Brad "Frickin" Treliving

[sempuki]

Originally Posted by J pold

This 100%. This fan base, CP in particular seems to only judge Treliving on transactions, divestment, and how everything looks on paper. The reality is the the team has under performed consistently since he took over as GM. I'm hopeful for this season and think he has done a great job all things considered but if it's another underwhelming season all of that won't matter and I suspect he will be let go.

The GM is in fact the only person in the organization that *has* to play the game on paper. How is he going to coach the team or score goals from the press box??

If coaching and goaltending continues to be a problem, then he has to take responsibility, but one thing he shouldn't be doing is stop making paper transactions to put the team in a better position to succeed on the ice.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by sempuki

The GM is in fact the only person in the organization that *has* to play the game on paper. How is he going to coach the team or score goals from the press box??

If coaching and goaltending continues to be a problem, then he has to take responsibility, but one thing he shouldn't be doing is stop making paper transactions to put the team in a better position to succeed on the ice.

I agree about coaching, but otherwise I don't think Treliving could realistically be expected to have improved the entire roster much more than he has managed in the past four years. Had he made a stronger push for an upgrade in goal it would almost certainly have come at the expense of the several upgrades he has made to the forward group and the blueline.

Fans have the luxury of seeing the game in fragments, to see the holes, and to unrealistically expect global improvements. But the General Manager has finite resources and must make decisions with a MUCH longer view to success. Treeliving's plan encompasses several years, and he is chipping away at seeing it through. He has provided some short-term relief in Smith, but but I don't think he can be faulted for making the decisions he has to date, and for his patience in seeing through the resolution of this final piece.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I agree about coaching, but otherwise I don't think Treliving could realistically be expected to have improved the entire roster much more than he has managed in the past four years. Had he made a stronger push for an upgrade in goal it would almost certainly have come at the expense of the several upgrades he has made to the forward group and the he blueline.

Fans have the luxury of seeing the game in fragments, to see the holes, and to unrealistically expect global improvements. But the General Manager has finite resources and must make decisions with a MUCH longer view to success. Treeliving's plan encompasses several years, and he is chipping away at seeing it through. He has provided some short-term relief in Smith, but but I don't think he can be faulted for making the decisions he has to date, and for his patience in seeing through the resolution of this final piece.

And keep in mind he's been involved in Bishop to Calgary twice, MAF once, Raanta as well. This isn't a guy that hasn't been knee deep on big goalie upgrades but has then balked.

Given his history of swinging deals you'd have to think the prices were in his mind too high.

[calgarywinning]

Originally Posted by Bingo

And keep in mind he's been involved in Bishop to Calgary twice, MAF once, Raanta as well. This isn't a guy that hasn't been knee deep on big goalie upgrades but has then balked.

Given his history of swinging deals you'd have to think the prices were in his mind too high.

If he were successful in swinging a goaltender for the last season, do we really think the outcome would have been that different?

Gio had a stellar year, but the defence was lauded as one of the best in the NHL, but on too many nights I saw way too many gaps, way too many opportunities for opposing teams.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by calgarywinning

If he were successful in swinging a goaltender for the last season, do we really think the outcome would have been that different?...

Well, yeah, that is kind of the point. This was always going to be a five- or six-year project, regardless of which holes Treliving prioritized.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by J pold

This 100%. This fan base, CP in particular seems to only judge Treliving on transactions, divestment, and how everything looks on paper. The reality is the the team has under performed consistently since he took over as GM. I'm hopeful for this season and think he has done a great job all things considered but if it's another underwhelming season all of that won't matter and I suspect he will be let go.

This is completely false. Last season was the only season under BT where the team arguably under achieved. Every other season they either over achieved or were right on par. And you could argue the only reason last year was a failure was because the rebuild has accelerated under his watch.

All that said, the results do have start showing on the ice starting this season. He’s locked up his core and although they likely haven’t peaked, they are starting to enter their primes.

[browna]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I personally have no complaints about Rittich's 2017–18 season, and am perfectly comfortable with him moving forward. He was a rookie last year, and it is little surprise that he struggled with a rather sudden increase of immediate expectations. He has been through it now, and I see no reason why he won't be in a better headspace this time around if he is suddenly needed to fill in as the starter. Prior to Smith's injury Rittich was fantastic: he looked consistently prepared, focused, and played a simple game with very few mistakes. He struggled to adjust, but that is to be expected for a goalie playing his first NHL season, and with only three months of on-the-job experience.

Hopefully you’re right and he has a bit more confidence. My point was that I don’t think Treliving will give the backup role as much rope of whoever is backup if they don’t look confident. Flames just haven’t had a good track record of having reliably confident backups, from Ramo Hiller, all the way back to Karlssson.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Bingo

And keep in mind he's been involved in Bishop to Calgary twice, MAF once, Raanta as well. This isn't a guy that hasn't been knee deep on big goalie upgrades but has then balked.

