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Old 10-11-2018, 03:56 PM   #1441
Dan403
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Someone said they think all Bennett is worth is a 3rd round pick.

Any other thoughts? What IS his value?

I think you get a late 1st for him.
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Old 10-11-2018, 03:57 PM   #1442
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Originally Posted by SuperMatt18 View Post
Chris Bourque had 8 points in 51 NHL games in his career.

Bennett has never ever played an AHL game, let alone be a career AHL guy.

The two aren't even remotely comparable.
So you're saying Bennett wouldn't produce in the AHL than? Oh come on, he'd be one heck of an AHL player.

Bourque = NHL PPG .15
Bennett = NHL PPG .36

That's pretty comparable, more than enough to have to elaborate with "remotely".

Tell me I'm wrong when he's lighting it up in the AHL.


Hopefully Bennett can put up a few points soon to bring that value up a bit for Calgary's sake. It'll give BT some leverage on getting a better return.
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Old 10-11-2018, 04:00 PM   #1443
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Bennett was playing pretty tall when they had Jagr on the other side. That was around that time.

Consistent with the mental boost Bingo thinks he needs
That is true, Jagr was one of the better linemates Jankowski and Bennett had. If only he could stay healthy, they probably would’ve been effective the whole season.

The thing is, Bennett has shown some flashes of being something better than a forgettable bottom 6 player. He has very raw skills and that need refining. One day he could be a 20 goal, pitbull of a player which is why management probably hasn’t traded him yet. But other times he’ll take a ton of bad penalties, look invisible and everyone is left disappointed.

At some point I hope he can shake off the 4th overall tag because I think it weighs on him a lot. If he can play a disciplined game along with an honest effort every night, he can be a very effective player that a lot of teams will want. But I worry that the pride of being such a high pick will be the reason he wants out to start fresh somewhere else.
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Old 10-11-2018, 04:14 PM   #1444
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Originally Posted by Dan403 View Post
Someone said they think all Bennett is worth is a 3rd round pick.

Any other thoughts? What IS his value?

I think you get a late 1st for him.
I bet the offers coming in are a 2nd.
At the deadline maybe you get a late 1st.
Again I think the better route is he's part of a deal to fill a need.
Actually better would be the kid figures it out.
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Old 10-11-2018, 04:24 PM   #1445
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I bet the offers coming in are a 2nd.
At the deadline maybe you get a late 1st.
Again I think the better route is he's part of a deal to fill a need.
Actually better would be the kid figures it out.
He’s 22, a solid NHLer with still a lot of upside.

A second rounder doesn’t even have a high probability of becoming a NHLer

Isn’t a second rounder what you trade for guys like Lazar? Or depth vets at the trade deadline, when you are out of it?

As you say, if he is part of a package for a material roster player where the Flames get the best player in the deal, I get that.
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Old 10-11-2018, 04:30 PM   #1446
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Let's look at Year 2 for Sam Bennett, and who he played with (from frozenpool):

20.8 bennett,sam - brouwer,troy - versteeg,kris
13.5 bennett,sam - chiasson,alex - gaudreau,johnny
11.3 bennett,sam - chiasson,alex - versteeg,kris
6.8 bennett,sam - chiasson,alex - stajan,matthew
5.4 bennett,sam - brouwer,troy - monahan,sean
5.3 bennett,sam - ferland,micheal -versteeg,kris
4.2 bennett,sam - bouma,lance - chiasson,alex
3.8 bennett,sam - brouwer,troy - tkachuk,matthew
2.8 bennett,sam - brouwer,troy - gaudreau,johnny
2.7 backlund,mikael - bennett,sam - frolik,michael

Red = players so bad at 5v5 that they hurt almost everyone they played with, or played their way out of the league.

Purple = player was productive on the PP, not a good 5v5 player, and they were on their way out of the league

Bold = good players

Green = look he played on a full line!

Brouwer, Chiasson and Versteeg were bad enough that they couldn't be carried to success by Monahan and Gaudreau, yet it was on Bennett to produce with those three 5v5 clowns. Hell, Brouwer was so bad he couldn't even produce with Monahan and Gaudreau while playing 5v4!

There's a difference between trying to hold a player accountable, and willfully ignoring circumstances as if they don't matter when they truly actually do.
This is assuming the only means of assessing his play is point production. But it's not. Ferland didn't produce much away from the top line, but his play still got him promoted to the top line where he was able to produce. The opposite seemed to have happened with Bennett.

Even this season, started on the fourth line. Had an opportunity on the third line, had a good game despite not making the scoresheet. Gets to play again on the third line with a better player in Neal. If he has another good game, he'll stay on the third line and when he strings a couple together and an opportunity presents itself, he may even see some top six minutes. But if he sucks, he'll be pushed to the fourth line where people will argue that's why he's not producing.

