Stony Nakoda want to rename all the things

[GGG]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Yeah this is currently what happens in much of new Brunswick (at least years ago when I lived there it did).

I am not sure how prevalent the speaking for Cree is within the Nakoda First Nation.

Probably none as they are part of the Sioux and not the Cree (I think)

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

This is why I said "traditional name for the area".

How traditional is it when it's written in Latin script?

[JohnnyB]

Pretty rapid turn towards 'us' vs. 'them' for a lot of posters in this thread. Don't know exactly who this 'us' is supposed to be.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by GGG

Probably none as they are part of the Sioux and not the Cree (I think)

Thanks

The First Nations argue the English or Cree names given to many of these places have failed to reflect their specific Indigenous history.

The Stoney Nations, descendants of the Sioux, include three bands with the largest reserve west of Calgary.

[getbak]

Calgary was the overlapping territory of the Nakota (Stoney), Tsuut’ina (Sarcee), Siksika (Blackfoot), and Ktunaxa (Kootenay) peoples. Each of them have their own unrelated languages.

Even if we did start renaming things with their traditional names, which language should we use?


One thought I did have recently: Instead of Reconciliation Bridge, they should rename the Langevin Bridge with some kind of traditional name (like the Tsuut’ina name for the Bow River).

[SebC]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

Pretty rapid turn towards 'us' vs. 'them' for a lot of posters in this thread. Don't know exactly who this 'us' is supposed to be.

It's pretty easy to figure out since 'us' and 'them' are legally defined. Until there isn't seperate legal status it's always going to be an "'us' vs. 'them'" situation. If we want to eliminate racism we need to eliminate racist policies.

[icecube]

Canada seems to have blinders on for their own racism towards First Nations.

Replace First Nations with African American and see how comments like "get over it" would fly. People down in the U.S
who do that are rightly looked at as ignorant rednecks.Their nonsense is rightly slogged off as moronic oversimplicity and bigotry.

The average Canadian has a lot to learn about the history of colonialism and race relations in this country. The Indian act, policies of starvation, residential schools, broken treaty promises and on and on.

It wouldn't matter what cultural ethnic background a person is from,if they and their ancestors had hundreds of years of ongoing racist government policies stacked against them you can bet they would be in the same damn boat as many of Canada's indigenous peoples are in today: marginalization and impoverishment.

How can people expect a complete turnaround in one or two generations? Colonization is still ongoing in this country. Kids on reserve receive 1/3 less funding for education than any other child in this country. We know the living conditions of some of these places.
The constitution states that Canada is responsible for "Indians and lands reserved for Indians" and yet what is done to fix stuff like this?

How much is the land and resources of Canada worth? A lot of this territory was never ceded to Canada, it is lands held in trust. How many Billions of dollars would that land be worth I wonder? Trillions perhaps? Maybe we could start by using some of it to help those who are the worst off.

The fact that many FN were able to find success in mainstream society is commendable despite the deck stacked against them. I personally know a First Nations family who raised a doctor, lawyer and social worker while many of their siblings struggled with addictions issues. They wouldn't even be able to tell you how they were able to find resiliency while other family members struggled. They would probably tell you it had very little to do with just working harder and pulling themselves up by the bootstraps. Life is a lot more complicated than that.

The fact that some were able to keep their cultural traditions and language intact despite a century of policies that attempted to extinguish their cultural identity is a minor miracle.

CBC ended up closing the comment section for Indgenous issues because of the endless stream of colonial bullcrap coming out of ignorant people's mouths.

It just goes to show how far we have to go to improve education on these matters. I suggest people start by learning about the truth and reconciliation commission and the calls to action. Another thorough document is the Royal Commission on Aborignal Peoples.

They contain good ideas on how to move forward and fix the wrongdoings of the past.

None of the ideas within say "get over it and join mainstream society".

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by SebC

It's pretty easy to figure out since 'us' and 'them' are legally defined. Until there isn't seperate legal status it's always going to be an "'us' vs. 'them'" situation. If we want to eliminate racism we need to eliminate racist policies.

Conversely, people could just stop being racist and looking at it as us vs them. Not to say the two cannot be unlinked, but there isn’t a link for a lot of people, “we” have a brutal reputation for our treatment (both historically and currently) of aboriginal people. A lot of people express negative views of them or see them only in the negative.

