2017/2018 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

That's lots of 4th line C options, but the top 3 is weak unless Jankowski takes a huge step.

I love Monahan, he's a mid range #1 C. That's great but not "high end" for the role he plays on the team.

I love Backlund, he's a mid range #2 C. That's great but not "high end" for the role he plays on the team.

So IMO, we are already behind the real contending teams as far as C goes, and then following that up with a #3 C with 73 NHL games under his belt. And if either Backlund or Monahan play hurt or miss time then we are really in trouble.

I get it. There are some young players we have as C options. Young players can surprise if given an opportunity. Just look at William Karlsson in Vegas. But i wouldn't go betting my season on it if I were Treliving. He did last year and Bennett/Janko/Stajan didn't get the job done.

That's why I love the Tavares pipe dream so much. You add that guy and all of a sudden you have a "high end" #1 C but the side effects are having Monahan and Backlund go from playing in water up to their necks to running around in the kiddie pool. That's the kind of C depth you can win a Cup with.

Fair enough. I'm kind of on the other side I think. Monahan is seriously under appreciated here. Don't think he needs to be shoved down from the top spot. He's done nothing to earn the level of mistrust some give him. Not saying you per se, but it's funny how much lack of appreciation the guy gets.

I get it, he has the personality of dry toast. But I'll be damned if he isn't equal partners in his and Gaudreaus success. give those two a consistent legit top line RW and they'd be one of the best lines in the league. Hell they dragged Ferland up to 20 goals. Imagine getting a bonafide legit Kessel type.

I mean if we want to talk about where weakness is, it'd be having Backlund @ the #2 center spot. He's the ultimate #3 defensive center on a cup contending team. If you want to go out and get a more offensive minded #2 C Im all for it. I'd be all for Tavares but I've already convinced myself he's not coming anywhere near the Flames.

I'm not nearly as concerned with the center depth as you are so I don't see why we would waste a ton more time and assets addressing the #2 strength on the team when that RW is the absolute worst problem the team has.

Maybe Tree does go out and get an upgrade at #2 center. But I'm betting that he goes hard on a top line RW. Like all or nothing on one.

[Monahammer]

I'd make a pitch for toews but I don't really think it's realistic. Something like Brodie, Brouwer, Bennett for Toews and a pick?
Toews-tkachuk would be a great duo

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Fair enough. I'm kind of on the other side I think. Monahan is seriously under appreciated here. Don't think he needs to be shoved down from the top spot. He's done nothing to earn the level of mistrust some give him. Not saying you per se, but it's funny how much lack of appreciation the guy gets.

I get it, he has the personality of dry toast. But I'll be damned if he isn't equal partners in his and Gaudreaus success. give those two a consistent legit top line RW and they'd be one of the best lines in the league. Hell they dragged Ferland up to 20 goals. Imagine getting a bonafide legit Kessel type.

I mean if we want to talk about where weakness is, it'd be having Backlund @ the #2 center spot. He's the ultimate #3 defensive center on a cup contending team. If you want to go out and get a more offensive minded #2 C Im all for it. I'd be all for Tavares but I've already convinced myself he's not coming anywhere near the Flames.

I'm not nearly as concerned with the center depth as you are so I don't see why we would waste a ton more time and assets addressing the #2 strength on the team when that RW is the absolute worst problem the team has.

Maybe Tree does go out and get an upgrade at #2 center. But I'm betting that he goes hard on a top line RW. Like all or nothing on one.

Oh no I'm not discrediting Mony at all. I'm fine with him as 1C and adding another 2 or 3C. Just saying by adding Tavares, mony would get bumped down and he'd be one of the top 5 #2Cs in the league.(just off the top of my head)

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I'd make a pitch for toews but I don't really think it's realistic. Something like Brodie, Brouwer, Bennett for Toews and a pick?
Toews-tkachuk would be a great duo

I would not touch Toews with a 10 foot pole unless Chicago was retaining close to 50%. That is the worst contract in the NHL imo.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Saad is likely higher in trade value than (or perhaps equal to) Brodie. They aren't going to "throw in" a first and third round pick to move him and you want them to take Brouwer also.

You are basically saying that Brodie has way more trade value than Saad, as Chicago needs to give up an extra 1st and 3rd and take Brouwer? That's a huge difference.

Calgary might well trade Brodie and Brouwer for Chicago's 1st and 3rd round pick. Getting rid of Brouwer would be huge for cap reasons.

No way does Saad, at $6M, have more value than Brodie at $4.65. Brodie is the more valuable. Is the difference a 1st? Doubtful - maybe a 2nd.

But throwing Brouwer into the proposal just muddies it up. Make it a Brodie/Saad deal and be done with it. Also, Chicago is cap-strapped - throwing in Brouwer destroys any discussions with them.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I would not touch Toews with a 10 foot pole unless Chicago was retaining close to 50%. That is the worst contract in the NHL imo.

That's a tad hyperbolic IMO.

He's dropped to a 20+ goal 50+ point two way center, and is not worth $10.5 million per year against the cap, I agree. But with Toews he's always been more than just goals and points. Bad contract? Yeah. Worst in the league? I don't think so.

[dammage79]

Pretty sure worst contract goes to either Lucic or Eriksson or Brouwer. Depending on your personal tastes.

[sempuki]

Someone get me some of the the NyQuil this guy is drinking...

