[PGT] *Ting* Flames get blanked by the oil

[Toonage]

Tkachuk-Jankowski-Neal

Neal shows chemistry with Jankowski.
Jankowski has shown chemistry with Tkachuk
Neal is a sniper, Tkachuk is magic in front of the net.
Jankowski is good on the dot, gets the puck

Seems worth a shot

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Numbers just don't support that.

As I said I haven't liked the last few games (Two before Backlund went down and two since), but as a trio they've been good before that. Bennett has the second most five on five minutes with Tkachuk this season after Backlund, this isn't a two week thing.

Tkachuk has seen a 4.7% increase in scoring chance splits with Bennett compared to without.

Tkachuk has seen a 12% spike in high danger chance splits with Bennett compared to without.

Numbers suggest Tkachuk has played better with Bennett than any other forward not named Monahan, Gaudreau or Lindholm.

3 years later, still talking scoring chances.

WHAT ABOUT GOALS AND POINTS

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by kermitology

Why isn't Andersson on the second PP unit? He can get pucks on net and walk the line, plus he's a right shot.

I think it's worth a try, he seems to see the ice and handle the puck well. Not the fastest skater but doesn't need to be to QB the PP.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

3 years later, still talking scoring chances.

WHAT ABOUT GOALS AND POINTS

Pfft, who needs 'em?

[haiku]

cant decide whats worse
bingos math or flash freak out
haiku calls for aid

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Tkachuk-Jankowski-Neal

Neal shows chemistry with Jankowski.
Jankowski has shown chemistry with Tkachuk
Neal is a sniper, Tkachuk is magic in front of the net.
Jankowski is good on the dot, gets the puck

Seems worth a shot

When was this?

I'm not disagreeing with the concept, though I'm not sure if their breakout is going to terrify anyone.

[Toonage]

Last season, granted the end of the year and may not have been more than a few games

No speedsters on that line but if they take o-zone draws and possess, thats a good trio

[Kovaz]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

3 years later, still talking scoring chances.

WHAT ABOUT GOALS AND POINTS

If we're going to focus on goals over chances, you have to also give Bennett credit for massively improving the Tkachuk line's shutdown ability. Tkachuk away from Bennett has 3.07 GF/60 and 3.07 GA/60, while with Bennett he's at 2.22 GF/60 and 2.22 GA/60. With Backlund at C they're at 2.59 GF/60 and 1.56 GA/60. For comparison, Tkachuk-Backlund-Neal comes in with a horrific 1.21 GF/60 and 3.62 GA/60, and Tkachuk-Backlund-Czarnik is decent enough at 2.58 GF/60 and 2.58 GA/60.

So although Bennett does suppress Tkachuk's point totals, he's also been a big part of improving that line's defensive ability. If we're going to continue to use Tkachuk in a shutdown role with Backlund, looking strictly at point totals misses an important part of the picture.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Kovaz

If we're going to focus on goals over chances, you have to also give Bennett credit for massively improving the Tkachuk line's shutdown ability. Tkachuk away from Bennett has 3.07 GF/60 and 3.07 GA/60, while with Bennett he's at 2.22 GF/60 and 2.22 GA/60. With Backlund at C they're at 2.59 GF/60 and 1.56 GA/60. For comparison, Tkachuk-Backlund-Neal comes in with a horrific 1.21 GF/60 and 3.62 GA/60, and Tkachuk-Backlund-Czarnik is decent enough at 2.58 GF/60 and 2.58 GA/60.

So although Bennett does suppress Tkachuk's point totals, he's also been a big part of improving that line's defensive ability. If we're going to continue to use Tkachuk in a shutdown role with Backlund, looking strictly at point totals misses an important part of the picture.

I definitely agree Bennett helps with suppressing offense. In my tkachuk thread I pointeed out that the flames were middle of the pack in Goals Against prior to Bennett's promotion and since he's been there, the flames are 4th best in the league.

However, with Backlund out, I don't see that trend continuing, so tangible offense becomes that much more important and is where Bennett clearly struggles the most.

Tkachuk Backlund Bennett work as a line.

Tkachuk-Bennett don't work as a pairing.

IMO, of course.

[1Nite]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Koskinan hits his posts every time the opposing team enters the zone.

I think it to wake up the oiler players, after playing hitchcock hockey.

[Kovaz]

I also noticed they swapped Bennett to C on the Tkachuk-Bennett-Ryan line for the later part of the game. If we want to keep Mangiapane-Jankowski-Neal together (which I do), I'd be tempted to try Tkachuk-Bennett-Czarnik as a line. Between Bennett at C and Derek Ryan in the top 6, I think I prefer Bennett at C.

