Thoughts on Liberal leadership race?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by fanforever1986

I cannot believe how liberal this board is sometimes, its really gross.

Calgary has not, and will not ever benefit from having the libs in power...and how citizens of this city figure they should support that is beyond anything rational

It would be a really boring board if everybody was on the same side and said the same things.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Easy Peter, he's just throwing darts at a board to see if they will stick.

Haha I know. I just put up with this stuff on a daily basis in the classroom.
What do they say? The right thinks and the left feels?

All of the Liberal cheerleaders should check out some of the latest polls.

[mykalberta]

With respect (and this is coming from someone who is as right as you get without being a Nazzi), the polls havent been great for the Conservatives.

They have actually showed the Liberals closing the gap in the new SES polls which are the only reliable polls in Canada.

A counterpoint to the polling numbers are people poll differently than they vote and having CBC making a special event of every Canadian soldier killed doesnt help. Neither does a strong Conservative Environment policy.

MYK

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by fanforever1986

I cannot believe how liberal this board is sometimes, its really gross.

Calgary has not, and will not ever benefit from having the libs in power...and how citizens of this city figure they should support that is beyond anything rational

Maybe they vote as Canadians rather than as Calgarians? There are issues that transcend what is best for one's specific locality, depending on what your priorities are I suppose.

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Maybe they vote as Canadians rather than as Calgarians? There are issues that transcend what is best for one's specific locality, depending on what your priorities are I suppose.

Wow - that is an amazing comment - lemme guess - you have a Pierre Elliot Trudea button in your basement right next to your poster of Jacques Chirac and Gerhard Shroeder hugging right?

Wow - I am at a loss for words.

What issues transcend Canada that isnt good for Calgary but is good for Canada?

Environment? Umm it does affect Calgary but people in Calgary think there is a better way than some Bullshut Euro lovin on an issue they have for purely politcial reasons.

I just wish Harper would transcend his current party's base and announce an immediate 3.5 Billion Environment funding plan with 3 centres of excellence - Edmonton for power fuels, Winnipeg for clean agricultre fuels, and Waterloo for efficient combustion engines and smog. With laws to reduce coal/natural gas emmisions by 20% in 10 years, and have a 10 year plan to get every car in Canada to E85 or higher standards or face serious taxes on basic carbon based fuels. In a perfect Conservative world that would be announced at a joint press conference with the US, Australia, and Japan at a Kyoto conference right in the face of the EU and all their other prima dona BS. Swartzenegger would be there also to call France-Belgium-Germany girly men

That would be a Conservative plan to the Environmental problem - not some one tonne challenge oh we care about the enviro BS that does nothing but sounds good - classic EU politeering.

Just - wow.

MYK

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

I just wish Harper would transcend his current party's base and announce an immediate 3.5 Billion Environment funding plan with 3 centres of excellence - Edmonton for power fuels, Winnipeg for clean agricultre fuels, and Waterloo for efficient combustion engines and smog. With laws to reduce coal/natural gas emmisions by 20% in 10 years, and have a 10 year plan to get every car in Canada to E85 or higher standards or face serious taxes on basic carbon based fuels.

The thing is, the world has to start focusing on zero/low emission power sources, not fuels who's main source still comes out of the ground or a farm. There should be a 10-20 year plan to get every car to become completely free of natural fuels, not just some phased reduction that really doesn't solve the main issue. The plan the Conservatives put forth was an absolute and utter joke.....it came nowhere close to actually taking the bull by the horns and taking charge of the matter.

People have been p*ssy-footing around this issue for so many years now, its ridiculous. We put a frickin' man on the moon in a decade, why the hell can't we actually figure out a way to drive a car without it dumping tons of toxic waste into our systems every year? It can be done (and has been done in the instances of some electric cars that were mysteriously shut down), we just actually have to have the real will to do it.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

Wow - that is an amazing comment - lemme guess - you have a Pierre Elliot Trudea button in your basement right next to your poster of Jacques Chirac and Gerhard Shroeder hugging right?

Wow - I am at a loss for words.

What issues transcend Canada that isnt good for Calgary but is good for Canada?

Environment? Umm it does affect Calgary but people in Calgary think there is a better way than some Bullshut Euro lovin on an issue they have for purely politcial reasons.

I just wish Harper would transcend his current party's base and announce an immediate 3.5 Billion Environment funding plan with 3 centres of excellence - Edmonton for power fuels, Winnipeg for clean agricultre fuels, and Waterloo for efficient combustion engines and smog. With laws to reduce coal/natural gas emmisions by 20% in 10 years, and have a 10 year plan to get every car in Canada to E85 or higher standards or face serious taxes on basic carbon based fuels. In a perfect Conservative world that would be announced at a joint press conference with the US, Australia, and Japan at a Kyoto conference right in the face of the EU and all their other prima dona BS. Swartzenegger would be there also to call France-Belgium-Germany girly men

That would be a Conservative plan to the Environmental problem - not some one tonne challenge oh we care about the enviro BS that does nothing but sounds good - classic EU politeering.

