Treliving needs to start feeling the heat - Page 64 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Roof-Daddy · 03-31-2018, 01:23 PM

Some folks need to google the definition of literally.

nik- · 03-31-2018, 01:25 PM

The Flames' highest ever draft pick being used by another team would be such a Calgary Flames moment. Especially combined with our other highest draft pick being nowhere close to living up to expectation.

bigrangy · 03-31-2018, 01:30 PM

What looks stupider?

Trading a ~10% chance at a franchise defenseman for an NHL d-man on a 3 year contract

Or

Trading a franchise centerman for an AHL defenseman that you lost in expansion

One of these is a way worse trade than the other one and I know that the trade that will get chirped more was the least stupid of the two.

This season is the worst

Jeff Lebowski · 03-31-2018, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigrangy

What looks stupider?

Trading a ~10% chance at a franchise defenseman for an NHL d-man on a 3 year contract

Or

Trading a franchise centerman for an AHL defenseman that you lost in expansion

One of these is a way worse trade than the other one and I know that the trade that will get chirped more was the least stupid of the two.

This season is the worst

You just proved Nik's point about comparisons with the oilers. Who cares if it was a less bad move than Chiarellis. It's still a bad move and prevents CGY from improving. (Not a diss on Hamonic the player)

The Flames need to just start making good personnel decisions period.

We should be comparing to successful models and try and match that - not be better then other bad teams.

VladtheImpaler · 03-31-2018, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nik-

The Flames' highest ever draft pick being used by another team would be such a Calgary Flames moment. Especially combined with our other highest draft pick being nowhere close to living up to expectation.

You just know it's happening don't you? Given what the Flames are all about... If the Isles don't draft top 3 with our pick, I may actually start to have hope. I will call it "The Cleveland Browns False Dawn".

MoneyGuy · 03-31-2018, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Some folks need to google the definition of literally.

I was literally thinking the same thing.

VladtheImpaler · 03-31-2018, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

You just proved Nik's point about comparisons with the oilers. Who cares if it was a less bad move then Chiarellis. It's still a bad move and prevents CGY from improving. (Not a diss on Hamonic the player)

The Flames need to just start making good personnel decisions period.

We should be comparing to successful models and try and match that - not be better then other bad teams.

Yeah, no kidding - we made a better move than the Cleveland Browns/Edmonton Oilers - let's hang a banner to commemorate that achievement...

Vinny01 · 03-31-2018, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

And Treliving may have literally traded Rasmus Dahlin for 3 years of Travis Hamonic.

And ROR was an RFA after that, not a UFA.

And a 2013 Flames team with ROR and a healthy Kipper isn't drafting 6th overall.

And no, Feaster isn't a model GM. Steve Yzerman is a model GM. Feaster was just a better management person than Tre and Burke.

RoR was going on waivers he wouldn’t have been a Flame.

Hamilton, Russell, Hudler, Glencross, Stone all good trades by Treliving.

Regehr, Iginla, Bouwmeester, Tanguay all horrible trades by Feaster.

Drafting is about even.

The Iginla and O’Rielly situations made the team a laughing stock. Not something that has occurred under Treliving.

DeluxeMoustache · 03-31-2018, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinny01

The Iginla and O’Rielly situations made the team a laughing stock. Not something that has occurred under Treliving.

Good god, the team is a laughing stock right now, at the very moment you wrote that

TOfan · 03-31-2018, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Good god, the team is a laughing stock right now, at the very moment you wrote that

Why are the Flames a laughing stock? Every year good teams are missing the playoffs. Tampa missed last year. Who's laughing at Colorado these days? Do you think the Flames are set up to be a 'laughing stock' next year?

The margine is razor thin between good and bad teams. Sure the Flames underachieved this year, no one is disputing that but if you can't see the Flames are set up to be a competitive team for the next 5 years, then I question why you are even a fan of the team.

Discussing what they could have or should have been is a fools errand. At this point the discussion should be about next year and how to turn it around. This is a good team that likely only requires a couple moves to bounce back to where they should be.

Missing the playoffs could turn out to be a blessing in disguise.

DeluxeMoustache · 03-31-2018, 02:53 PM

^ It’s not the fact that they lose, it’s how they lose.

Damn right they are a laughingstock right now. Sure, it is fixable. Everything is.
This is not a thin margin season, this is implosion and not giving a crap on the ice.

I’m a fan because I’m invested, have been for years. Have spent much disposable income on seasons tix over the years and I am always optimistic that there is potential for improvement.

But yeah, right now they are a laughingstock.

Jiri Hrdina · 03-31-2018, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

And Treliving may have literally traded Rasmus Dahlin for 3 years of Travis Hamonic.

.

No it is literally impossible to say that he literally did that

Textcritic · 03-31-2018, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

^ It’s not the fact that they lose, it’s how they lose.

Damn right they are a laughingstock right now. Sure, it is fixable. Everything is.
This is not a thin margin season, this is implosion and not giving a crap on the ice.