The push to rectify poor treatment of Canadian aboriginals shouldn’t create an us vs. them ideology, it should help us recognise our own shortcomings and better respond to things like this instead of defaulting to the Canadian racist standard “haven’t we done enough for those people?” They’re Canadians, and until we recognise that making amends for something you’ve done wrong isn’t but the same as giving someon preferential treatment, we can’t move forward.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Aleks

The only people left making poor decisions are the Aboriginal themselves. And I'm not saying assimilate, that's the word you chose to use, I said integrate, inject themselves into alongside, not all out conform to. Their choice to remain completely atypical of everyone else is holding them back, and it's being done at the blame of the rest of us, instead of accounting for their own well being

Well, that isn’t true, to think everyone but aboriginals are in the clear is misguided. You didn’t say assimilate, but you did say join “majority society.” I hate to break it to you, but “inject themselves into alongside”? Yeah, that’s what this is. It’s time we stopped seeing aboriginal people as “outside” society and started recognising that their way of life is a part of our society already.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Well, that isn’t true, to think everyone but aboriginals are in the clear is misguided. You didn’t say assimilate, but you did say join “majority society.” I hate to break it to you, but “inject themselves into alongside”? Yeah, that’s what this is. It’s time we stopped seeing aboriginal people as “outside” society and started recognising that their way of life is a part of our society already.

It is physically outside of our society.....

[Aleks]

Originally Posted by Fire

With how PC everybody is nowadays I wouldn't be surprised if this was seriously considered.

This board especially. Sensitivities abound!

Originally Posted by GGG

A lot of this lack of integration is the fault of the Indian act. They have no ability to control what happens on their land. The federal government has to approve all deals they are not allowed to sell or develop it without federal approval. The election process, on reserve taxation, etc are all controlled by the federal government.

Eliminating the Indian act and treating the Native bands as independent agencies responsible for their own people with only grants given by the federal government in accordance with our commitments with the English versions of the treaties. Push as much governance onto the bands as possible. There will be corruption and waste and suffering but it will ensure that these people have the ability to control their own path forward.

Great! Eliminate it and also stop the handouts. We never had handouts when we came here. I sure as #### got to where I am with my own hard work and determination. I know they can too. No more tax breaks, no more rules for them and rules for us, no more paid education, no more reparation style payments. Its not working, just stop it.

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

Pretty rapid turn towards 'us' vs. 'them' for a lot of posters in this thread. Don't know exactly who this 'us' is supposed to be.

Yah.....see:

Originally Posted by SebC

It's pretty easy to figure out since 'us' and 'them' are legally defined. Until there isn't seperate legal status it's always going to be an "'us' vs. 'them'" situation. If we want to eliminate racism we need to eliminate racist policies.

Its clear the definition is provided for us. You're status or you're not. And being status affords you many many benefits which intended to be constructive and helpful, but in turn are abused and contribute to the habitual victim card, how do you turn that tap off?

Originally Posted by icecube

Canada seems to have blinders on for their own racism towards First Nations.

Replace First Nations with African American and see how comments like "get over it" would fly. People down in the U.S
who do that are rightly looked at as ignorant rednecks.Their nonsense is rightly slogged off as moronic oversimplicity and bigotry.

The average Canadian has a lot to learn about the history of colonialism and race relations in this country. The Indian act, policies of starvation, residential schools, broken treaty promises and on and on.

It wouldn't matter what cultural ethnic background a person is from,if they and their ancestors had hundreds of years of ongoing racist government policies stacked against them you can bet they would be in the same damn boat as many of Canada's indigenous peoples are in today: marginalization and impoverishment.

How can people expect a complete turnaround in one or two generations? Colonization is still ongoing in this country. Kids on reserve receive 1/3 less funding for education than any other child in this country. We know the living conditions of some of these places.
The constitution states that Canada is responsible for "Indians and lands reserved for Indians" and yet what is done to fix stuff like this?

How much is the land and resources of Canada worth? A lot of this territory was never ceded to Canada, it is lands held in trust. How many Billions of dollars would that land be worth I wonder? Trillions perhaps? Maybe we could start by using some of it to help those who are the worst off.

