Yeah, I haven't had a chance yet, I'll throw one up tonight. I really actually loved the episode because of the time lines involved.
on a side note, the show is on the bubble for renewal, but the writers have stated that they're writing an end of series scenario just in case there's no season 6. So the theory is
Spoiler!
Coulson is going to either die, or be cured and have his mind erased and he ends up with the musician in Seattle. And Daisy becomes the new director of shield
oh and just an add on
Spoiler!
Out of the darkness and into the light
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Caught this on Reddit. Thought it was pretty cool.
Edit: Also Clark Gregg has been cast into Captain Marvel as a young Coulson. I wonder if they'll throw in any minor nods to Agents of Shield. It would be nice to have SOME acknowledgement of AoS in the MCU, even if it's really small.
Edit 2: Wait... I just realized Captain Crunch made an appearance on this episode and is also the primary purveyor of this thread!!! Too bad Talbot outranks you.
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Last edited by Teh_Bandwagoner; 04-04-2018 at 02:01 PM.
Have you ever watched a TV show over a series of years, and then decided that as it neared the end that it would have been awesome if you had been more detailed oriented as you watched the series.
This is probably one of those episodes where everything over the last few years was actually neatly bought together.
First of all, this episode was all about parts. It focused on answering a lot of questions about General Hale and her rise in Hydra, we dealt with the ramifications of frameword Doctor Fitz, who isn't going away. And we got the whole what's happening with the destroyer of worlds thing.
First of all, why was this episode cool to me, because you basically start with Hydra 902010 as a young Hale wakes up and goes to Hydra high, messes around with a young and now dead Sitwell and deals with a bullying future head of Hydra. Young Hale as ruthless and bright and dedicated and ambitious. She also has a dog. well err did.
We see the role that Daniel Whitehall had (remember him) as he's apparently like a combination of evil Dumbledore and Himmler at this school during a class Whitehall talks about building a machine that would allow a man to absorb and use elements Absorbing man) no he talks about a machine that cane fuse a man with the power of the Tesseract, however Hale brings up the idea of a machine that allows the merger of a human and alien technology.
Later after the graduation and Hales murder of her dog, which is a Hydra right of passage for flushing your weakness. She's called into Whitehall, who informs her that he's actually more interested in her lady parts, err he wants to use her as a surrogate mother to give birth to the future leader of Hydra who will be put into Whitehalls machine.
We flash forward to 2 years ago and we see and meet the future of Hydra in Hales daughter Ruby. The first thing that we can see is Ruby and possibly Hale are not normal Hydra, Ruby refuses to kill her dog and take part in the right of passage. This makes us see that there is some out of the box thinking here. But at this point the relationship between Ruby and her mother seems to be ok.
Then we kind of come to present day and we see General Talbot who is obviously still suffering from taking a bullet to the head. Its sad to see as he's clearly damaged to the point where his lack of impulse control and frustration makes him dangerous to his family. Of course Hale swoops in and "transfers" him to a Hydra facility.
Here's where we see again the Ruby Hale breakfast interrogation technique, and poor Glenn falls for it. However he's interrogated and refuses to cooperate.
the next flash forward is Coulson, and this is one of my favorite scenes this year as they attempted the same breakfast trick with him, but Snarky Phil isn't having it, he basically insults the breakfast layout as a C rate Holiday inn, then see's his favorite cereal and states that he'll be in his room.
Its been a long time since we've seen funny Phil at work so this was great.
finally Hale meets up with Coulson and shows him the Chitari device which allows them to see the Confederacy representative. We find out that they will protect earth in exchange for Gravitonium and inhumans. At that point, Hale mentions that Hydra has another plan, and they want to put a person in Whitehalls chamber and infuse that person with Gravitonium. Whitehall called the project the Destroyer of Worlds.
So first of all we get a hint about how Daisy's power evolved, but second of all, we get the first hint that Daisy isn't the destroyer of Worlds, Ruby who is destined to be put in that machine is likely the destroyer of worlds.
Ok, meanwhile on the other side of the fence, we see that Fitz is slowly getting more comfortable with his role as doctor evil, the ends justify the means guy. But Daisy outright hates him and uses her power on him. Its actually a bit sad to see.