[Kovaz]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I definitely agree Bennett helps with suppressing offense. In my tkachuk thread I pointeed out that the flames were middle of the pack in Goals Against prior to Bennett's promotion and since he's been there, the flames are 4th best in the league.

However, with Backlund out, I don't see that trend continuing, so tangible offense becomes that much more important and is where Bennett clearly struggles the most.

Tkachuk Backlund Bennett work as a line.

Tkachuk-Bennett don't work as a pairing.

IMO, of course.

I think it's more Tkachuk-Ryan-Bennett doesn't work as a line more than Tkachuk-Bennett doesn't work as a pairing, but until we see another line tried it's hard to confirm which is the case. My opinion is that Tkachuk needs two linemates that can skate, which is why Tkachuk-Backlund-(Frolik/Czarnik/Bennett) have all worked reasonably well, but Tkachuk-Backlund-Neal and Tkachuk-Ryan-Bennett haven't worked.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Kovaz

I think it's more Tkachuk-Ryan-Bennett doesn't work as a line more than Tkachuk-Bennett doesn't work as a pairing, but until we see another line tried it's hard to confirm which is the case. My opinion is that Tkachuk needs two linemates that can skate, which is why Tkachuk-Backlund-(Frolik/Czarnik/Bennett) have all worked reasonably well, but Tkachuk-Backlund-Neal and Tkachuk-Ryan-Bennett haven't worked.

Ryan and Bennett both skate pretty well. At least as well as Backlund/Frolik.

[Funkhouser]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Koskinan hits his posts every time the opposing team enters the zone.

I wonder if there is actually any psychology behind this process? It annoyed all of us at home, imagine for the players on the ice.

Maybe it has some Pavlonian effect of getting into the players' heads and impacting their play!!!

Or maybe he's just an idiot. Either or.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Funkhouser

I wonder if there is actually any psychology behind this process? It annoyed all of us at home, imagine for the players on the ice.

Maybe it has some Pavlonian effect of getting into the players' heads and impacting their play!!!

Or maybe he's just an idiot. Either or.

considering his stats, he can be an idiot all he wants.
it's working for him.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by browna

JG honestly only forward regularly noticeable.
Some garbage penalty calls (Peluso and Prout, reputation calls) calls and a very dubious goal called back. The goalie didn’t even complain.

How does Seguin goal count but not this. Absolute joke

Flames weren’t great but if Peters would have taken Brodie off top pp and bs no goal Flames could have won this still. Oilers are still terrible

[CaptainCrunch]

It says a lot when the Flames are missing a number 2 shut down center, and a number 1 blueliner and had played a bunch of games in short order including one against an actual hockey team the night before, and the oilers barely scrapped by.


The Oilers are running on a coach bump, a softer schedule and some breaks.



The problem is when things start settling back to their norn, they don't have the bench strength to pull back out.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

considering his stats, he can be an idiot all he wants.
it's working for him.

It will be both hilarious and tragic to watch the Oilers run yet another promising-looking goalie into the ground.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Numbers are great and all that.

Watching them play together is a whole different conclusion.

No matter what the numbers suggest, it is unequivocally true that Sam has been abysmal offensively for a 2nd line guy. He gets put on that 2nd line and Tkachuk noticeably starts to tail off. Again, it might just be coincidence but that's doubtful at best.

Try someone else (Neal) with MT and see what happens. Send Sam to the 4th line and let him produce those numbers with others that maybe helps them.

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

3 years later, still talking scoring chances.

WHAT ABOUT GOALS AND POINTS

Production is production, and I certainly don't shy away from that.

I just don't see Bennett as hurting Tkachuk as some have pointed out.

At the end of the day you need a second line to do some scoring. I'd hope they analysis of a second line is deeper than just looking at goals scored in month time frame and look into scoring chances generated vs giving up.

But you need to produce ultimately.

The stats certainly don't support the notion that Bennett is neutering Tkachuk.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Production is production, and I certainly don't shy away from that.

I just don't see Bennett as hurting Tkachuk as some have pointed out.

At the end of the day you need a second line to do some scoring. I'd hope they analysis of a second line is deeper than just looking at goals scored in month time frame and look into scoring chances generated vs giving up.

But you need to produce ultimately.

The stats certainly don't support the notion that Bennett is neutering Tkachuk.

They can certainly be an effective line without putting up gaudy point totals and I wouldn't go as far as to say Bennett is neutering Tkachuk at all. The problem is that he's unable to capitalize on anything and is seemingly a non-factor in his ability to locate Tkachuk in open ice and help create more chances. Without Backlund it seems like it's just Tkachuk out there by himself in the offensive zone right now.

Your 6th best forward certainly needs to offer more to the group than the occasional point in the long run and I'm not sure what the answer is outside of potentially trying to get Neal going in that spot.