Bettman: No basis for a Calgary arena deal anytime soon

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Maybe it won't happen under Nenshi's rule but it's going to happen and I sense the Flames owners will simply wait another four years.

Nenshi only has one vote on council.

I think the overwhelming consensus among Calgarians is that, yes, both parties can come to some sort of compromise, but you're not getting the Katz deal.

[Tyler]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Sorry I only partially trust you, if the Flames put the team up, any local ownership group is going to want a even more generous arena offer then the Flames current ownership wants, and a non local group will have an or else clause in their offer to purchase to keep the team in the city.

Going back to that Forbes article, the Flames are not a massive money making organization.

Why does a new owner even need to pay for a new arena? NHL teams aren't massive money making organizations. You make your money when you sell.

A new owner could theoretically buy the team, and then work with a 3rd party to broker a deal where they are simply a tenant.

That's the big wild card with this. Why can't the city or a group like AEG own and operate the arena? I'll tell you why - because the Flames will make less money.

It's very much a possibility, but it's a last resort. Murray Edwards wants to have his cake and eat it too. Financially, I get it. Doesn't have to go down that route though.

Let's not forget that a Dallas businessman just paid hundreds of millions of dollars to own a PIECE of the Carolina Freaking Hurricanes.

If the Flames EVER go up for sale, there will be a laundry list of new money, flush with cash people somewhere in North America who have already been vetted by the league (it's been confirmed that the NHL already has a waiting list), who will willingly buy the team under the auspicious of keeping the team in Calgary.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Tyler

When was the last time a Canadian team's ownership group changed hands?

Very rarely.

Trust me, there is a current lineup to be an NHL owner, and most would step over their own mother to own a Canadian franchise.

Murray Edwards will never sell this team. He's way to proud. People are getting way too bent out of shape about this. This is simply a waiting game.

The Oilers (2008) Leafs (2011) and Habs (2009) had significant ownership changes in the last 10 years. Jets were bought in 2011 as well.

That’s over half the Canadian teams in the last decade. Just saying.

[DJones]

So we just need to find a couple local billionaires willing to blow 1.5 billion dollars on team that makes 20 million in revenues each year.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by DJones

So we just need to find a couple local billionaires willing to blow 1.5 billion dollars on team that makes 20 million in revenues each year.

Wait—what??

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

The Oilers (2008) Leafs (2011) and Habs (2009) had significant ownership changes in the last 10 years. Jets were bought in 2011 as well.



That’s over half the Canadian teams in the last decade. Just saying.

How many ownership changes over that time has resulted in a relocation of a team from Canada to another city?

[DJones]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Wait—what??

800M for the team. 600M for the arena.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by DJones

800M for the team...

Hahaha! No.

Not for a team without a building.

[browna]

Things pick up when the Olympic bid gets decided later in the year.

Then, if they get them (they will if they decide to bid) just like the Saddledome 38 years ago, the Feds and province and COC pick up the portion in dispute.

If they don’t get them, I think Nenshi still wants some sort of tangible legacy and a big east village development will be it...that will be including an arena, and the issue will be back on the table.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Why does a new owner even need to pay for a new arena? NHL teams aren't massive money making organizations. You make your money when you sell.

A new owner could theoretically buy the team, and then work with a 3rd party to broker a deal where they are simply a tenant.

That's the big wild card with this. Why can't the city or a group like AEG own and operate the arena? I'll tell you why - because the Flames will make less money.

It's very much a possibility, but it's a last resort. Murray Edwards wants to have his cake and eat it too. Financially, I get it. Doesn't have to go down that route though.

Let's not forget that a Dallas businessman just paid hundreds of millions of dollars to own a PIECE of the Carolina Freaking Hurricanes.

If the Flames EVER go up for sale, there will be a laundry list of new money, flush with cash people somewhere in North America who have already been vetted by the league (it's been confirmed that the NHL already has a waiting list), who will willingly buy the team under the auspicious of keeping the team in Calgary.

And the part that I don't actually believe is that there will be a condition to keep the team in Calgary without a new building partnership.

And I really don't believe that there would be a lineup of billionaires that would take a run at the Flames without a new building that improves their revenue and profit statements.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Why does a new owner even need to pay for a new arena? NHL teams aren't massive money making organizations. You make your money when you sell.



A new owner could theoretically buy the team, and then work with a 3rd party to broker a deal where they are simply a tenant.



That's the big wild card with this. Why can't the city or a group like AEG own and operate the arena? I'll tell you why - because the Flames will make less money.