May basically wants Fitz to be a weapon against Hydra, since he's a ruthless super villain when he wants to be. Daisy basically wants to beat him up and pull his underwear over her head. And Simmons finally reveals that he's Deke's Grandfather, to which Fitz discloses that "he's the worst".
Yeah it was a chuckle scene in that way, but it mad Fitz realize that he and Simmons are going to be ok and have a daughter and make it to the light house if the world is destroyed.
In a lot of ways this was an awesome episode even though there was no real action in it. But we got to see the world prior to AOS and what Hydra was up to. We also got to see some pretty awesome world building of the Confederacy who might or might not be saviors of mankind, we also got to see Hydra at its deceitful best, but we gained some understanding of what they were after. Yes they are basically technology driven Nazi's, however they feel that they doing this to save the world and make it better.
One other added note, for a while the question has been, what kind of a leader is Coulson and what's he willing to give up. the summed this up nicely in this episode.
When Talbot was offered the same deal he reverted to type, he wouldn't betray the flag of his country not matter what the cost. Coulson on the other hand knows a possibly good alliance no matter the cost, and is willing to sock his moral hatred of Hydra away in order to win.
Random thoughts
Coulson reacting to the Welcome scenario in the Hydra Bunker with extreme snarkiness before finding his favorite box of cereal was hilarious. it also put him in a better bargaining position with Hale.
Coulson looking a Ruby and commenting on the failure of home schooling. sometimes he just scores verbal sparring points without trying.
Daisy - "Hale is Hydra" only to realize the wordplay.
Fitz on learning that his grandson is Deke - "But he's the worst".
I loved the little easter eggs, the creation of the Absorbing man, the Chitari giving Hydra the device, all brilliant, but I loved seeing Whitehall back. He was such a menacing villain back in season two. I also loved that Phils reaction was "I buried him . . . go team" when Hale mentioned him.
Poor Talbot, he was Coulson's bitter enemy, and in the end when Hale had him taken away he was left with the idea that only Coulson could save him.
Ruby is obsessed with Daisy and its creepy and while the plan by Hale was to put Quake in the machine and fuse her with Gravitonium. You get the feeling that Ruby is going to betray her mother and enter the machine so that she can destroy Quake.
Great episode lots of stars, and now I want a series called Agents of Hydra.
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Sometimes you forget how nasty and menacing of a villain that Grant Ward became on that show. Its amazing that the character shift started out so subtly. And he kept pushing and pushing into the darkness.
And as much as they've had some great villains. Whitehall, Hive, Aida. Grant Ward was probably the best villains that I've ever seen.
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Well Agents of Shield keeps moving towards the inevitable and Inside Voices was no different. The show is now really pushing the concepts of inevitability and because of that invulnerability.
This episode also bought back a couple of minor villains from the show and suddenly put us headlong on the course to the end of the world.
Once again we have multiple story lines that are slowly coming together. What is Hale's plan to save the world from an alien invasion (I'm still convinced that this is going to tie into Thanos). The dynamic splintering of the team at the shield base with Daisy and Mack on one side and Yo yo and Simmons on the other side, and Fitz's pragmatic new get things done character in the middle. The third story is the inevitable confrontation between Ruby and Hale with Daisy being caught in the middle.
When we look at the inevitability theory of time, it basically states that time is linear and no matter what happens you can't deviate it. You can't go into the past and change the future. you might change events, but time will find a way. We've seen this being proven, Yo Yo losing her arms. Deke the grandson, the relationship between May and Robin.
What has come out of this sense of invincibility is that somehow Simmon's and Yo Yo seem to believe that Fitz ruthless nature is probably the only weapon against the end of the world, but in order to for them to break him out Simmons used a taste test and a bit of acting, however in the end we found out that Daisy had among her glasses of water a glass of poisonous hydraulic fluid and she didn't pick that, she also had a gun go off accidentally and nobody died. So in terms of this ploy, she duped Mack, freed Fitz and somewhat proved that he is invulnerable due to the inevitability of time.
Meanwhile Hale is pushing forward with the experiment to graft Daisy with Gravitonium, and she's experimenting with the substance to the point of sending poor Creel in to touch it. When he does, things go wrong and he hears two voices in there. We knew about the one voice from Dr Hall who fell into it in season one. But we got a flashback where Raina basically had Ian Quinn given to the Gravitonium.
so here's crazy theory number one
Spoiler!
Ruby is going to be absorbed into the Gravitonium, and she and Quinn and Hall will become one entity Graviton, who is a villain in Agents of Shield. Graviton will attempt to destroy the world and Daisy will be the only one who can stop it
Anyways, Creel finds out after this experiment that Hale lied to him about Talbot and he throws his lot in with Coulson to save him.
Again we go to the inevitability theory as during the escape attempt Coulson is killed and revived by Creel. But that doesn't mean he can't die later, this was a jerk tease by Whedon to give us a heart attack.
We also get Glenn Talbot comedian with no impulse control. during the escape he keeps talking loudly and Coulson begs him to use his inside voice.
Meanwhile Robin tells the team where Coulson and Talbot are going to turn up through a drawing and Coulson escapes with Talbot using the alien transporter.
Meanwhile Creel is recaptured and Hale decides that her daughter is strong enough to go in the infusion chamber. And we're now full bore heading towards a final confrontation.
This was a fun episode that was more about moving things over and filling in plot holes while setting the table for the last 5 episodes
Random crap
Daisy is become a severe Hard ass - If this show continues I feel like Daisy is going to be the director of shield even if Coulson doesn't die
Talbot - "THIS IS MY INSIDE VOICE!!"
The continued dislike of Deke by Fitz. When Yo Yo finds out
Yo Yo -"Wow, I'm really sorry"
Fitz - "Thanks"
Simmons - "No he's really quite sweet"
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While I wouldn't say that this series is moving at breakneck speed, its certainly moving towards what seems to be the inevitable, and that's the destruction of the Earth. It just feels at this point that whatever Shield does, Hydra is one step ahead, or fate is ushering the team towards the inevitable future.
As of now, this series has broken into three distinct story lines.
The dynamic between Hale and Rudy
The Dynamic of the Daisy lead shield
The story line of Coulson and Talbot and Coulson upcoming date with the Grim Reaper.
In terms of the dynamic of the Daisy lead shield, its pretty clear that Daisy is having some problems with leadership and she seems to be striking the wrong note with the rest of the team to the point that just as we see Coulson returning, we've seen Fitz, Simmons and Yo Yo. Actually the episode ended with what I felt the writers taking a shot at the absurdity of this seasons story line as they returned to England to fight Robots. When you hear that statement in a vacuum you can actually see the humor in it.
With Fitz and Simmons and Yo yo on a mission to destroy the infusion chamber and end the cycle you almost feel hope that the world isn't going to end as they smash key components of the Chamber only to have Robo Ivanov show up with his squad of Death Troopers.
However while Yo yo managed to dispatch Ivanov and shut down the droids but we did learn that her awesome robot arms don't work with her mutant and shorted out the first time she jumped.
Meanwhile we see Ruby pursuing Talbot and Coulson, and she manages to reach them just as Daisy and her team try to extract Coulson. However Daisy and Ruby have a clash and we find out that Ruby is actually able to dodge Daisy's blasts, but Daisy wins in the end. Of course she gave an order to Deke who promptly ignored it and got critically shot for that.
When Ruby returns home Hale angrily locks her in her room, but Strucker free's her and tells her that he has the secrets of the chamber, so Ruby beats up her mom and they head to the chamber with the Gravitonium.
Of course they capture Fitz and Simmons and put them to work fixing the machine, again proving the theory of inevitability. You have a sense that Ruby is going to merge with the Graviton and the insanity of Quinn and Hall and all hell is going to break loose.
So at the end of the episode just when things aren't bad enough they get worse, as Talbot phones home and is activated by Hale to be a Hydra sleeper agent.
Tidbits.
Deke wakes up from surgery completely blasted out of his mind, and hilarity ensues as he asks Mack if they have a secret handshake and embarressingly admits that he loves Daisy.
Yo Yo once again tells the team that Coulson must die.
May rips into Coulson about his choices and then tells him that she loves him, but maybe its in the weird platonic way.
That particle chamber looks shockingly like Captain American's creation chamber.
When Hale raised Ruby she was supposed to raise the perfect Monster, the new leader of Hydra. Instead she's created the Frankenstein who filled with hurt and neurosis who really needs to kill Daisy and fullfil her destiny to feel whole.
3 episodes left to the end of the world.
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Ok, before I'm going to go anywhere with the spoiler tags, I'm going to say one thing
mother$$$$$$
Spoiler!
Shield has always managed to skirt the darkness while at its heart trying to keep things a little light. At the darkest moments in this series you can always count on a phrase or statement out of nowhere that lets you breath and laugh at the absurdity of the situation. And absurdity isn't a bad term. We're talking about a spy agency that's dealt with Nazi's, mutants, evil alien super beings, a virtual world and a love sick robot and the end of the world.
But through all of it, they have these pure moments where you just have to laugh. They teased us with that tonight with the whole Deke in love with Daisy and Lemon stories, but this thing got dark in a hurry.
And those bastards swerved us, they swerved us hard.
Death seems to be a fact of life in this show as well, and this episode had it all including the slaughter of a terrified and misguided young girl.
WTF you say, just wait its coming, and they managed to make a monster really sympathetic and at the same time through us a massive curveball.
I also want to remind anyone that reads this, and I hope there are a few of you left, that each season of Shield has had a theme, sacrifice, choices, vengeance among other ones, but the overlying theme this year has been the question of inevitability, that no matter what your choices are your on a path.
When I look at the darkness of this season, its amazing how they paced it so it almost has become another unseen character in the show. Yo Yo loses her arms. Fitz uses his evil doppilganger and tortures his friends, Coulson slowly dying from the Tahiti project, it was almost like they were pacing this as the gradually deepening pool, and tonight you took that step and suddenly found yourself immersed in the darkness.
Basically we have seen the evolution of Daisy as the new leader of Shield has she has effectively sidelined Coulson in the hopes of avoiding the inevitable time loop and his death which Yo yo has said can't be stopped and shouldn't be stopped. But splitting up the team and leaving Coulson behind with Talbot and Mack and Robyn has its own problems and Shield once again teased us with that death that we really don't want.
Poor Talbot is completely broken and brain washed and his mission was to snatch Robyn the poor girl who's power is that she can see parts of the future. But during his snatch he's confronted by Coulson who tries to help Talbot to shake his programming, in the end we see the scene where Coulson orders Talbot to point the gun at him and only a last minute icer shot prevents Coulson from dying.
Meanwhile poor Simmons and Fitz are trying to repair the infusion device for Ruby and Strucker and Ruby takes extra ordinary pleasure in torturing Simmons by throwing her weapon at Gemma's head.
As I stated last week, Ruby is very much a monster, but she's like Frankenstein, a victim of her creator General Hale who's been driven by birth to beat her hero and be the leader of Hydra. As such Ruby can't help herself, there's really not a good bone in her body, mainly because he was raised that way.
Meanwhile Daisy and her team manage to snatch General Hale who's seen that her daughter is going to merge with the Gravitonium with the two now insane entities in it, and surrenders to try to save her daughter.
This leads to the confrontation where Ruby is infused with 8% of the Gravitonium and she becomes incredibly powerful and unbalanced and accidentally kills Strucker by crushing his head which is gruesome.
The climax of the episode is Daisy and Hale trying to help Ruby who is basically begging for help, and is tortured by the voices in her head. The acting by Dove Cameron has been top notch as she's played Ruby with a combination of menace and vulnerability. But it gets more jarring as just as Hale and Daisy seem to be getting through to Ruby, Yo Yo shows up and kills her in a fairly gruesome manner and we watch poor Ruby as she slowly bleeds to death.
So there's curve ball number two. The first one not really surprising as far as another tease of Coulson's death. However they've been hinting that Ruby was going to be the destroyer of world and I predicted that she would become Graviton. But as Ruby died and basically released her energy, Yo Yo stated that she'd saved the world.
In episode 18.
However I don't believe it, I don't believe that they're going to allow Earths inevitable fate to be altered and the time loop disrupted that easily, To me this now shifts things back to Daisy becoming the destroyer of worlds.
Hale herself disappears and the next scene that we see is her with the alien being willing to disclose the location of the Gravitonium and the Shield base, and the shocked and shattered Hale who has just lost her daughter states that she doesn't care if they kill Shield, so Hale has gone from being the reluctant antagonist to a vessel for vengeance.
