[PGT] Flames 5 Oilers 7

[TheFlamesVan]

Tomorrow's game can't come fast enough.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by TheFlamesVan

Tomorrow's game can't come fast enough.

Philly has lost 10 in a row, if we lose to them the pitchforks and torches will reach Simpsonian levels.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Here's a picture of last night's action at the Saddledome.

[CaptainCrunch]

You know, I get that people are upset at GG, and that's fine he deserves some of the ire that's sent his way.

But honestly people that think that coaches have to stand up at the start of the game and make grand motivational speeches to get players fired up to go out on the ice are following a fictional narrative.

This is called professional hockey for a reason, these are professional players that are lavishly played and coddled, they are peak athletes and they shouldn't need a coach to do the motivating. So when are we going to start criticizing the players and taking them to task for coming out soft and playing brain dead hockey. When are we going to start calling out the leadership core of this team, you know the guys that need to set the pace, and either lead by example or lead by doing.

Because I'm not seeing a lot of that this year.

And no I don't believe that GG's system includes terrible pinch choices and decisions that led to 5 breakaways.

But while its fine to complain about this coach and that's fine, this is the same leadership group that were extremely happy to see Hartley get fired because he was a hard a$$ and he was too hard on the players and too demanding.

They wanted this kind of coach, they wanted that systems guy, player coach, buddy cop Captain coach.

The leaders and veterans on this team need to eat a big poop sandwich for this loss, because frankly they shouldn't need a coach to make a rousing speech to get the players ready for the Battle of Alberta.

I'm almost more disgusted with the players then the coach for their soft starts.

[kevman]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I don't know about the rest of you but I am really getting tired of this team being a constant and consistent source of disappointment in my life.

No matter what, for the last 30 years they always find a way to be a pathetic failure. This year so far is really taking the cake though.

The way they played after game 20 last year, add Hamonic, career years from the top line so far and actual above average goaltending, yet they still fumble#### their way to sad pathetic mediocre disappointing results.

Sometimes I wonder why I keep following sports at all.

For what it's worth it helps to walk away from CP.

Last nights game sucked. Full on. But this place is a cesspool of negativity at the moment. If your bummed, there is nothing positive to take from a bunch of pitchfork wielding posters. I always look for the positives, that's why I checked in today. Turns out there isn't any. No need to dwell. Tomorrow is a new day and a new game. Come back after they win and enjoy sports again.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

I can't recall a game where Gulutzan used a timeout to change the momentum in a game. I'm curious as to whether he likes saving timeouts for video reviews or just doesn't believe in that kind of intervention. I wish the media would ask him that.

In his post game he was asked about the nervousness, how to address it and he said you have to talk about it put it on the table. I guess that means during practice and video - not in game.

I feel like I have to repeat this but I'm not on the fire Gulutzan train. I do want to know what the coach can/will do during games to counter bad situaitons ie tactically or motivationally. Or does he not believe he can do those things in the heat of battle, meaning he needs the video for teaching moments.

Maybe he is a bit too cerebral and he needs a little more visceral in the moment gut action.

I'm upset at the entire organization for:

-not addressing the season long inconsistency
-seemingly not having answers for the problems plaguing the team
-not communicating that here is what's wrong, here's what were doing about it
-overall stubborness
-no damn leadership. no accountability

I don't get the sense that this organization hates to lose. I'm sure they want to win but there is a difference.

Couldn't agree more with this statement.

[CroFlames]

I am pissed off. I tried cooling off for a couple days, but I am still pissed off.

I'm officially on the fire GG bandwagon. At the very least, a new coach will jolt this team and that might be good enough. This is a skilled team, they CAN win a division and go deep in the playoffs.

Can Lindy Ruff do worse that GG? I'm certain he won't be worse.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Philly has lost 10 in a row, if we lose to them the pitchforks and torches will reach Simpsonian levels.

I would have to avoid CP for a few days.

[Ashasx]

It's frustrating that the list of coaches available is rather terrible. I think Ruff is one of the most underperforming coaches in modern NHL history and want no part of him.

Darryl really is by far the best available, and that's even if he wants to coach again.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

It's frustrating that the list of coaches available is rather terrible. I think Ruff is one of the most underperforming coaches in modern NHL history and want no part of him.

Darryl really is by far the best available, and that's even if he wants to coach again.

He's 5th all time in wins.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

He's 5th all time in wins.

well I don't want to make this a Lindy Ruff thread, but he also has coached the 4th highest amount of games, so that makes sense.

[foshizzle11]

So, I stayed away from CP yesterday after that loss. I turned off the game after the 2nd period. I couldn't believe my eyes. What we all witnesses was just the luckiest game for the Oilers and the worst luck for the Flames. We made some mistakes, yes, but seriously. Some of those goals and stupid/little mistakes shouldn't have lead to a 6-1 lead for that crapshoot of a hockey team.

I am disappointed but I don't think we should be blaming GG for this. The players have to have that desire to come out and play, to show that they care and can get up for games on their own. We aren't in pee wee hockey here, why is this so hard?

Line combos and rolling 4 lines is starting to get annoying, that is something that I don't like and I think GG needs to start adjusting to during the game. Why excuse for ever having our bottom pair with the 4th line, ever.

Forget about Saturday night as a lucky/crappy win for the Oilers and get on a roll. Smith needs to play better, he wasn't great on Saturday like we know he can be. Or maybe give Rittich the start tonight, he didn't look all that bad minus the Maroon gaff.

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

You know, I get that people are upset at GG, and that's fine he deserves some of the ire that's sent his way.

But honestly people that think that coaches have to stand up at the start of the game and make grand motivational speeches to get players fired up to go out on the ice are following a fictional narrative.

This is called professional hockey for a reason, these are professional players that are lavishly played and coddled, they are peak athletes and they shouldn't need a coach to do the motivating. So when are we going to start criticizing the players and taking them to task for coming out soft and playing brain dead hockey. When are we going to start calling out the leadership core of this team, you know the guys that need to set the pace, and either lead by example or lead by doing.

Because I'm not seeing a lot of that this year.

And no I don't believe that GG's system includes terrible pinch choices and decisions that led to 5 breakaways.

But while its fine to complain about this coach and that's fine, this is the same leadership group that were extremely happy to see Hartley get fired because he was a hard a$$ and he was too hard on the players and too demanding.

They wanted this kind of coach, they wanted that systems guy, player coach, buddy cop Captain coach.

The leaders and veterans on this team need to eat a big poop sandwich for this loss, because frankly they shouldn't need a coach to make a rousing speech to get the players ready for the Battle of Alberta.

I'm almost more disgusted with the players then the coach for their soft starts.

I don't expect a grand motivational speech every game, but maybe some form of emotion could help.

Also, I think not being ready is on the systems side of the game. Why can we not adjust our system against the Oilers to employ more forechecking on a pathetic d core? Why can we not pressure more in the neutral zone to slow opposing teams down?

I firmly believe he reason we see bad pinches so frequently is the players know if the puck gets across he offensive blue line GG's ultra passive system means the other team is walking it right into our end. This forces players to push harder in the offensive zone.

Babcock talked about howuch video he watched of Gaudreau to try and figure out how to shut him down. He adjusted his system according to what he saw, and guess what? It worked. GG's "one size fits all" approach to coaching is the epitome of basing your game plan entirely on theory and ignoring real world realities.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

You know, I get that people are upset at GG, and that's fine he deserves some of the ire that's sent his way.

But honestly people that think that coaches have to stand up at the start of the game and make grand motivational speeches to get players fired up to go out on the ice are following a fictional narrative.

I think what people are getting mixed up is the fire and brimstone, paint peeling motivator (I think guys like Tortarella fit this) and the master manipulator (Think Scotty Bowman) style coaches. You don't need to yell and scream to motivate professionals. You DO however need to find their buttons, and push it from time to time. That is what separates the good from the great IMO.

I don't know where the quote was, but I think it was Amonte or Roenick (maybe even Suter) that told a story about how when Sutter coached in Chicago. They were having a bad game, and Sutter grabbed one of their sticks, grabbed a pen, and wrote "work" across the blade and handed it back. No words, no speeches, no yelling; just a small message saying you were taking a night off and it wasn't acceptable. THAT is what a guy like Sutter does, and that's why players play for him. He finds what motivates the individual player, and exposes it.

I just don't see GG being that type of coach.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

I think what people are getting mixed up is the fire and brimstone, paint peeling motivator (I think guys like Tortarella fit this) and the master manipulator (Think Scotty Bowman) style coaches. You don't need to yell and scream to motivate professionals. You DO however need to find their buttons, and push it from time to time. That is what separates the good from the great IMO.

I don't know where the quote was, but I think it was Amonte or Roenick (maybe even Suter) that told a story about how when Sutter coached in Chicago. They were having a bad game, and Sutter grabbed one of their sticks, grabbed a pen, and wrote "work" across the blade and handed it back. No words, no speeches, no yelling; just a small message saying you were taking a night off and it wasn't acceptable. THAT is what a guy like Sutter does, and that's why players play for him. He finds what motivates the individual player, and exposes it.

I just don't see GG being that type of coach.

If it was Amonte it didn't work.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

Babcock talked about howuch video he watched of Gaudreau to try and figure out how to shut him down. He adjusted his system according to what he saw, and guess what? It worked. GG's "one size fits all" approach to coaching is the epitome of basing your game plan entirely on theory and ignoring real world realities.

You really don't think they don't watch video or game plan?

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by Wild GM

You really don't think they don't watch video or game plan?

I don't think they adjust their game plan one little bit based on the strengths and weaknesses of the team they are playing. I'm sure they watch video and say "player X likes to shoot", but they sure don't look at the opposing team video and devise a game plan to counter their strengths. Under GG this team plays one way, and that's the only way to play, and it doesn't matter who the other team is, that's how you play.

Just like his absurd obsession with R-L defense pairings. If it doesn't work it doesn't work.

[Igottago]

Its not about movie style speeches but it is about knowing what makes your team tick and how to get the best out of each individual. Its about understanding the right balance between incentive and punishment to optimize performance. Its about creating team cohesion, and managing emotions. This is literally the same thing for any team based environment, whether its on the ice or in the board room. Just because these guys are professionals doesn't mean they are always 100% on, just like any human being. That's why you have people appointed to positions of leadership, to manage that. No team in any industry is just 100% self directed. To say the coach has no impact on motivation is just false. The coach is the de-facto leader of the team.

[Red]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

I think what people are getting mixed up is the fire and brimstone, paint peeling motivator (I think guys like Tortarella fit this) and the master manipulator (Think Scotty Bowman) style coaches. You don't need to yell and scream to motivate professionals. You DO however need to find their buttons, and push it from time to time. That is what separates the good from the great IMO.

I don't know where the quote was, but I think it was Amonte or Roenick (maybe even Suter) that told a story about how when Sutter coached in Chicago. They were having a bad game, and Sutter grabbed one of their sticks, grabbed a pen, and wrote "work" across the blade and handed it back. No words, no speeches, no yelling; just a small message saying you were taking a night off and it wasn't acceptable. THAT is what a guy like Sutter does, and that's why players play for him. He finds what motivates the individual player, and exposes it.

I just don't see GG being that type of coach.

I remember one time the Flames were down 3-0 to Minnesota at home . After the 2nd period Sutter didn't even go to the dressing room to talk to them. Didn't give them the the of day...flames won that game. At the time Minnesota was undefeated after leading into the 3rd period.

Sutter was a great coach here.

[Calgary4LIfe]

My favorite Darryl Sutter story was the one that Conroy shared. Apparently him and Iginla were having an awful night, and in the middle of the third period, they found themselves on the bench. Sutter was at the opposite end of the bench, but yelled towards them saying something like: "Don't you two princesses worry about breaking into a sweat. You two can just sit there and enjoy watching the game.", and proceeded to bench them for the rest of the night.