The trials and tribulations of Glen Gulutzan

[Resolute 14]

Four years ago we had Wideman, Russell, Butler and Smid. We've replaced them with Hamonic, Stone, Hamilton and Kulak since. If the players are better skilled, then the GM has done his part. So who's left to blame for being unable to fit the pieces together?

[rubecube]

I'm not an advanced stats guy but Brodie looks like he's regressed each of the past two seasons under GG.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by stone hands

This team has had the exact same leaky defence for the last 4 years. This isn’t a new or gg specific problem. The flames have really creative, offensive defensemen who really lack defensive responsibility. That’s all there is to it. Top defence core on paper sounds nice, but when they are a top defence core because of their offence and not their defence thenyoure going to have an almost never ending problem keeping pucks out of your net without stellar goaltending - which has been exactly the case. How many times over the last few years have awful goaltenders problems been exacerbated by totally porous defense?

I was going to say this. The opinions (and they aren't crazy) that Calgary's D is great is not based on their defensive abilities - it's based on the ability to move the puck and contribute offensively.

Can this change? Sure. I think Hamilton has the makings of a really good defender. He has the size, reach and skating to do so. He just needs to learn it better. Hamonic is pretty good now, but has to play with Brodie, which is hard (Warrener said its a really difficult job to play with a guy like Brodie - it's easier, he said, to play with Wideman). Stone is physical sometimes, but not stellar defensively. I think Kulak could be good, like Hamilton, with seasoning and instruction.

Perhaps the Flames could do with a really top notch defence coach. I'm not even sure who it is now - Jerrard?

[Jay Random]

Also, let's not forget that defence isn't just about the six guys on the blue line. It takes a long time for forwards to learn sound defensive play, which is why most coaches like to lean hard on their veterans to protect a lead. The Flames have a young forward group, with seven of the currently dressed 12 aged 25 or under. It's easy to blame defencemen (or the coach) for gaffes in their own zone, but a lot of those situations wouldn't arise if the forwards had the experience and know-how to get the job done further up the ice.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I was going to say this. The opinions (and they aren't crazy) that Calgary's D is great is not based on their defensive abilities - it's based on the ability to move the puck and contribute offensively.

Can this change? Sure. I think Hamilton has the makings of a really good defender. He has the size, reach and skating to do so. He just needs to learn it better. Hamonic is pretty good now, but has to play with Brodie, which is hard (Warrener said its a really difficult job to play with a guy like Brodie - it's easier, he said, to play with Wideman). Stone is physical sometimes, but not stellar defensively. I think Kulak could be good, like Hamilton, with seasoning and instruction.

Perhaps the Flames could do with a really top notch defence coach. I'm not even sure who it is now - Jerrard?

Yeah Warrener said some interesting things today. Said when paired with a new defender he knew right away if it was going to work because you either clicked or your didn't and time wouldn't change that. Brodie and Wideman never clicked and things never improved but Brodie and Stone formed a decent pairing right away. It's looking like Brodie/Hamonic simply isn't going to work and playing them together for an entire season is likely going to lead to unfulfilled potential of the talent on the blue line. Unfortunately Gulutzan is probably the most stubborn head coach in the NHL so I feel this discussion is going to go long into the season.

[memphusk]

He's no good.

[Pipty]

Gg=ng?

[home_sweet_dome]

Originally Posted by Red Slinger

Aren't "overacheived" and "underacheived" subjective terms and therefore unable to be considered FACT?

Technically yes but a reasonable person applying sound logic would conclude those Dallas teams didn't meet expectations and underachieved.

Similarly if i said going into this season that the Flames should give up more goals than they score and end up with 91 points based on their roster and their GM trading the 1st rounder in the summer, any logical person would say that would be a very disappointing season and a definite underachievement. Through 18 games that's exactly what they've been.

The only year that's really debatable is last season but if at the start of the year you told me the Flames would make the playoffs as a wildcard team and get swept in the 1st round, all while suffering very little in the way of significant injuries, i'd still say that was disappointing based on the roster and classify it as a slight underachievement.

No matter how you slice it, none of his teams have over-achieved or come close to it.

So you can nit-pick and drink the kool-aid or bury your head in the sand all you want, but the 234 game sample size doesn't lie...Gulutzan is no good.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I'm not an advanced stats guy but Brodie looks like he's regressed each of the past two seasons under GG.

He looked good with Stone last season.

[dirk diggler]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

There's no excuse for a team with this defensive personnel to play as poor defensively as the Flames do. Absolutely no excuse. There's no way teams like the Canucks and Oilers should have better GAA and defensive stats than the Flames when you compare the rosters. I don't know how anyone can argue that this team isn't underachieving. Can you say with a straight face it's not realistic to expect better play out of this defense than the Oilers or Canucks?

funny you say that, i checked the goals against today thinking the exact same thing. we all are quick to say the Oilers have a weak d and they do but when this team is supposedly built as a strong defensive team and they give up the goals they do, you really have to question what is wrong. too often out there, they look confused. as for GG, get over the whole left/right shot pairing obsession and play the guys with the guys they play well with. Hamonic/Brodie doesnt work. but i have to question a guy who allows Brouwer to wear the "A".

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by dirk diggler

funny you say that, i checked the goals against today thinking the exact same thing. we all are quick to say the Oilers have a weak d and they do but when this team is supposedly built as a strong defensive team and they give up the goals they do, you really have to question what is wrong. too often out there, they look confused. as for GG, get over the whole left/right shot pairing obsession and play the guys with the guys they play well with. Hamonic/Brodie doesnt work. but i have to question a guy who allows Brouwer to wear the "A".

Just put Brodie back with Giordano. Great pairing. Hamilton with Stone or Hamonic, maybe some chemistry is there.

[Stay Golden]

Not sure if this is entirely Gulutzen's game plan on D, Cameron or Jerrard but collectively they are all part of building and maintain it. I have never been a fan of giving up your own blue line and collapsing the middle. It is a horrible strategy Smith has had to face the second most shots so far this season in entire league. This is a direct result of this type of game plan.
The Flames the worst PK % in the league, the very worst and probably for the same reason. Letting teams gain the zone easily and choosing to defend and their strategy to keep everything on the outside. As we have seen time and time again eventually this pk breaks down. Meanwhile Smith continues to get shelled with shots. Gulutzen is the HC he has final say on what system is in place and how they practice it. He has final say in what lines are out who is together and which D are paired up.
The real truth is Smith has had to stand on his head and be the MVP almost every game. Smith covers up a lot of system and execution problems on this team.
As for Gultzen I see too many times especially while at games that as a HC, MIA behind the bench and with refs. He needs to assert himself more.

[Draug]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Do you not see the difference between a winning streak, which usually shows consistent good play and "a loss" which is the world's smallest sample size?

If the team generally is playing poorly despite having good players, that's on the coach at any time. But the Flames have generally played very sound hockey this year. They have special teams holes and individuals sometimes, being human, have bad games. This last game was a snowball effect of numerous catastrophic errors combined with a lack (heh) of incredible saves. Had the Flames been rewarded after a pretty good start I think they win that game. The same team, however, played an incredibly good game just prior to that one.

And there is where I completely disagree. Of our 10 wins, I give Smith credit for a majority of them. Of our 8 losses, I blame the goaltending on a minority of them. Basically, I think goaltending had covered up for the team not playing sound hockey.

[Resolute 14]

It says a fair amount that, in order to claim the Flames have played well, one has to separate and trivialize the areas were we are exceedingly poor.

[Backlunds_socks]

Originally Posted by Dion

He looked good with Stone last season.

Looking good and being a top player in the NHL are two different things.


Remember Brodano, Brodie was hailed as jesus himself.

[Robbob]

I still think it is ridiculously hasty to make any change. With all the "faults" and missteps the team is currently in a playoff spot and only 4 points from the division lead. It has always been a marathon and not a sprint. Making rash decisions early helps no one.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yeah Warrener said some interesting things today. Said when paired with a new defender he knew right away if it was going to work because you either clicked or your didn't and time wouldn't change that. Brodie and Wideman never clicked and things never improved but Brodie and Stone formed a decent pairing right away. It's looking like Brodie/Hamonic simply isn't going to work and playing them together for an entire season is likely going to lead to unfulfilled potential of the talent on the blue line. Unfortunately Gulutzan is probably the most stubborn head coach in the NHL so I feel this discussion is going to go long into the season.

That isn't always the case. Chemistry can be built over time. Just look at how long it took for Giordano and Hamilton to become good together.

[stone hands]

Originally Posted by Backlunds_socks

Looking good and being a top player in the NHL are two different things.


Remember Brodano, Brodie was hailed as jesus himself.

when brodano was a thing, brodie was bar none the best player on the flames and pretty much jesus

when gio went down everyone though this team was dead in the water but brodie kept the train going

i hate to speculate but i wonder how much of his decline has to do with his SO having ms. he has not been anywhere near the same player since she was diagnosed, its pretty night and day

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by stone hands

when brodano was a thing, brodie was bar none the best player on the flames and pretty much jesus

when gio went down everyone though this team was dead in the water but brodie kept the train going

i hate to speculate but i wonder how much of his decline has to do with his SO having ms. he has not been anywhere near the same player since she was diagnosed, its pretty night and day

I'd like the coaching staff to put him back on the right side of the ice, to eliminate that as a possibility of his regression.

Also, take him off the powerplay for awhile. Let him focus on 5v5 minutes.

These are easy things to try and nowhere close to rash decisions.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by stone hands

when brodano was a thing, brodie was bar none the best player on the flames and pretty much jesus

when gio went down everyone though this team was dead in the water but brodie kept the train going

i hate to speculate but i wonder how much of his decline has to do with his SO having ms. he has not been anywhere near the same player since she was diagnosed, its pretty night and day

The day his 'decline' started was the day GG decided that left/right pairing absolutely had to be a thing. Brodie played RD his entire NHL career prior to that. When he got the full time gig with the Flames, Hartley lamented how Brodie had no idea how could he could be. During the early years of the rebuild, he was getting better and better every game.

I don't doubt his wife's diagnosis had an effect on him. But IMO the day his troubles started was the day he got shifted over to the left side simply because that's how he shot. Having Wideman as his partner didn't help of course.

I'm a patient guy and don't really get into the fire GG debate. But the one thing that drives me nuts about the coach is this LD/RD thing he has going on. Brodie on the RD was a top 20 D. A legit top pairing player. Brodie on the LD is a shell of his former self. He makes boneheaded plays that he simply never used to do. How many giveaways does he make a game now? He RARELY used to make those mistakes. Now it's a daily thing. Players aren't supposed to get worse in their primes years. Sadly, that is happening to Brodie.

Yes he has gotten better since Wideman left, there's no denying that. But no one can argue he's close to where he was previously. Even though Gio and Hamilton was a top pairing last season, I would still argue that Brodano was even better then them.

I hated how they got broken up, and I hate the LD/RD thing. Chemistry will always, 100% of the time triumph, over having players play a position simply because of how they hold their stick.