Again, Flames management had every incentive to want Bennett to flourish. There's no ulterior motive at this point of trying to ruin his NHL career. He played where they thought he should have played. It was up to him to prove them wrong and he had, up until now, failed to do so.
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Old 10-11-2018, 04:37 PM   #1447
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Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina View Post
Taylor Hall was a front line player in Edmonton who became a better front line player in NJ
Sam simply hasn’t produced. I’m surprised at the sentiment that anyone other than Sam is largely accountable for that
He has been a part of one of the shallowest forward groups, until this year, and still couldn’t muscle his way up the line up
That’s on him
Who knows how it would have gone, but if BT could go back in time, i bet he would send Sam to minors when he had the chance.
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Old 10-11-2018, 04:41 PM   #1448
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Or go back even further and draft Ehlers or Nylander
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Old 10-11-2018, 05:06 PM   #1449
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The time to trade Bennett is now. It's at the point now where if he regresses anymore than his value falls to unrecoverable levels and he'd end up being waived.

As a straight up trade I imagine he'd fetch an early 3rd round pick. Package him for an early 2nd +.

Bennett's a Chris Bourque type guy. Exceptional AHL player but can't produce at the NHL level.

Chris Bourque stats: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=78707
Why? I cannot understand this line of thinking... I'd rather see Bennett's potential play out on this team than trade him for a 3rd round pick. Jesus Christ, a 3rd round pick is more often than not, absolutely nothing of value. We don't need a 3rd round pick that likely won't ever play, or if they do it won't be for 2+ years. Right now, Bennett is very solid depth, which is clearly important. And you would trade him why? Because he's a 4th overall pick that isn't blowing the roof off? Who cares, he's a good player who is better than 99% of 3rd round picks... not to mention the fact that he's playing very well at the moment, Peters bumped him up the lineup... but yeah trade him now, for a very low odds lottery ticket.
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Old 10-11-2018, 05:19 PM   #1450
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Or go back even further and draft Ehlers or Nylander
I guarantee Bennett never misses a game due to a contract dispute. The guy has the right character, that’s for sure.
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Old 10-11-2018, 05:32 PM   #1451
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The point is valid, but for me the key is how they score goals. Neal is a sniper. Brouwer was never that. What Neal doesn't have is other attributes that allows him to product beyond that 40-50 point total. But in terms of a guy who can find the back of the net, when given a good look, I do believe he is that. But he needs help driving the offense. He doesn't drive it himself.
I think your last point is very on point which is why I'm concerned about Neal on the third line. I would prefer him on line 2 as he'd have Backlund instead of Dube and Tkachuk instead of Bennett. I know Peters said today that he has Tkachuk and Neal on different lines because they bring the same offensive game and physical style bu I worry Neal's production will suffer if left on the third line, unless Dube really surprises.
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Old 10-11-2018, 05:36 PM   #1452
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I guarantee Bennett never misses a game due to a contract dispute. The guy has the right character, that’s for sure.
Iginla missed games on a contract holdout.
Not sure doing so speaks to character...
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Old 10-11-2018, 05:39 PM   #1453
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Iginla missed games on a contract holdout.
Not sure doing so speaks to character...
Fair enough. Still think it’s bullsht and I’d fire my agent immediately if it got to that point.
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Old 10-11-2018, 05:44 PM   #1454
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Bennett will be a monster in the playoffs. I'll give him a playoff run before I want to trade
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Old 10-11-2018, 06:00 PM   #1455
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I guarantee Bennett never misses a game due to a contract dispute. The guy has the right character, that’s for sure.
Well yeah, because at this point he should be happy that he's getting a contract at all. Not much to negotiate when you have no bargaining chips.
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Old 10-11-2018, 06:05 PM   #1456
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Well yeah, because at this point he should be happy that he's getting a contract at all. Not much to negotiate when you have no bargaining chips.
Deluxe trolling
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Old 10-11-2018, 06:10 PM   #1457
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It's true, what was he going to do if he wanted more money? Sit out? He played 5 minutes the first game, they wouldn't have cared and he would have been left out until he caved.

Now who knows how he would act if he felt he was an 8M guy being offered 6M.
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Old 10-11-2018, 06:15 PM   #1458
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And anyone who thinks that a player shouldn't be fighting for what they are worth will probably not like the Tkachuk negotiations given his dad. Keith always fought for every penny. He saw it as it was, a business owned by billionaires. They can afford to pay their players what they are worth.

Sometimes there's a disagreement between what a player is worth by both sides, despite best efforts. It happens, it's really not a character flaw in my opinion.
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Old 10-11-2018, 06:22 PM   #1459
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Beauty assist for Bennett to Neal.
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Old 10-11-2018, 07:47 PM   #1460
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And anyone who thinks that a player shouldn't be fighting for what they are worth will probably not like the Tkachuk negotiations given his dad. Keith always fought for every penny. He saw it as it was, a business owned by billionaires. They can afford to pay their players what they are worth.

Sometimes there's a disagreement between what a player is worth by both sides, despite best efforts. It happens, it's really not a character flaw in my opinion.
That’s fine, but there is no reason to not have that figured out before training camp.
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