The fact that many FN were able to find success in mainstream society is commendable despite the deck stacked against them. I personally know a First Nations family who raised a doctor, lawyer and social worker while many of their siblings struggled with addictions issues. They wouldn't even be able to tell you how they were able to find resiliency while other family members struggled. They would probably tell you it had very little to do with just working harder and pulling themselves up by the bootstraps. Life is a lot more complicated than that.

The fact that some were able to keep their cultural traditions and language intact despite a century of policies that attempted to extinguish their cultural identity is a minor miracle.

CBC ended up closing the comment section for Indgenous issues because of the endless stream of colonial bullcrap coming out of ignorant people's mouths.

It just goes to show how far we have to go to improve education on these matters. I suggest people start by learning about the truth and reconciliation commission and the calls to action. Another thorough document is the Royal Commission on Aborignal Peoples.

They contain good ideas on how to move forward and fix the wrongdoings of the past.

None of the ideas within say "get over it and join mainstream society".

There is zero argument that there are some very sad and tragic scenarios in some very remote and even some not so remote areas. I only ask at what point is there going to be some self accountability with these groups? I ask that because again, I work, I'm educated, I pay my share of taxes, I receive no handouts. I've had numerous FN colleagues, also successful, smart, fantastic people. I don't think the argument or the issue is the potential of the groups we are talking about, its about making the change to shift the responsibility onto themselves. Its about not catering to every request because we are afraid we might be viewed as racist. Its about not trapping them in a society of handouts and special treatment. Its about empowering them with the same tools everyone else uses to empower themselves, self respect.

Of course there's stigma, of course there's people conditioned to have a single opinion of any native individual they see (and I assure you, much of it is well earned courtesy of the very visible minority). I don't think your comparison of african americans is correct, they are very much a part of every day functional visible society. The problem with the FN groups is they still remain outside of that, many by choice (the culture conservation facet, or even those afraid to leave the reserve), as a result of reservations. That's the reason I was saying adapting in majority society (#### assimilation if thats what you guys think, thats not it at all). I can maintain my identity just fine, and respectfully while just being a person here in the city. Any articulate, educated, hard working individual should be equal in every way regardless of heritage, so once they can accept that and not play bias steps can be taken and culture will change and be accepting.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by icecube

Canada seems to have blinders on for their own racism towards First Nations.

Replace First Nations with African American and see how comments like "get over it" would fly. People down in the U.S
who do that are rightly looked at as ignorant rednecks.Their nonsense is rightly slogged off as moronic oversimplicity and bigotry.

The average Canadian has a lot to learn about the history of colonialism and race relations in this country. The Indian act, policies of starvation, residential schools, broken treaty promises and on and on.

It wouldn't matter what cultural ethnic background a person is from,if they and their ancestors had hundreds of years of ongoing racist government policies stacked against them you can bet they would be in the same damn boat as many of Canada's indigenous peoples are in today: marginalization and impoverishment.

How can people expect a complete turnaround in one or two generations? Colonization is still ongoing in this country. Kids on reserve receive 1/3 less funding for education than any other child in this country. We know the living conditions of some of these places.
The constitution states that Canada is responsible for "Indians and lands reserved for Indians" and yet what is done to fix stuff like this?

How much is the land and resources of Canada worth? A lot of this territory was never ceded to Canada, it is lands held in trust. How many Billions of dollars would that land be worth I wonder? Trillions perhaps? Maybe we could start by using some of it to help those who are the worst off.

The fact that many FN were able to find success in mainstream society is commendable despite the deck stacked against them. I personally know a First Nations family who raised a doctor, lawyer and social worker while many of their siblings struggled with addictions issues. They wouldn't even be able to tell you how they were able to find resiliency while other family members struggled. They would probably tell you it had very little to do with just working harder and pulling themselves up by the bootstraps. Life is a lot more complicated than that.

The fact that some were able to keep their cultural traditions and language intact despite a century of policies that attempted to extinguish their cultural identity is a minor miracle.

CBC ended up closing the comment section for Indgenous issues because of the endless stream of colonial bullcrap coming out of ignorant people's mouths.

It just goes to show how far we have to go to improve education on these matters. I suggest people start by learning about the truth and reconciliation commission and the calls to action. Another thorough document is the Royal Commission on Aborignal Peoples.