It's very much a possibility, but it's a last resort. Murray Edwards wants to have his cake and eat it too. Financially, I get it. Doesn't have to go down that route though.



Let's not forget that a Dallas businessman just paid hundreds of millions of dollars to own a PIECE of the Carolina Freaking Hurricanes.



If the Flames EVER go up for sale, there will be a laundry list of new money, flush with cash people somewhere in North America who have already been vetted by the league (it's been confirmed that the NHL already has a waiting list), who will willingly buy the team under the auspicious of keeping the team in Calgary.

If there were some local investors willing to put up all the private money for an arena, do you really think the city wouldn’t have brought that up by now?

[browna]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

How many ownership changes over that time has resulted in a relocation of a team from Canada to another city?

All those franchises had had built buildings within 10 years of the change of ownership.

Exception being Edmonton and Katz stressed numerous times in his opening presser, which got ignored for a few years as Oiler fans were instead salivating over having an owner to spend to the cap, that it was only going to work for him financially, all nostalgia aside (and we see how much he likes nostalgia) if the community was willing to partner in a new building.

He was not subtle about that from the start and I think the City of Edmonton knew that they were going to be paying a share at the time, because if Katz walked, given previous ownership structure of 28 guys, that the Oilers would be likely gone by now or very soon if he pulled out.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

I think the overwhelming consensus among Calgarians is that, yes, both parties can come to some sort of compromise, but you're not getting the Katz deal.

The Flames aren't even offering the Katz deal... at least Katz committed to building stuff in the CRL zone that would pay property tax. Flames didn't even do that... wrap that around your head folks, the deal that folk point to as the gold standard of bad arena deals was a better deal then the deal that the Flames owners threw a tantrum over not getting.

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Like there's going to be a local ownership group willing to pay $600 million to buy the team and then put up another $500 million for an arena. That's fantasy. The team will need a new building eventually because nobody is going to pay for the team and new arena to keep the team in Calgary. Maybe it won't happen under Nenshi's rule but it's going to happen and I sense the Flames owners will simply wait another four years.

The new ownership does not have to build a new arena, the last two sales(Carolina and Phoenix) were not accompanied by a new arena purchases and nieither of those are particularly impressive setups. The one in Phoenix is in a very bad location and Carolina has never made money in a below average market.

[Corral]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

I fully support Bettman and the owners vs the PA but dear god he is a slime ball. He obviously wants to make the Calgary taxpayers pay thru the nose for the Flames expensive new toy. What a huckster.

I can't understand why any fan would have this position. The players are kids playing their dream who entertain you nightly by doing so. They get paid well because the people they play for demand a high price to sell that entertainment to the masses and sell a whole lot of TV and merchandise. Players were treated like widgets until just a few decades ago.

It's the owners who screw the fans at every corner - every time.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Hahaha! No.

Not for a team without a building.

So it's 600M for an expansion team but an existing team with assets wouldn't get that?

That's US dollars as well

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by Corral

I can't understand why any fan would have this position. The players are kids playing their dream who entertain you nightly by doing so. They get paid well because the people they play for demand a high price to sell that entertainment to the masses and sell a whole lot of TV and merchandise. Players were treated like widgets until just a few decades ago.

It's the owners who screw the fans at every corner - every time.

because the players wanted more than 50% and if there was no hard cap tied to revenue there'd be no Jets. And frankly the Flames would be a farm team for the Leafs/Rangers/Habs.

[Frequitude]

Crossposted from the main thread since we're discussing the interview here:

Maclean erred in his follow up to Bettman's claim that the city's proposal involves the Flames paying for the whole thing.

Instead of asking why that's a problem (it's obvious, arenas aren't a positive investment), he should have asked "Do you believe that property taxes or rent count as funding towards an arena?". Because that's the basis of Bettman's claim.

And then if Bettman said "yes", which he would have to for his claim to be valid, it should have been followed up with "Regular homeowners like your fans have to both build or buy their house and then also pay property taxes on it. Why should team owners be treated differently?"

[getbak]

I've said this before, the city needs to start talking to AEG and Oak View Group about getting them to fund the new arena with private money (like their recent deals in Vegas, Seattle, and Long Island), and we'll see CSEC back at the table pretty quickly.

[Corral]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

because the players wanted more than 50% and if there was no hard cap tied to revenue there'd be no Jets. And frankly the Flames would be a farm team for the Leafs/Rangers/Habs.

Spoken like Gary himself - you keep telling yourself the owners are looking out for the good citizens of Winnipeg or Calgary. Uncle Gary's subtle threats to Calgary today (like always) show me all I need to know about who's side he is on.