Your use of “numpty” to describe firearms owners aside, gun safes aren’t expensive at all, you can get an 8-gun from Canadian Tire for $200, less if you wait for it to go on sale
I disagree with this. The majority of the nation agrees that there needs to be greater regulation on guns.
Then the Democrats need to make gun control/bans the vocal point of their platform come election time. If the majority of people are for it then they should be a shoo-in, at that point they take the moral stand against the NRA and push their legislative changes through. Lead by example.
Nor are they particularly large, considering the amount of space a gun itself takes up.
That being said just having laws around trigger locks and not storing guns loaded or storing ammo nearby would make massive strides in gun related deaths.
As the government decides what constitutes a 'legal' safe they can be very expensive if the that's the point of the law. As they should be frankly, a gun safe should be almost as secure as a real safe and bolted to the floor or wall permantly
No one would be opposed to spending a bunch of money to modernize the background check system to make sure that they are done efficiently, have updated records and actually have the desired result, which is keeping prohibited people from purchasing a firearm. It might be a bit harder, but you could probably also get ammunition subject to a NICS check as well if you could show the system worked well. Modernizing the system could also pave the way for private, in-state sales to be subject to a NICS check as well, closing the "loophole" that exists.
A shall issue licensing system like Canada's would probably take a while longer to implement, but could be done so long as the barriers to entry are not excessive. A starting point for this could be federal level changes to the CCW laws requiring training and demonstrated proficiency and a safety course for first time owners.
This is where there's huge disconnect from what is reasonable and what the NRA pushes for.
The NRA doesn't want to modernize background checks and they push to keep record-keeping archaic. I'd have to find the clip at some time when I'm not on my phone at work, but Last Week Tonight showed a segment about the way background check information is kept...and it's all paper. Microfilm is as advanced as it gets, because the NRA lobbied to get and keep it that way.
The NRA also lobbies to avoid a registry, which would interfere with the other ideas with CCW changes and whatnot. While your ideas make sense, make no mistake, the NRA wants no part of them.
The Following User Says Thank You to wittynickname For This Useful Post:
This is where there's huge disconnect from what is reasonable and what the NRA pushes for.
The NRA doesn't want to modernize background checks and they push to keep record-keeping archaic. I'd have to find the clip at some time when I'm not on my phone at work, but Last Week Tonight showed a segment about the way background check information is kept...and it's all paper. Microfilm is as advanced as it gets, because the NRA lobbied to get and keep it that way.
The NRA also lobbies to avoid a registry, which would interfere with the other ideas with CCW changes and whatnot. While your ideas make sense, make no mistake, the NRA wants no part of them.
In the NRA's perfect world anyone could wander down to the 7/11 and buy an AR15 without any checks what so ever, they see that as their perfect world, unlimited gun ownership and freedom to carry anywhere, except of course at the NRA's meetings and head office, wouldn't want some wack job with a gun turning up there.
The NRA also lobbies to avoid a registry, which would interfere with the other ideas with CCW changes and whatnot. While your ideas make sense, make no mistake, the NRA wants no part of them.
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Lanny_McDonald For This Useful Post:
In the NRA's perfect world anyone could wander down to the 7/11 and buy an AR15 without any checks what so ever, they see that as their perfect world, unlimited gun ownership and freedom to carry anywhere, except of course at the NRA's meetings and head office, wouldn't want some wack job with a gun turning up there.
In their perfect world legislation would be passed that required mandatory gun ownership at age 18, and in the US I honestly think they'd have a better chance of passing that than passing meaningful gun control.
This is where there's huge disconnect from what is reasonable and what the NRA pushes for.
The NRA doesn't want to modernize background checks and they push to keep record-keeping archaic. I'd have to find the clip at some time when I'm not on my phone at work, but Last Week Tonight showed a segment about the way background check information is kept...and it's all paper. Microfilm is as advanced as it gets, because the NRA lobbied to get and keep it that way.
The NRA also lobbies to avoid a registry, which would interfere with the other ideas with CCW changes and whatnot. While your ideas make sense, make no mistake, the NRA wants no part of them.
The National Tracing Center is not allowed to have centralized computer data.
That's been a federal law, thanks to the NRA, since 1986: No searchable database of America's gun owners. So people here have to use paper, sort through enormous stacks of forms and record books that gun stores are required to keep and to eventually turn over to the feds when requested. It's kind of like a library in the old days—but without the card catalog. They can use pictures of paper, like microfilm (they recently got the go-ahead to convert the microfilm to PDFs), as long as the pictures of paper are not searchable. You have to flip through and read. No searching by gun owner. No searching by name.