[Monahammer]

It's not one of the worst in the league, and with the cap going up and toews a lock for solid d play and 50+ points on the 2nd line, potentially more if he gels with Tkachuk. I think their possession game would be dominant.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

No way does Saad, at $6M, have more value than Brodie at $4.65. Brodie is the more valuable. Is the difference a 1st? Doubtful - maybe a 2nd.

But throwing Brouwer into the proposal just muddies it up. Make it a Brodie/Saad deal and be done with it. Also, Chicago is cap-strapped - throwing in Brouwer destroys any discussions with them.

You may be right, but Brodie has been really bad the last two years. Saad wasn't good last year, but it's one year and he was't Brodie bad.

But I think it was the addition on Chicago's side of a 1st and a third and the addition of Brouwer that made it laughable.

Substitute Hamilton for Brodie and it becomes a discussion, though I doubt either team does it. Chicago isn't taking on more cap.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

That's a tad hyperbolic IMO.

He's dropped to a 20+ goal 50+ point two way center, and is not worth $10.5 million per year against the cap, I agree. But with Toews he's always been more than just goals and points. Bad contract? Yeah. Worst in the league? I don't think so.

I agree.

If a team can fit Towes into their cap structure (a big if) and they are close to (and want to win the SC), there are worse players to pick up than Toews.

Once Crawford went down, Chicago went down like the Titanic.

Toews will be relevant again.

[Enoch Root]

This thread is a great example of how fans are very focused on what you've done for me lately: Kessel is now a 90 point guy, even though that was his highest point total by 10 points, and in his prior 4 years, he averaged 70 points.

Meanwhile, Toews, one of the best Cs int he league, has an off year and suddenly he is one of the worst contracts in the league. If an Olympic team were being put together today, Toews would be one of the Cs (which, on TC, really says something).

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This thread is a great example of how fans are very focused on what you've done for me lately: Kessel is now a 90 point guy, even though that was his highest point total by 10 points, and in his prior 4 years, he averaged 70 points.

Meanwhile, Toews, one of the best Cs int he league, has an off year and suddenly he is one of the worst contracts in the league. If an Olympic team were being put together today, Toews would be one of the Cs (which, on TC, really says something).

Would probably go something like this too:

Crosby
Toews
EDIT wait a second, forgot future GOAT McJesus.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Would probably go something like this too:

Crosby
Toews
EDIT wait a second, forgot future GOAT McJesus.

Crosby on the top line with Marchand and Bergeron

McDavid on the 2nd, scoring line

Toews on the 3rd line

47 other great players to fill out the roster with.

That would be my guess

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

That's a tad hyperbolic IMO.

He's dropped to a 20+ goal 50+ point two way center, and is not worth $10.5 million per year against the cap, I agree. But with Toews he's always been more than just goals and points. Bad contract? Yeah. Worst in the league? I don't think so.

How so? Patrice Bergeron is superior to Toews in every way and makes $6.8M
Crosby makes $8.7M and has more awards and is the best C in the game. Is leadership worth an extra 4-4.5M a year? I don't think so. It might not be the worst in the NHL but it is in the top 5 for sure.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This thread is a great example of how fans are very focused on what you've done for me lately: Kessel is now a 90 point guy, even though that was his highest point total by 10 points, and in his prior 4 years, he averaged 70 points.

Meanwhile, Toews, one of the best Cs int he league, has an off year and suddenly he is one of the worst contracts in the league. If an Olympic team were being put together today, Toews would be one of the Cs (which, on TC, really says something).

I bet you he wouldn't. An off year? He has been around a 60 point player for the past four seasons. Who does he bump out of Crosby, McDavid, Bergeron, Stamkos and that is just off the top of my head.

[Scroopy Noopers]

How is Toews one of the best centres in the league besides just being Toews?

[Nelson]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Saad would be ideal. But I'd still go after one more guy like Kapanen on top of that.

LW:
Johnny
Tkachuk
Bennett
Ferland

RW:
Saad
Kapanen
Frolik
Foo

C:
Monahan
Janko
Backlund
Lazar


I mean thats pretty locked in right there. Could even have Foo as depth on the farm and Lazar be the spark plug

Also dark horse guy like Dube or Mangipane can come in a make a mess of things too.

Either way. thats a pretty solid depth chart if you add those two RW's. rotates Ferland back to LW where he should be.

I disagree with putting Jankowski above Backlund on the centre depth chart. Unless 2018-19 Jankowski is head and shoulders above 2017-18 Jankowski, Jankowski should play much less than Backlund. He needs sheltered minutes: lots of offensive zone starts against weaker than average competition. Even in these circumstances, 2017-18 Jankowski struggled mightily (the Flames scored 44% of the goals). I’m not sure, but I think Jankowski might even be the Flames 4th best centre. I think Shore might be better. The team probably won’t score as much with Shore on the ice, but they’ll likely also give up way less.

[savardandjokinen]

The worst contract in the league has got to be Seabrook's

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

How is Toews one of the best centres in the league besides just being Toews?

A season ago he was the #1C on a 109 pt team playing over 20 minutes a game, He had 58 pts in 72 games.

There are total of 8 1C over the last 2 seasons that teams have put up 109 pts. NO teams have hit 109 pts both years.

He is one year away from having what would be considered a great (career?) season for Monahan.

The Hawks were awful last season playing Riitch/Gillies equivalents in net for most of the year.

PS Tavares teams have had 100 and 101 pt seasons.