I’m a fan because I’m invested, have been for years. Have spent tens of thousands on seasons tix over the years and I am always optimistic that there is potential for improvement.

But yeah, right now they are a laughingstock.

It really does not matter how many times you insist upon it, this is simply not true. "Laughingstocks" are teams of historic ineptitude like the Oilers and the TB Lightning gong show prior to Steve Yzerman's arrival. The Flames had a really disappointing season, but are no where near the same territory. This is pure hyperbole.

DeluxeMoustache · 03-31-2018, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Textcritic

It really does not matter how many times you insist upon it, this is simply not true. "Laughingstocks" are teams of historic ineptitude like the Oilers and the TB Lightning gong show prior to Steve Yzerman's arrival. The Flames had a really disappointing season, but are no where near the same territory. This is pure hyperbole.

I don’t believe the word has a minimum time requirement, my friend. Not eons or eras.

Ha! I have a list of people, and not a terribly short one, who are ridiculing the Flames that I should have you reach out to, then, so you can tell them how they are wrong.

nik- · 03-31-2018, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Textcritic

It really does not matter how many times you insist upon it, this is simply not true. "Laughingstocks" are teams of historic ineptitude like the Oilers and the TB Lightning gong show prior to Steve Yzerman's arrival. The Flames had a really disappointing season, but are no where near the same territory. This is pure hyperbole.

The Flames have dozens of disappointing seasons.

Aarongavey · 03-31-2018, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinny01

RoR was going on waivers he wouldn’t have been a Flame.

Hamilton, Russell, Hudler, Glencross, Stone all good trades by Treliving.

Regehr, Iginla, Bouwmeester, Tanguay all horrible trades by Feaster.

Drafting is about even.

The Iginla and O’Rielly situations made the team a laughing stock. Not something that has occurred under Treliving.

Well you have no idea whether O'Reilly would have gone on waivers, NHL never actually ruled on the difference between signing a RFA (O'Reilly) and a UFA (Nabokov).

He traded a guy coming off a 76 point season for a 2nd and a 4th, usually guys like that are worth at least a 1st.

He signed Mason Raymond who produced at about half the PPG rate as Roman Cervanka. Ditto for Brouwer.

He traded a 3rd round pick for Brandon Bollig

He traded a 35th overall pick for one season of Brian Elliott.

He traded a 2nd for Lazar.

He is good at trading Feaster assets (Russell and Hudler) for something as those players appreciated in value.

Over 4 years he has been unable to turn his assets (Raymond, Hillier, Brouwer,Lazar, Bollig) into tradeable assets in non-playoff years. Unfortunately BT is running out of Feaster acquired assets to trade.

jayswin · 03-31-2018, 04:36 PM

The Hudler haul was pretty good considering the season he had leading up to it. Saying "coming off a 76 point season" is pretty disingenuous. He was coming off the current season he was playing in.

It would have been nice to sell Hudler the previous off season as you likely could have got a first and a prospect or decent player, but no GM could have justified selling a 76 point top lline winger with the team coming off a playoff run.

Jaydee · 03-31-2018, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Some folks need to google the definition of literally.

Hackey · 03-31-2018, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayswin

The Hudler haul was pretty good considering the season he had leading up to it. Saying "coming off a 76 point season" is pretty disingenuous. He was coming off the current season he was playing in.

It would have been nice to sell Hudler the previous off season as you likely could have got a first and a prospect or decent player, but no GM could have justified selling a 76 point top lline winger with the team coming off a playoff run.

Hudler trade was great. A 2nd and a 4th for a guy who had 35 points at the trade deadline. Everyone knew he was a small one dimensional player on the decline. That off season the best contract he could get was a one year deal worth 2 million. Played only 32 more games in the NHL.

Anduril · 03-31-2018, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pointman

reading back what Treliving said in the postseason interview a year ago, he clearly thought the the best teams are build around center. He then goes out and stockpiles the D.

The particularly concerning is the quote below, where he said, that he expects young guys in the middle of the ice to grow into key roles. He clearly expected Bennett to blossom into a top-six center this season. The problem is that Bennett is not even a center, but rather an LW. This is just like Feaster signed Cervenka to play center, except that Feaster did not spend 4th overall for it. Treliving was trusted with the highest pick in the Flames history and he couldn't even project, what position his pick will play in the NHL.

"I'll never be convinced that the middle of the ice isn't where the championship teams are built. We're getting there by putting it on the backs of young guys in key roles."

https://www.nhl.com/flames/news/trel...18/c-288977518

Wow, that's quite the stretch you were going for there. A player who has played center all their career, projected to be a potential top 6, if not top line center by almost any scout you could ask being slotted in and given the patience to develop as a center is somehow equivalent as Cervenka who primarily played wing in his professional career?

Say what you want about the lack of proper talent surrounding Bennett on his wings or maybe the excessive patience of leaving him a position where he consistently showed little improvement but that's a silly comparison to make.