[News] Flames cut 17 players. 33 players left UPD: 4 more PTOS released. 29 players left

[gamesaver]

Originally Posted by Mike F

Don't disagree about Dansk vs. Gilles and Rittich. But IMO, one of the latter two has to make a strong showing in the remaining preseason games. If not, the Flames need to get a credible 2nd goalie to play with Smith. They can't afford to throw away any points in what will be a tight Pacific Division.

As has been pointed out, Toronto will have to choose between McElhinney and Sparks. Picking up McBackup would be a big upgrade for Calgary - in 3 of his last 4 seasons he's put up .934, .917, and .914 sv%s, playing an average of 23 games in those seasons.

The last time the Flames had a backup who had a >/=.914 sv% playing more than 10 games. . . . Roman Turek in 2003/04!

When I was playing in goal, I hated friendly games, because my team was never really trying hard in our own zone and in front of me. Nobody wanted to get injured, especially if the real season was about to start in week or two. Forwards where not blocking shots. Defensemen were not covering bodies or making space so I could see the shot. Lazy skating, risky passes, odd man rushes. Its simply different. And its really hard to go out there and give 100% effort if noone in front of you is willing to do the same in terms of playing defence. You let in 2 or 3 which were really hard to stop and you get pissed even more. It can get really frustrating and you can see many goalies struggling throught the league at this point. What was the score of DET vs CHI match last night? 8-6? Classic preseason game. Howard let in 6. Do you think wings fans are calling for his head because of it?

[tsquared1967]

Gaudreau
Monahan
Neal
Tkachuk
Backlund
Czarnik
Bennett
Ryan
Lindholm
Mangiapane
Jankowski
Frolik
Lazar
Peluso

Giordano
Brodie
Hanifin
Hamonic
Prout
Stone
Andersson

Smith
Rittich

This is my roster. Hathaway isn't good enough to crack the lineup and Peluso is muscle when called upon.

Prout is my replacement for Engelland that provides toughness on the back end that this team desperately need. Kulak doesn't make the cut.

Rittich vs. Gillies.... flip a coin.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Mike F

Don't disagree about Dansk vs. Gilles and Rittich. But IMO, one of the latter two has to make a strong showing in the remaining preseason games. If not, the Flames need to get a credible 2nd goalie to play with Smith. They can't afford to throw away any points in what will be a tight Pacific Division...

No, they really don't. As I pointed out earlier in this thread, Rittich played one pre-season game in 2017 and posted a 0.778 SP. The next time he played in the NHL he rattled off six wins and two OT points in ten games with a very tidy +0.920 SP. The results in pre-season games are honestly virtually meaningless. It is a fraction of what the coaches and management see in the course of training camp.

I agree with Strange Brew that Treliving is most definitely combing the market for an upgrade in net, but I am also equally convinced that barring the sudden availability of a high-end starting goalie the Flames WILL enter the season with one of Rittich or Gillies on the roster. A pedestrian performance in an inconsequential pre-season game is not going to result in a panic move for a career backup goalie. It just isn't. And more to the point, the team's path to success does not hinge on one of Gillies or Rittich turning in a succession of ten bell saves in a single pre-season warm-up against SJ or Edmonton.

[Bourque's Twin]

I’ve seen enough of Lazar, Hathaway and Kulak. I don’t think they have any upside and I don’t think they contribute much as it is. I’d rather they get replaced by players who either have more of an impact today or who have more upside.

I think Andersson or Valimaki should take Kulak’s spot, with Prout as #7.

I think Dube or Mangiapane should play on the 4th line and Peluso should take the #13 spot. Peluso and Prout are perfect candidates to sit in the press box and dress when needed.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Neal
Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Bennett - Jankowski - Frolik
Dube - Ryan - Czarnik
X Peluso

Giordano - Brodie
Hanifin - Hamonic
Valimaki/Andersson - Stone
X Prout

[GullFoss]

if it was me, id try to trade Stone and Lazar to senators and hope they bite.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

Gaudreau - Monahan - Neal
Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Bennett - Jankowski - Frolik
Dube - Ryan - Czarnik
X Peluso

Giordano - Brodie
Hanifin - Hamonic
Valimaki/Andersson - Stone
X Prout

I have seen about 15 different roster projections in the past week and I have to say they all get me pretty excited. It doesn't seem to matter where anyone plugs players, the lineups all look amazing. It's a roster that really appears like it can make some noise.

Get on with the season, already!

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

I’ve seen enough of Lazar, Hathaway and Kulak. I don’t think they have any upside and I don’t think they contribute much as it is. I’d rather they get replaced by players who either have more of an impact today or who have more upside.

I think Andersson or Valimaki should take Kulak’s spot, with Prout as #7.

I think Dube or Mangiapane should play on the 4th line and Peluso should take the #13 spot. Peluso and Prout are perfect candidates to sit in the press box and dress when needed.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Neal
Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Bennett - Jankowski - Frolik
Dube - Ryan - Czarnik
X Peluso

Giordano - Brodie
Hanifin - Hamonic
Valimaki/Andersson - Stone
X Prout

I think Kulak has upside. He's played better each year (and I wasn't a big supporter at all at first). Lazar might yet. He has had terrible linemates (I love Stajan but Lazar definitely got the worst version) who couldn't keep up. Even so he got chances. This camp has not been a good one, but he's got way more tools than Hathaway, Peluso or the like. Including the fact he can play C in a pinch.

[Stay Golden]

Agree with others assessment on Kulak. Either Valimaki or Andersson are a smarter choice than Kulak.

Same as Lazar Hathaway they could easily be replaced by Dube, Czarnik, If Peters is willing to take the leap for quick crafty depth instead of 1D pluggers.

[Monahan For Mayor]

Gaudreau - Monahan - Neal
Tkachuk - Backlund - Czarnik
Dube - Lindholm - Ryan
Mangipane - Jankowski - Frolik
Bennett> Takes Dube/Mang spot as soon as they look out of place in NHL games

Gio - Brodie
Hanifin - Hamonic
Kulak - Stone
Anderson

I personally think both Valimaki and Anderson have got caught flat footed too many times in pre season games. Regular NHL rosters mite be a real issue if these guys can't fix that.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

if it was me, id try to trade Stone and Lazar to senators and hope they bite.

No chance they would want Lazar back

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Klimchuk is a smart two-way hockey player who finished second on the AHL team in scoring last season while being a former first-round pick. He played well in the preseason and came up big in critical moments at times.

Draft pedigree doesn't mean anything this many years out. Weren't you just saying this to those criticizing Bennett for where he's at?

[CalgaryFan1988]

I don't get the logic of some fans wanting to trade Stone.

Defenceman get injured all the time, the young guys will get their shot this season. Why trade away our depth, when we don't have any cap issues?

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I don't get the logic of some fans wanting to trade Stone.

Defenceman get injured all the time, the young guys will get their shot this season. Why trade away our depth, when we don't have any cap issues?

- Because between Brodie, Hamonic, Andersson, Prout we are already four deep at RD, along with Kulak who has quite a bit of experience at RD. Any more depth could easily be acquired on the waiver wire and probably outperform Stone, who simply doesn't do many things especially well either defensively or offensively. He is still living off the numbers he put up in Arizona when OEL was setting him up with power play one-timers. Last year he was highly dependant on his partner to control the play, while contributing little more than holding penalties when the play was inevitably forced to his side of the ice. The gap between Kulak and Stone was not small at ES, with Stone relying on reputation and penalty killing to keep himself afloat. If you just need a throwaway #6D who can kill penalties, Prout can do that at a more appropriate cost and without two years of term.

I've seen people say that Stone has "proven" he can step into a top 4 role and not look out of place but this is false. All he really proved was that he has a great slap shot and had perfect timing in terms of being traded right before a Brian Elliott hot streak (as did Matt Bartkowski). If Stone is in our top four for any extended period, the results will probably never work out so nicely again.