Given his history of swinging deals you'd have to think the prices were in his mind too high.

Treliving also traded away a bunch of 1st and 2nds in other deals, which left him short of ammunition to address goaltending. Grubauer, for instance, was moved for a 2nd this off-season - a 2nd Treliving didn't have.

Overall, I'm positive about Treliving's tenure as GM, and I think he improved the roster over the summer. But he has resorted to deficit spending, and you only have so many high draft picks to use to plug holes. It remains to be seen if a #4 d-man on a good contract was worth spending a bunch of assets that could have been used in other deals.

[Mr.Coffee]

I don't think Treliving has done much with player transactions to question what he's doing. He's a shrewd negotiator when it comes to RFA's, his trades are alright usually, his UFA signings leave a little to be desired but really overall not too bad all things considered. At the end of every season, he's usually filling the holes everybody else sees and believes to be the case.

BUT... he does seem to be a little strange with coaching IMO. That'd be the one piece you could criticize and was the reason for under performance last season. Let's hope he got it right this time.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I don't think Treliving has done much with player transactions to question what he's doing. He's a shrewd negotiator when it comes to RFA's, his trades are alright usually, his UFA signings leave a little to be desired but really overall not too bad all things considered. At the end of every season, he's usually filling the holes everybody else sees and believes to be the case.

BUT... he does seem to be a little strange with coaching IMO. That'd be the one piece you could criticize and was the reason for under performance last season. Let's hope he got it right this time.

The biggest issue I have with Treliving is his July 1 performances. These bottom-6 UFA signings are death. Raymond and Brouwer were bad when they happened, and everyone who was honest with themselves could've seen that. Why in poo perfect Hell is Derek Ryan getting a third year? If you give him to years, you don't need to buy him out year 3. And if there is a buyout candidate on our cap sheet, it's Derek Ryan. Just give him 2/$7M and call it a life.

The coaching searches are odd. There were lots of viable candidates two years ago, and none of them were Gulutzan. And I have never stopped being shocked that Gulutzan was able to convince Treliving that he was the guy.

Peters wouldn't have been my hire. But his teams in Carolina seemed to generally be regarded as well-coached. It's not Peters' fault that Carolina either goes to the Conference finals or is perpetually irrelevant.

But this is the GM we're talking about. You don't want the GM to panic. You don't want the GM to do things to 'save his job'. You don't want the GM making moves that are completely disconnected from one another. You don't want a Yes Man.

Treliving is a very good NHL GM. There are no embarrassing failures, and his moves are properly motivated. I don't expect my GM to be perfect. I expect him to know the rules, and to tirelessly work to improve the team.

Here's everyone on the team signed for 4+ years:

Gaudreau - 25
Monahan - 23
Neal - 30
Lindholm - 23
Backlund - 29
Giordano - 34
Hanifin - 21

Total cap hit: $40.775

Treliving is the best GM the city has had since Fletcher. It's not even close. You keep someone like this around.

[ForeverFlameFan]

^ great post. There’s so many players signed long term. And Tkachuk will be added to that fold soon.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

The biggest issue I have with Treliving is his July 1 performances. These bottom-6 UFA signings are death. Raymond and Brouwer were bad when they happened, and everyone who was honest with themselves could've seen that. Why in poo perfect Hell is Derek Ryan getting a third year? If you give him to years, you don't need to buy him out year 3. And if there is a buyout candidate on our cap sheet, it's Derek Ryan. Just give him 2/$7M and call it a life.

The coaching searches are odd. There were lots of viable candidates two years ago, and none of them were Gulutzan. And I have never stopped being shocked that Gulutzan was able to convince Treliving that he was the guy.

Peters wouldn't have been my hire. But his teams in Carolina seemed to generally be regarded as well-coached. It's not Peters' fault that Carolina either goes to the Conference finals or is perpetually irrelevant.

But this is the GM we're talking about. You don't want the GM to panic. You don't want the GM to do things to 'save his job'. You don't want the GM making moves that are completely disconnected from one another. You don't want a Yes Man.

Treliving is a very good NHL GM. There are no embarrassing failures, and his moves are properly motivated. I don't expect my GM to be perfect. I expect him to know the rules, and to tirelessly work to improve the team.

Here's everyone on the team signed for 4+ years:

Gaudreau - 25
Monahan - 23
Neal - 30
Lindholm - 23
Backlund - 29
Giordano - 34
Hanifin - 21

Total cap hit: $40.775

Treliving is the best GM the city has had since Fletcher. It's not even close. You keep someone like this around.