...which no matter how you feel about guns, we can all agree is ridiculously stupid. How does that even benefit the NRA?
In their perfect world legislation would be passed that required mandatory gun ownership at age 18, and in the US I honestly think they'd have a better chance of passing that than passing meaningful gun control.
18!! what kind of godless commie are you?
The Following User Says Thank You to afc wimbledon For This Useful Post:
...which no matter how you feel about guns, we can all agree is ridiculously stupid. How does that even benefit the NRA?
First they make a list. Then you’re on a list. Then they take your guns. Then you're being forced to wear a dashiki and praying to a nine headed Muslim god.
Gun nuts are notoriously paranoid of government and their reach, hence their need to own a bunch of guns. They don’t care why there’s a list or a registry they just know they want no part of it.
The Following User Says Thank You to ResAlien For This Useful Post:
as hilarious that segment is - the thought that all of those people own (probably a bunch of) guns is not really that hilarious when you think about it.
...which no matter how you feel about guns, we can all agree is ridiculously stupid. How does that even benefit the NRA?
The way it benefits them is that is essentially eliminates a registry, the existence of which wouldn't keep crimes from being committed. Even the LGR in Canada didn't stop the illegal use of guns. Not only that, it was riddled with inaccuracies and excessively expensive for any benefits, real or perceived, that it provided.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wittynickname
This is where there's huge disconnect from what is reasonable and what the NRA pushes for.
The NRA doesn't want to modernize background checks and they push to keep record-keeping archaic. I'd have to find the clip at some time when I'm not on my phone at work, but Last Week Tonight showed a segment about the way background check information is kept...and it's all paper. Microfilm is as advanced as it gets, because the NRA lobbied to get and keep it that way.
The NICS system is separate from the Tracing Center and is electronic, which allows it to be instant. During a background check, the Tracing Center would not be queried, only the NICS system. The updates to the NICS system would be to ensure records are being properly added and collected from submitting agencies, expanding the reliability of the check performed by increasing the amount of data polled. Changing the way the Tracing Center operates (non-electronic records) would require the creation of a gun registry, which they are currently prohibited by law from going. Even then, it would only lead to the original buyer.
Last edited by llwhiteoutll; 03-27-2018 at 03:14 PM.
The way it benefits them is that is essentially eliminates a registry, the existence of which wouldn't keep crimes from being committed. Even the LGR in Canada didn't stop the illegal use of guns. Not only that, it was riddled with inaccuracies and excessively expensive for any benefits, real or perceived, that it provided.
Except that a registry is the way you establish and enforce responsibility. That is the problem with the current system, and the United States in general. There is little to no responsibility for one's actions. If there was a registry for weapons you bought and own, you would be damn certain to show more responsibility over your guns, and make sure you were certain who the weapon was sold to, should you sell the gun. This lack of responsibility mechanism is what allows for the flow of untraceable guns in society.
Quote:
The NICS system is separate from the Tracing Center and is electronic, which allows it to be instant. During a background check, the Tracing Center would not be queried, only the NICS system. The updates to the NICS system would be to ensure records are being properly added and collected from submitting agencies, expanding the reliability of the check performed by increasing the amount of data polled. Changing the way the Tracing Center operates (non-electronic records) would require the creation of a gun registry, which they are currently prohibited by law from going. Even then, it would only lead to the original buyer.
What are you talking about? Tracing a weapon has nothing to do with the background process, and vice versa. A NICS inquiry is basically a check for the existence of federal or state warrant or criminal adjudication against a subject. The NICS query checks the National Crime Information Center (NCIC) and the Interstate Identification Index databases for wants and warrants. The NICS database identifies purchases you have made so it can be established if you are accruing an unreasonably large number of weapons in a short period of time. This is the extent of the background, and is pretty quick to go through. This has nothing to do with establishing a gun registry or collection of the gun ownership details.
The reason the government would like the ownership records digitized is for the investigation of weapons used in a crime, and to establish providence for the location of that weapon. This is all common sense and fully expected with so many other things we own. I don't know why people continue to swallow the garbage the NRA peddles. Read the second amendment. It says nothing the NRA is promoting.
The Following User Says Thank You to Lanny_McDonald For This Useful Post:
Your use of “numpty” to describe firearms owners aside, gun safes aren’t expensive at all, you can get an 8-gun from Canadian Tire for $200, less if you wait for it to go on sale
That's a gun cabinet. Not a safe. Also it's on sale for $124.99 this week at Canadian Tire.
Safes are still pretty crazy expensive.
The Following User Says Thank You to CaramonLS For This Useful Post:
