[Game Takes] Canucks 5 Flames 2

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Here's my biggest concern with Peters system ...

He plays a tight gap game with everyone playing "up". That works great if your players are a) fast and b) fast mentally because you put so much pressure on the opposition that you are relentless and suffocating.

As a result you'll get the majority of shot attempts, shot and scoring chances ... GOOD

But also as a result is a team that could be flat footed when a mistake happens and you turn the puck over. That happens enough and you're down because you've given up two or three grade A chances and the other team has managed to score. Suddenly you're chasing the game and score effects once again drive your shot attempts way up.

Hope I'm wrong.

Me too. Theoretically this team has enough players who can skate out of trouble when they do turn the puck over. I was surprised watching last night by how slow the team looked overall, because a big increase in team speed was also something that I saw in the pre-season that looked like the biggest difference from last year. Hopefully opening night jitters, adjustments and whatever the hell happened on the god-awful powerplay are things that the players have gotten out of their systems. They can skate better than they showed through the first 35 mins last night.

[---Hatrick---]

Maybe they need to ban Fortnite on the road

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by ---Hatrick---

Maybe they need to ban Fortnite on the road

Considering that the Flames were one of the best road teams in the League last year I am sceptical that is a problem.

[EVERLAST]

Weve seen that this team had the ability to play Peter's system. Last night was a weird speed bump.

I'm willing to be patient and see as a result.

We still need to see screens in front and players willingness to go to the tough areas though.

That was very evident last night . Just zero heart from this team and only a.few guys showed up last night for some reason.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Red Slinger

Random thoughts:

It seemed like the Flames were having issues generating high quality scoring chances. I don't know if the stats back up the eye test on that or not. It also seemed like the Canucks weren't really concerned about point shots and were mostly blocking shooting and passing lanes, both 5 on 5 and the PP. I wonder if the Flames had a real threat from the point if the middle of the ice would open up at all. It could have made a difference on the PP at least.

The team seemed tentative and discombobulated in general. Especially, in the first period the puck support was pretty bad and looked like nobody was on the same page. There were a few good individual performances but they didn't seem to play together. I suppose that can be expected but, for the 7th year running, I would have hoped that's what they used the preseason for.

I was really disappointed in some of the vets who are supposed to be difference makers, especially early on. Gaudreau and Neal were largely invisible for 2 periods. I can give Neal a pass since it's his first game with the new team and he's not really the straw that stirs the drink. But Gaudreau has no excuse. He needs to be better and more consistent for this team to have a real shot at being contenders.

It looked like Frolik's woes from last season continued into this game. Hopefully he can get out of his funk. If not, they need to move him down the lineup permanently and make room for someone like Bennett, Czarnik or even Dube.

While he didn't have a great game I really liked what I saw from Hanifin. He has the makings of a great all-around defenseman. He had physical play, great skating, great defending, good puck-handling, nice outlet passes, controlled the play and was involved. He had some mistakes but when he irons out the wrinkles in his game I think we will be looking back and saying "Dougie who?"

In one of the preview shows (TSN I think) they talked about how the NHL is getting faster. However, they also pointed out that the biggest team in the league won the Cup last year. There were also other big, fast teams like Winnipeg and Nashville that are in the elite of the league. After the hit on Dube and the beat-down of Hamonic it sure showed that this team isn't physically intimidating to anyone, even a very young Vancouver team. It's good to have a fast, skilled team but it's even better to have a fast, skilled, big, tough team. Even against a relatively small team like the Canucks the Flames couldn't really answer. This could be a problem against some teams. Even one big guy in the lineup that can play a regular shift could make a big difference.

How Peters handled the 3M line was puzzling. We missed the playoffs last year, why are we going back to old formulas? I know lots of debate on what we call our 4 lines, but how on earth does Frolik play with Backlund and Tkachuk, and Neal is with Ryan and Dube? Believe we've seen the best of Frolik and I don't know where he fits on the team anymore. I think you have to move him out of the lineup period as he doesn't really bring the energy you are looking for in that role. I don't see him fitting in on the RW with Lindholm/Neal/Czarnik above him. Bring in Hathaway/Lazar to bring that energy.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I'll be more straight forward in my comments so as more people can get the point rather than discovering it for themselves:


Fancy stats are for losing teams. Good possession stats mean that you are chasing the game and are likely to lose.

-------------

Jankowski was one of the positive highlights from last year. He has done nothing to deserve being demoted to 4th line centre.

Yes the Flames have got a lot of new players that they need to highlight but they should have to actually outplay Jankowski to take away his well earned ice-time.


The Flames were being outworked and their 2 hardest working forwards got minimal minutes.

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

How Peters handled the 3M line was puzzling. We missed the playoffs last year, why are we going back to old formulas? I know lots of debate on what we call our 4 lines, but how on earth does Frolik play with Backlund and Tkachuk, and Neal is with Ryan and Dube? Believe we've seen the best of Frolik and I don't know where he fits on the team anymore. I think you have to move him out of the lineup period as he doesn't really bring the energy you are looking for in that role. I don't see him fitting in on the RW with Lindholm/Neal/Czarnik above him. Bring in Hathaway/Lazar to bring that energy.