Derek Ryan got a third year because that is what it took to sign him. What were the other options? Out bid the Blues for Tyler Bozak? Put Sam Bennett back at C? Play Dillon Dube 8-12 mins a night, opposed to the 15-18 in the A (in all situations) and hope he's ready for the NHL?

I agree with you that Treliving the best GM the Flames have had since Fletcher. You can probably assume he didn't just hand Ryan a third year because he felt like being nice. Treliving is a saavy negotiator. If he didn't give Ryan the third year, there's a good chance someone else would have.

Their lineup is deep and balanced. I have no issue with the Ryan signing.

[Poe969]

I keep beating the same drum but as good of a job as Treliving has done putting this team together, it will all be for naught if there isn't a contingency plan in place for the goalie situation. Outside of the net, this may be the strongest team the Flames have had in years but they need solid goaltending the whole year for it to matter. If anything, this team could probably afford to lose a forward and/or defender at the cost of goalie.

I really hope the Flames have a good goalie this year, I hated holding my breath every time the other team shot the puck.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Treliving also traded away a bunch of 1st and 2nds in other deals, which left him short of ammunition to address goaltending. Grubauer, for instance, was moved for a 2nd this off-season - a 2nd Treliving didn't have.

I have a feeling the 2nd wasn't the issue in the Grubauer trade. I have a feeling the issue was the caphit of the Orpik buyout.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by J pold

This 100%. This fan base, CP in particular seems to only judge Treliving on transactions, divestment, and how everything looks on paper. The reality is the the team has under performed consistently since he took over as GM. I'm hopeful for this season and think he has done a great job all things considered but if it's another underwhelming season all of that won't matter and I suspect he will be let go.

Don’t agree with this take considering the team made the playoffs 2 of his first 3 years and he took over pretty much one year into a scorched earth rebuild. They vastly overachieved in his first year, came back down to earth in year 2, had a strong bounce back in year 3, and the first really disappointing season last year.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Treliving also traded away a bunch of 1st and 2nds in other deals, which left him short of ammunition to address goaltending. Grubauer, for instance, was moved for a 2nd this off-season - a 2nd Treliving didn't have.

Overall, I'm positive about Treliving's tenure as GM, and I think he improved the roster over the summer. But he has resorted to deficit spending, and you only have so many high draft picks to use to plug holes. It remains to be seen if a #4 d-man on a good contract was worth spending a bunch of assets that could have been used in other deals.

No Grubauer was moved for a 2nd and a very large buy out of a veteran defenseman.

The Flames didn't have the cap space to add what they added and buy out Brouwer and pull that off.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I don't think Treliving has done much with player transactions to question what he's doing. He's a shrewd negotiator when it comes to RFA's, his trades are alright usually, his UFA signings leave a little to be desired but really overall not too bad all things considered. At the end of every season, he's usually filling the holes everybody else sees and believes to be the case.

BUT... he does seem to be a little strange with coaching IMO. That'd be the one piece you could criticize and was the reason for under performance last season. Let's hope he got it right this time.

He wanted a team that plays with the puck.

He hired a guy that was passionate about a possession style and he was correct, the Flames shot up the charts and out played the opposition for the most part.

What they didn't do is handle adversity very well, and with a young roster he needed a stronger voice behind the bench.

Peters has the possession and more bark.

When you lay it out that way it's not really that odd in my mind.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Bingo

No Grubauer was moved for a 2nd and a very large buy out of a veteran defenseman.

The Flames didn't have the cap space to add what they added and buy out Brouwer and pull that off.

And they didn't have the cap space because of the Brouwer and Stone contracts.

The point is that Treliving has made mistakes, and some of those mistakes are what's preventing him from addressing the goaltending situation.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

And they didn't have the cap space because of the Brouwer and Stone contracts.

The point is that Treliving has made mistakes, and some of those mistakes are what's preventing him from addressing the goaltending situation.

All GMs are wrong often.

The key is to have more wins than losses, and have the impact of the wins out weight the impact of the losses.

Treliving has been that so far.

A guy like Chia in Edmonton has had some wins for sure, but the impact of the Hall and Eberle trades carry a lot of negative weight.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Bingo

All GMs are wrong often.

The key is to have more wins than losses, and have the impact of the wins out weight the impact of the losses.

Treliving has been that so far.

I agree, which is why I said that my opinion of Treliving is overall positive. I was addressing your claim that Treliving hasn't been able to fix the goalie situation because he thought the price was too high for Bishop, Raanta, etc. I'm just suggesting that he didn't have the assets to make those deals because he spent them elsewhere - a whole raft of picks for a #4 d-man and a bunch of cap space for a #5 d-man. Everything is a trade-off.