Shocking and dark, and with 4 episodes left, I don't believe by any stretch that the world is safe.
Random thoughts
1) The camera work really added to the tension of the episode with a reliance on reactions. The interactions between Fitz and Simmons. The drawing in on Ruby during her insanity moments were shocking and jarring and really put this episode over the top
2) The action choreography and especially the fight scenes in my mind are the best in TV. The fight between Sky and May when they invade the base was so incredibly well done and viceral.
3) Poor Deke he continues to be the foil of humor especially with his feelings towards Daisy. During the briefing when Mack asks him if he's wearing body spray was such a random locker room moment and well done. The story of courting in the future where you leave a lemon on a girls bed was well done, and Mack and Coulson's reaction to it was hilarious.
4) Phil wanting to continue the conversation with May where she said she loved him and her unwillingness summed up the awkwardness of their relationship where she storms off and Phil mutters "Good talk Phil"
5) Struckers head being crushed and poor Ruby's head nearly being cut off by Yo Yo were far more grotesque then most deaths except for poor Aida's death last year, but they were actually incredibly necessary to the story line.
6) Hales instant surrender so she could rush to her daughters rescue showed that she's almost an unwilling enemy, but I think that's changed.
7) When the Graviton exploded out of Ruby, where did it go, I think they emphasized it too much to just be a nice special effect.
8) Is there a link up coming with the next Avengers movie?
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My guess for the connection is that the Gravitonium is actually the Soul Gem. It seems like a “Whedon thing to do”.
1. It has consumed the “souls” of at least two people, and I don’t think the actual number of voices heard has been given.
2. The aether was not a stone and was able to inhabit other life. It would make sense that another “gem” would act similar, and the soul gem is supposed to steal souls into another dimension which could explain where Hall and Quinn are.
3. An Infinity gem would definitely be powerful enough to rip the planet apart.
4. “As he stood over the Gravitonium with Raina discussing giving it to Quinn, Garrett said he could see "its soul."” This is the, Oh look, we told you back at the beginning it was the soul gem, moment.
5. Just the fact that everyone has been wondering where it is and they hid it in a tv show.
Of course this is probably way off base. How to have the Gravitonium end up in Avengers without any AoS actors on the cast list and with 4 episodes remaining in the season, but Ruby’s explosion would make a great timeline sync. That release of power is what draws Thanos to Earth.
But for me it makes a good end point for the series. It was part of this first story arc in the MCU and revealing the soul gem would tie up the reason for the series but allow it to continue if renewed.
I’ve really enjoyed this series and am sad to see it end. It is fantastic to me to see how the budget declined the writing has skyrocketed. My only complaint on this whole season is Deke to me has been overused as comic relief in the second half and lost some of his charm and savvy to love blind puppy dog.
The best ending for me is the inevitability of the planet being destroyed and that’s how they end infinity war. Fitz is right about the timeline, but Fitz doesn’t have the Time Stone.
Then again maybe I’m reading too much into it and just hoping for a cool crossover. ��
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Last edited by belsarius; 04-21-2018 at 12:42 PM.
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There are persistent rumors that Agents of Shield is being renewed but held close to the vest because of how this season has been written.
The latest new was that it looks like its coming back.
I love your theory by the way, it fits together nicely.
Even to add, if at the end of the season, the aliens seize the Gravitonium, it doesn't take much for Thanos to take it from them without having a AOS presence. They could show up to aid the humans, and Thanos basically takes it as the last stone.
Even the idea of someone using the Time Stone to reverse the destruction of the earth is an awesome way to break the loop of inevitability.
I still expect that in terms of a renewal and the question of Coulson's death.
One of two things could happen.
1) Daisy takes over and Coulson dies, I don't think that will happen because Coulson is a great character, but they're swerving us with him becoming more back ground then foreground.
2) Coulson survives, and leaves shield or he dies and we have another Tahiti but Phil's memory of Shield are erased and he goes to Seattle to be with the Cello player and be a teacher until something happens that makes it necessary to bring him back unwillingly. Seeing Coulson as a boring high school teacher and football coach while feeling that he's more then that would be a cool story line.
I really hope the renewal is true, this show has to me been one of the stronger shows on network TV.
And the cast has been great.
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