He was certainly the worst of a poor forward group last night. I'd rather see Lazar in the lineup, for the exact reason you've stated here.

I'm now realizing I have nothing new to add, I agree with your take.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I'll be more straight forward in my comments so as more people can get the point rather than discovering it for themselves:

Gee, thanks for the assistance


Fancy stats are for losing teams. Good possession stats mean that you are chasing the game and are likely to lose.

Which is why only bad teams have good possession stats

-------------

Jankowski was one of the positive highlights from last year. He has done nothing to deserve being demoted to 4th line centre.

Yes the Flames have got a lot of new players that they need to highlight but they should have to actually outplay Jankowski to take away his well earned ice-time.

Jankowski is not a better C than either Monahan or Backlund and wasn't last year, so at best he's third line. Basically you are complaining that he wasn't in Ryan's spot. Ryan has better career stats. It's not a demotion for Jankowski, it's slotting C's where their stats indicate.

Also, Jankowski might just be, as a C, behind Lindholm and maybe even Dube, if they are given a chance to play it.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I'll be more straight forward in my comments so as more people can get the point rather than discovering it for themselves:


Fancy stats are for losing teams. Good possession stats mean that you are chasing the game and are likely to lose.

-------------

Jankowski was one of the positive highlights from last year. He has done nothing to deserve being demoted to 4th line centre.

Yes the Flames have got a lot of new players that they need to highlight but they should have to actually outplay Jankowski to take away his well earned ice-time.


The Flames were being outworked and their 2 hardest working forwards got minimal minutes.

Out playing the opposition is never for losing teams. That's just silly.

There are score effects and that certainly played a role last night, but the last time you brought this up I showed you that the Flames were one of the top 6-7 (from memory sorry) least impacted teams by score effects in the NHL last season.

I can certainly understand the idea that you can't just lose every game and point to underlying numbers as a silver lining. It's a results league. But winning takes playing well, and counting stats that suggest your team is playing well but not winning is part of the information any informed hockey coach or executive would want at their disposal.

And they're not fancy. They are a count of shot attempts and scoring chances. someone needs to seriously demystify this.

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

How Peters handled the 3M line was puzzling. We missed the playoffs last year, why are we going back to old formulas? I know lots of debate on what we call our 4 lines, but how on earth does Frolik play with Backlund and Tkachuk, and Neal is with Ryan and Dube? Believe we've seen the best of Frolik and I don't know where he fits on the team anymore. I think you have to move him out of the lineup period as he doesn't really bring the energy you are looking for in that role. I don't see him fitting in on the RW with Lindholm/Neal/Czarnik above him. Bring in Hathaway/Lazar to bring that energy.

Pretty sure Frolik played more with Bennett/Jankowski last night than he did with Backlund/Tkachuk.

[Oil Stain]

Here's a visualization of the shots per period. The game tide.

Shows things closer in the first. Calgary ran the show in the third.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Bingo

There are score effects and that certainly played a role last night, but the last time you brought this up I showed you that the Flames were one of the top 6-7 (from memory sorry) least impacted teams by score effects in the NHL last season.

You showed everyone else on the board. I seriously question whether anyone has ever been able to show Ricardo anything. He isn't looking.

They are a count of shot attempts and scoring chances. someone needs to seriously demystify this.

To some people, ‘fancy stats’ means anything that you can't count without taking off your shoes.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Considering that the Flames were one of the best road teams in the League last year I am sceptical that is a problem.

Maybe they need to ban Fortnite at home.

[edn88]

One game does not a season make.

Lots of reasons why we lost to a supposedly inferior Vancouver team. Let's see where they are after game 5 before losing our collective $#!+

[Oil Stain]

This chart is really cool.

Has a tonne of info.

[Oil Stain]

When the Flames were rolling in the third their lines were:

Gaudreau-Monahan-Neal
Tkachuk-Backlund-Czarnik
Dube-Ryan-Lindholm
Bennett-Jankowski-Frolik

Will be interesting to see if they keep any of these lines together going forward.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Oil Stain

When the Flames were rolling in the third their lines were:

Gaudreau-Monahan-Neal
Tkachuk-Backlund-Czarnik
Dube-Ryan-Lindholm
Bennett-Jankowski-Frolik

Will be interesting to see if they keep any of these lines together going forward.

This is a lot like I was hoping to see off the hop

That first line listed is why Neal was brought in
The second line is what had chemistry in the pre season
Lindholm was contemplated on the top line with Monahan to take some draws, and he had an abysmal night in the faceoff circle
Bennett and Jankowski should play with someone who is not dead weight. If you put Lindholm on their line you would have 3 really strong lines, but that would also involve Peters putting his beloved Ryan on the 4th.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Buff

Maybe they need to ban Fortnite at home.

If that was an option I think it might have merit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dammage79]

Game 1 was a clunky game full of old bad habits. We didn't see nearly anything that resembled the pace and puck movement that was so prominent in the pre season. And the old PP reared its filthy ugly head. No movement, no pace and the Canucks whether it was the way they played or the Flames lack of another gear read far too many passes both in 5 on 5 and on the pp. Passing was horrid last night.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Considering that the Flames were one of the best road teams in the League last year I am sceptical that is a problem.

I know this is all joking, but was Fortnite a thing during last season, or was it not until summer?