They contain good ideas on how to move forward and fix the wrongdoings of the past.

None of the ideas within say "get over it and join mainstream society".

To be colonial don't you have to profit in some way from the people being colonized? Your post is just buzzword city, the only racists in this debate are the people who are perfectly happy to keep throwing money at reserves so the people there can languish in third world conditions.

[OutOfTheCube]

Maybe we would've kept the native names if they weren't all overly long and dumb-sounding.

[flamesfan1297]

Originally Posted by Aleks

The only people left making poor decisions are the Aboriginal themselves. And I'm not saying assimilate, that's the word you chose to use, I said integrate, inject themselves into alongside, not all out conform to. Their choice to remain completely atypical of everyone else is holding them back, and it's being done at the blame of the rest of us, instead of accounting for their own well being

Agreed with this. The reserve system is what's holding them back, if they truly want to to better for themselves then they should get rid of the reserve system IMO. it's only alienating them more from society, and I don't believe that it helps keep their culture intact.

At what point is it their responsibility to take action for themselves? It's a little tiresome when everytime they ask for something we give it to them, for a fear of being called a racist otherwise. Enough of the handouts.

This renaming thing seems like a publicity stunt to me.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by flamesfan1297

Agreed with this. The reserve system is what's holding them back, if they truly want to to better for themselves then they should get rid of the reserve system IMO. it's only alienating them more from society, and I don't believe that it helps keep their culture intact.

At what point is it their responsibility to take action for themselves? It's a little tiresome when everytime they ask for something we give it to them, for a fear of being called a racist otherwise. Enough of the handouts.

This renaming thing seems like a publicity stunt to me.

They aren't handouts, they are ongoing payments under the obligations of treaty 7. At a minimum the Canadian government needs to live up to the English language requirements of treaty 7

https://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/11.../1100100028803

The reserve system is built by the White Man. It is codified in the Indian Act. Going to back to the Treaty's as the basis of policy would be a first step.

Also the historical interpretation of the treaty is a fantastic read.

http://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/110.../1100100028791

[JohnnyB]

Can't say I see myself as part of an 'us' that stands in some sort of oppositional relationship with the first nations. Certainly not an 'us' that would make comments like this:

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Maybe we would've kept the native names if they weren't all overly long and dumb-sounding.

unless this is intended as some ironic mockery of bigotry, in which case I would laugh.

[llwhiteoutll]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Maybe we would've kept the native names if they weren't all overly long and dumb-sounding.

What was the original native name for Calgary? What about Canmore?

[FireGilbert]

Re-naming towns and cities founded by Europeans is silly however I do not have a problem with re-naming or having dual names for things like mountains and lakes that are sacred to the Natives and were already named prior to European settlement.

For example when I was recently in Banff I learned that Tunnel Mountain is called Sleeping Buffalo Mountain in the local language. Considering there is no tunnel through the mountain and it does kind of look like a sleeping buffalo a name change would be appropriate despite all the new signage required.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by GGG

They aren't handouts, they are ongoing payments under the obligations of treaty 7. At a minimum the Canadian government needs to live up to the English language requirements of treaty 7

https://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/11.../1100100028803

The reserve system is built by the White Man. It is codified in the Indian Act. Going to back to the Treaty's as the basis of policy would be a first step.

Also the historical interpretation of the treaty is a fantastic read.

http://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/110.../1100100028791

Her Majesty also agrees that next year, and annually afterwards forever, she will cause to be paid to the said Indians, in cash, at suitable places and dates, of which the said Indians shall be duly notified, to each Chief, twenty-five dollars, each minor Chief or Councillor (not exceeding fifteen minor Chiefs to the Blackfeet and Blood Indians, and four to the Piegan and Sarcee Bands, and five Councillors to the Stony Indian Bands), fifteen dollars, and to every other Indian of whatever age, five dollars; the same, unless there be some exceptional reason, to be paid to the heads of families for those belonging thereto.

I'll assume they weren't told about this thing called inflation, or they may never have a agreed to it.

[driveway]

At first I wasn't really sure how I felt about this idea. Then I read through this thread and discovered it both angers and outs racists, so now I'm pretty cool with it.