Just - wow.

MYK

I don't really have a clue what you're rambling on about. All I was implying was that what is right and good for Canada is not necessarily EXACTLY what is right and good for Calgary. Is that a totally wrong statement? Whats with all the bs Trudeau talk? You don't know jack about me, so why not settle down and talk rather than flipping out on me. You do Conservatives a disservice by looking like an over-sensitive nut. Relax.

I suppose one easy thing that is good for Canada but bad for Calgary is taxing energy trusts.

Also, why do you feel the need to say your name at the end of your posts? Its right there by your Avatar... seems a little redundant, you're not writing poetry here.

[evman150]

"Et maintenant, le prochaine Premier Ministre du Canada - Stéphane Dion".

Gerard Kennedy was easily the best candidate, but I'm happy with Stéphane Dion winning. A Liberal Party led by Stéphane Dion has the ability to take back Canada for Canada, and end quasi-american rule. That's really all that matters.

I'm looking forward to the next election.

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by fanforever1986

I cannot believe how liberal this board is sometimes, its really gross.

So "not Conservative" = "Liberal"?
I think that is really gross.

A couple other points I noticed: I DID live in Ontario in the Rae years. Yes there was a recession but Rae's attempt to spend his way out of it (much of which was viewed as "payback" to the traditional supporters of the NDP - CAW, OPSEU et al) was a horrible approach and continued to drive Ontario into the debt cesspool started by the Peterson Liberals.

Ralph bucks - I personally think it was a poor decision. It was viewed by many as "found money". It was beneficial for some people, but just a gift to many others. If it was intended to give back to the people who paid the taxes it would have been better served lowering Alberta Health premiums, altering the tax rate or increasing the Alberta basic personal exemption.

Cuba's Health Care - Cuba has a lot of issues but healthcare isn't one of the (relatively speaking). According to the WHO, Cuba ranked 39th in the world (US was 37th, Canada was 30th) and that is easily the best in the Carribbean.

I think PC Leadership received the same type of TV coverage as the Liberals received today. I recall seeing conventions in the past getting similar coverage. The leaders elected by grassroots methods don't seem to be as easy to cover on TV, at least until the results come in. It's one thing for 3200 people to vote 2 or 3 times in a day in one building. Another for a traditional type of vote with different many different locations to report in.

Back to the thread...
Until he shows how he is going to steer the party it is too early for me to guess how he will do in the long term. I didn't really know much about him. I wasn't a fan of Ignatieff (I didn't agree with his stance on Iraq), but I do believe in what we are doing in Afghanistan and based on what someone else said in this thread Dion doesn't. Let's see what happens next.

[Devils'Advocate]

Dion is not against an Afghanistan mission, just against this one.

We should say to NATO, 'Look, we are very willing to work with you, to design something that makes sense, because we don't want to risk the life of our soldiers if we are not making progress'. - Stephane Dion

[FLAMESBURNOIL]

Originally Posted by evman150

"Et maintenant, le prochaine Premier Ministre du Canada - Stéphane Dion".

Gerard Kennedy was easily the best candidate, but I'm happy with Stéphane Dion winning. A Liberal Party led by Stéphane Dion has the ability to take back Canada for Canada, and end quasi-american rule. That's really all that matters.

I'm looking forward to the next election.

So if what we see now is "quasi-american rule" - First off tell me whats wrong with the goverment right now....

Secondly what is canadain rule? Stealing billions of tax payers dollars? Secondly do you pay taxes?

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Dion is not against an Afghanistan mission, just against this one.

We should say to NATO, 'Look, we are very willing to work with you, to design something that makes sense, because we don't want to risk the life of our soldiers if we are not making progress'. - Stephane Dion

We aren't making progress???? Check again Dion.....there are hundreds of thousands of children now going to school because of our mission.....the seeds of democracy are planted......most of Afghanistan is free from the suicide bombing (it's only along the south eastern border with Pakistan that it is really gone to ****). Dion....and a lot of other liberals will only be happy with the mission when people stop getting killed.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by evman150

"
. A Liberal Party led by Stéphane Dion has the ability to take back Canada for Canada, and end quasi-american rule. That's really all that matters.

.

I would love to hear some sort of explanation as to what this means exactly.

Though I highly doubt one is forthcoming because it sounds like nothing more than typical Liberal fearmongering.

Its the thing they are best at. Make stuff up and keep saying it until the message is bought...hook, line and sinker.

[Cheese]

Well tranny heres a few...

The Childcare boondoggle. $100 a month per child under 6. Taxable income.

1% reduction in GST is a joke and does not benefit anyone but the wealthy. Two percent is the same.

Accountability? Havent seen too much of that yet. Seems to be the same grease the pig scenario that was always in place.

