Building The 2018/19 Flames Roster

[Harry Lime]

Good ol' number 26.

And Lucky Number 7s, we used to call 'em.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

As has been shown to you already, the only net cost of buying him out this year is the $1.5M in 21/22. Are there contracts due at that time? Of course. But there will also be young replacements on the D-corp, and also in net.
$1.5M in 2021/22, when the cap will probably be between $85 and 90M, is not a concern.

If Treliving sees an opportunity to improve the team his year, he is going to take it. And even though there is a fair amount of cap space available for a move, he would probably still want to have room to make another move as the season unfolds.

I agree that if nothing happens this summer, and they have miles of cap space, then it makes sense to let Brouwer eat popcorn and wait until next year to buy him out.

But the cost of buying him out is minimal, and gives Treliving lots of flexibility. Suggesting he sees it your way is short-sighted.

No, I'm just extremely confident. I've already looked into this months ago, this wasn't something I just saw and responded to. I looked at our future cap situation just after the new year and it makes sense to me to wait it out another year.

I know the chances of a buyout is theoretically equal, but I also know that GMs don't like saddling themselves with dead cap space, so you might as well try to minimize the impact. Only time will tell, but I just don't see a buyout happening.

[spuzzum]

How large of an impact did Engelland have on the Flames the season before last? The Flames certainly had a lot more success while he was here including several playoff dances.

At the time of his signing, it was viewed as the worst FA signing of the summer. No offensive production, extremely slow and immobile, and a gritty type player being phased out of the league.

I wonder if he had a much larger impact on this team and if the Flames need a similar type defenseman going into next season.

[Mattman]

I could get behind signing Vanek and Derek Ryan. Both very useful bottom 6 RHS.

BUT

I would like to see a right hand shot added to our top 6 and preferably our 1st line before getting depth guys.

Ferland - Janko - Vanek
Mangiapane - Ryan - Foo

[Jiri Hrdina]

Adding Vanek is adding another guy who isn't a good all around player.
Until the Flames add guys who can consistently produce while not being horrible two way players - they have no chance of competing.

[Toonage]

The morning show on 960 has mentioned on several occasions (and I believe they have legit inside info on this) that management doesn't like Vanek and would never entertain having him on the team.

[Mattman]

Originally Posted by Toonage

The morning show on 960 has mentioned on several occasions (and I believe they have legit inside info on this) that management doesn't like Vanek and would never entertain having him on the team.

There's gotta be a reason. Did someone on our management ever coach him or were they ever close to him in some way?

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Toonage

The morning show on 960 has mentioned on several occasions (and I believe they have legit inside info on this) that management doesn't like Vanek and would never entertain having him on the team.

Maybe management needs to start thinking outside their incredibly rigid box though. Maybe we wouldn't have ended up missing the playoffs this season because we care so much more about character and grit over actual talent and skill. I'm not saying Vanek is the answer, but this same garbage thinking over the last 2 decades cannot continue. The horse has been beaten, it's already dead.

Explore all and any options that makes this team faster and more skilled and maybe we can actually win a playoff round for once when we're expected to rather than just winning one out of the blue.

[Toonage]

No idea why they seem to dislike him (or allegedly dislike him). Playoff disappearances maybe? Seems to put up the points in the regular season but who knows, could be bad in the room? All I know is I've heard his name come up a few times and its been shot down each time with that reason either hinted at or outright said.

Also maybe it was Burke advising Treliving to stay away, and that could be gone now. Really, who knows. Just wanted to point it out though that given what we do know, he likely isn't on the radar.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Maybe management needs to start thinking outside their incredibly rigid box though. Maybe we wouldn't have ended up missing the playoffs this season because we care so much more about character and grit over actual talent and skill. I'm not saying Vanek is the answer, but this same garbage thinking over the last 2 decades cannot continue. The horse has been beaten, it's already dead.

Explore all and any options that makes this team faster and more skilled and maybe we can actually win a playoff round for once when we're expected to rather than just winning one out of the blue.

This is such a over-dramatic leap / reach.

Because it's speculated they don't like one player notorious for being streaky, one dimensional and a terrible two-way player, you get to "garbage thinking"?

[Red]

Originally Posted by Toonage

No idea why they seem to dislike him (or allegedly dislike him). Playoff disappearances maybe? Seems to put up the points in the regular season but who knows, could be bad in the room? All I know is I've heard his name come up a few times and its been shot down each time with that reason either hinted at or outright said.

Also maybe it was Burke advising Treliving to stay away, and that could be gone now. Really, who knows. Just wanted to point it out though that given what we do know, he likely isn't on the radar.

The Flames would be Vanek's 6th team in 2 years.

This isn't just Burke and Treliving, he is a player that people keep shipping out of town. Good skillset keeps him in the NHL, but there seems to be something about him that people don't like.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

No, I'm just extremely confident. I've already looked into this months ago, this wasn't something I just saw and responded to. I looked at our future cap situation just after the new year and it makes sense to me to wait it out another year.

I know the chances of a buyout is theoretically equal, but I also know that GMs don't like saddling themselves with dead cap space, so you might as well try to minimize the impact. Only time will tell, but I just don't see a buyout happening.

Oh, I know you're confident. Unfortunately, increased confidence does not make us more correct.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

This is such a over-dramatic leap / reach.

Because it's speculated they don't like one player notorious for being streaky, one dimensional and a terrible two-way player, you get to "garbage thinking"?

No, the garbage thinking has been prevalent for the last 2 or 3 decades and it's the likely the cause of our incredibly mediocre results over the same time period. This was a team once littered with Hall of Famers on the same roster and now, we might have just 1.

It's not like this is not the first time I've stated this. I don't have a problem with them disliking that specific player. But it's the line of thinking that I have a problem because it's the same reason we've ended up with "character" guys instead of players who can actually score and contribute. We were one of the lowest scoring teams in the league, if someone can help improve the Flames' ability to score more goals, then management needs to look into it.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Oh, I know you're confident. Unfortunately, increased confidence does not make us more correct.

Listen, if Troy Brouwer is bought out this summer, I have no problem coming out and admitting I was wrong. But until it is done, I'll continue to be extremely confident that he won't. If Treliving has shown me anything in his tenure here, it's that he's very fiscally responsible and risk adverse, so I just don't see him taking the buyout plunge yet.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

No, the garbage thinking has been prevalent for the last 2 or 3 decades and it's the likely the cause of our incredibly mediocre results over the same time period. This was a team once littered with Hall of Famers on the same roster and now, we might have just 1.

It's not like this is not the first time I've stated this. I don't have a problem with them disliking that specific player. But it's the line of thinking that I have a problem because it's the same reason we've ended up with "character" guys instead of players who can actually score and contribute. We were one of the lowest scoring teams in the league, if someone can help improve the Flames' ability to score more goals, then management needs to look into it.

This is utter nonsense. You just took a rumour about an individual player we don't even know is true and used it to validate your biased, over-dramatic negative feelings spanning two decades and several management regimes.

I don't really care if you have pent up frustrations and an inherently negative outlook. But using the example of Vanek above as a jumping off point to spew it and act like that validates it was both weak and painful to read.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Maybe management needs to start thinking outside their incredibly rigid box though. Maybe we wouldn't have ended up missing the playoffs this season because we care so much more about character and grit over actual talent and skill. I'm not saying Vanek is the answer, but this same garbage thinking over the last 2 decades cannot continue. The horse has been beaten, it's already dead.

Explore all and any options that makes this team faster and more skilled and maybe we can actually win a playoff round for once when we're expected to rather than just winning one out of the blue.

How can you just jump inside their heads and deem it character and grit?

Vanek is soft and one dimensional. The game isn't played that way anymore.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

No, the garbage thinking has been prevalent for the last 2 or 3 decades and it's the likely the cause of our incredibly mediocre results over the same time period. This was a team once littered with Hall of Famers on the same roster and now, we might have just 1.

It's not like this is not the first time I've stated this. I don't have a problem with them disliking that specific player. But it's the line of thinking that I have a problem because it's the same reason we've ended up with "character" guys instead of players who can actually score and contribute. We were one of the lowest scoring teams in the league, if someone can help improve the Flames' ability to score more goals, then management needs to look into it.

Honestly I think it's garbage thinking to try and put any regime in the same package as all others and think it's a 30 year thing.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Bingo

How can you just jump inside their heads and deem it character and grit?

Vanek is soft and one dimensional. The game isn't played that way anymore.

Because through the last couple decades, the GMs who have been employed have put heavy emphasis on these traits. This isn't something that I conjured up from thin air, this is taken from the Horse's mouths.

If people here don't want Vanek, that's fine. It's like he's anywhere near the top of my list. I'm just saying, this management group needs to think differently from years past because all we've seen is a whole of mediocrity. So sorry everybody for trying to think outside the box a little.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Because through the last couple decades, the GMs who have been employed have put heavy emphasis on these traits. This isn't something that I conjured up from thin air, this is taken from the Horse's mouths.

If people here don't want Vanek, that's fine. It's like he's anywhere near the top of my list. I'm just saying, this management group needs to think differently from years past because all we've seen is a whole of mediocrity. So sorry everybody for trying to think outside the box a little.

And what you're not getting is just because the present group may dislike Vanek as a player (which we don't know) it in no way correlates to anything thinking separate, previous management groups had. Philosophical or otherwise.

You're connecting dots that aren't there to validate your own frustrations / narrative.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Because through the last couple decades, the GMs who have been employed have put heavy emphasis on these traits. This isn't something that I conjured up from thin air, this is taken from the Horse's mouths.

If people here don't want Vanek, that's fine. It's like he's anywhere near the top of my list. I'm just saying, this management group needs to think differently from years past because all we've seen is a whole of mediocrity. So sorry everybody for trying to think outside the box a little.

Treliving thinks what he thinks.

You can agree with his thinking or disagree for sure ... but I'm more than certain that Risebrough, Coates, Sutter and Button have little to do with his decision process.

The guy has drafted the likes of Mangiapane and Phillips in recent drafts. The guy isn't all in on grit.