Andersson is already quite a bit better better as a RD than either Stone or Prout, and Kulak/Valimaki/Kylington are all better as left D. That means you're either sacrificing the best possible top 6D, or you have Stone sitting in the pressbox... and if Stone is a pressbox regular this season, he becomes an untradeable anchor contract that you have to buy out in July. There's actually no proof teams haven't already caught on to Stone's poor value - he might already be untradeable and it's possible CGY was the only team that overvalued him a while back.

Of course you don't want to throw Andersson into the top 4 fire unless necessary - but trading Stone would still leave Rasmus as your #3RD behind Brodie and Hamonic. If there's an injury, we'll also be able to evaluate Andersson in a top 4 role - this isn't a problem. Either he sinks, as Stone has and would, or he swims, in which case you can keep him there and slot a guy like Hamonic even lower in the lineup and that is how championships are built

Overall, by trading Stone you minimize risk, improve your current roster, and still have perfectly sufficient depth.

Is he a terrible player? At 1.25 to 1.5M AAV, maybe not the worst #7D to stuff in your press box, who can look competent in a bottom pair role. But his salary is not irrelevant because you can't put 7 mill in the pressbox.

Trading Stone is not irresponsible, it is prudent, especially if Andersson has shown to be more effective, which he did even dating back to the NHL games he played last season. You can't afford to start healthy scratching 3.5M x 2Y and you're wasting Andersson by pairing him with Stone instead of Kulak. Forcing Stone into the top six for the sake of it, despite not meriting it - that is irresponsible

[devo22]

I think you keep Stone and Kulak for one more year. Ideally, both Kylington and Valimaki knock down the door next summer and make them expendable. But right now, having them for the bottom-pairing is smart. Injuries do happen and Stone has proven that he can handle 2nd pairing minutes. Kulak will probably never be more than a 16-17 minutes guy, but he's solid at what he does. Can easily push him down to 7th, too.

Also, "too many RDs" is a great problem to have in this league.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Draft pedigree doesn't mean anything this many years out. Weren't you just saying this to those criticizing Bennett for where he's at?

Ouch, you're right. I slipped that in there totally without thinking. Thanks for calling me out on that

[PsYcNeT]

I don't think Valimaki and Andersson are interchangeable. Valimaki still needs another year to season.

[Wolfman]

I don't see the downside in Valimaki spending the year in Stockton and dominating. Let him start pro in the AHL and learn what it takes to be a pro.

[bubbsy]

Agreed, Andersson has been the best dman kid so far in camp. I thinks kylington was right there with Valimaki, in fact, i thought he looked a step ahead of him.

Gio/Brodie
Hanifin/hamonic
Andersson/stone
Kulak/prout

It's the 7th dman spot I think is up for grabs. Kulak has looked meh this camp and prout brings an element i think the team wants in the lineup,though kulak>prout.

12th forward, 7th dman, backup goalie are the question marks remaining in my mind, none of which are that big a deal. I am actually looking to see guys like neal, lindholm, ryan, Bennett, Jankowski, Brodie, hamonic, stone, smith solidify their game in these final days of camp. That's far more crucial.

[Wolfman]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

Agreed, Andersson has been the best dman kid so far in camp. I thinks kylington was right there with Valimaki, in fact, i thought he looked a step ahead of him.

Gio/Brodie
Hanifin/hamonic
Andersson/stone
Kulak/prout

It's the 7th dman spot I think is up for grabs. Kulak has looked meh this camp and prout brings an element i think the team wants in the lineup,though kulak>prout.

12th forward, 7th dman, backup goalie are the question marks remaining in my mind, none of which are that big a deal. I am actually looking to see guys like neal, lindholm, ryan, Bennett, Jankowski, Brodie, hamonic, stone, smith solidify their game in these final days of camp. That's far more crucial.

Agree with most of your comment. The backup goalie to me is the biggest area that they have to get right. Whether that's one of the two or getting a goalie not in the organization to fill that role. I'm tired of having a question mark as a backup.

[Strange Brew]

If the Flames do end up keeping an enforcer type on the roster, at least be glad he’s not signed to a multi year deal or that we gave up draft picks for him. We have seen those movies before.