Kyoto. The Cons idea is pure rubbish and is worse than Kyoto...not better. Im not a Kyoto proponent, but at least put some teeth into the envirnoment...dont pull out more.

Harpers continual agenda to put a vote to Gay marriage.

The Stronach files. They didnt look too smart calling her stupid. If Belinda was that dumb -- and she was the party’s second most prominent player -- what does that say about the accumulated dullness of the other knives in the Tory drawer?

Accepting the BC Liberal into their fold when they blasted the Liberals for allowing the same thing.

The Hope that the Bloc will continue to prop up his government, as opposed to really working in QC to gain status and votes.

Not a lot of substance in the PMOs office, and continued elbow rubbing with the neo-cons south of the border.

His continued references at end of speeches with ...God Bless <fill in blank>


Theres more...and Im not suggesting that the Liberals were without blame either, however lets not Paint the Tories as something they aint...cuz they aint a heck of a lot better at all. Canadian political parties are stagnant and need a serious slap alongside the head to promote big change. That hasnt happened yet.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Well tranny heres a few...

The Childcare boondoggle. $100 a month per child under 6. Taxable income.

1% reduction in GST is a joke and does not benefit anyone but the wealthy. Two percent is the same.

Accountability? Havent seen too much of that yet. Seems to be the same grease the pig scenario that was always in place.

Kyoto. The Cons idea is pure rubbish and is worse than Kyoto...not better. Im not a Kyoto proponent, but at least put some teeth into the envirnoment...dont pull out more.

Harpers continual agenda to put a vote to Gay marriage.

The Stronach files. They didnt look too smart calling her stupid. If Belinda was that dumb -- and she was the party’s second most prominent player -- what does that say about the accumulated dullness of the other knives in the Tory drawer?

Accepting the BC Liberal into their fold when they blasted the Liberals for allowing the same thing.

The Hope that the Bloc will continue to prop up his government, as opposed to really working in QC to gain status and votes.

Not a lot of substance in the PMOs office, and continued elbow rubbing with the neo-cons south of the border.

His continued references at end of speeches with ...God Bless <fill in blank>


Theres more...and Im not suggesting that the Liberals were without blame either, however lets not Paint the Tories as something they aint...cuz they aint a heck of a lot better at all. Canadian political parties are stagnant and need a serious slap alongside the head to promote big change. That hasnt happened yet.

Lovely...now how does that equate to "quasi-American" rule?

Which was my only question.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Are you for real??? Since when is giving money back to the citizens a boondoggle? It isn't. I guess you are smarter than everyone else and you should be telling people how they should spend their own money. Nice.....real nice.

Again....what the hell are you smoking? Since when is cutting taxes a joke? I for one am tired of paying almost 50% of my money to taxes and will take any cut. Not to mention their plan on reducing taxes in the future.

You haven't seen anything because the Liberal Senators have held it up and made a hundred changes to the original legislation. Go talk to them about it.

At least they are realistic about it instead of telling the entire country that Koyoto is this great idea and we will follow it....then pretty much double the countries CO2 emissions.

It is called democracy....not like the Libs who say YOU MUST VOTE HOW THE PARTY VOTES....not how your constituants want you to vote. Good grief.

Get over it.....where did they call her stupid?

Agree with you on this point.

What?? What issue is it that he needs to have the Bloc prop up the government? The Bloc has not threatened to topple the government. I think you are getting confused with the Martin government.

And here it is.....you cannot have peaceful interaction with the US because if you do then you must be wanting to be like them. Not sure if your aware but the US is our Largest trading partner 85%.....it is a good idea to have good relations with them......not like the Libs who do nothing but call them names.

You are so accepting of other people. How dare he say godbless when the majority of Canadians are Christian.

The CPC is a thousand times better than the previous Martin/Chretien Libs. They keep their promises (other than the Income trust) and have the courage to say what they mean not what people want them to hear.

When people like you write this kind of stuff it makes me really sad and embarrased to be a Canadian.

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

The CPC is a thousand times better than the previous Martin/Chretien Libs. They keep their promises (other than the Income trust) and have the courage to say what they mean not what people want them to hear.

When people like you write this kind of stuff it makes me really sad and embarrased to be a Canadian.

OK, how many lies are they allowed?

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

The CPC is a thousand times better than the previous Martin/Chretien Libs. They keep their promises (other than the Income trust) and have the courage to say what they mean not what people want them to hear.

When people like you write this kind of stuff it makes me really sad and embarrased to be a Canadian.

You and a few thousand Albertans...

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

OK, how many lies are they allowed?

They made a promise they couldn't keep....it was wrong....but it may have also been necessary. When they made that promise they probably didn't realize that every major business in Canada were planning on converting to income trusts.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Cheese

You and a few thousand Albertans...

Try again....last time I looked.....36.3% of Canadians voted for the Conservative Party last election.....