[PGT] Canucks 5 Flames 3

[Flames_Gimp]

not calling the automatic slashing penalty that would have given the flames a long 5 on 3 at the beginning of the 3rd was the turning point imo

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

not calling the automatic slashing penalty that would have given the flames a long 5 on 3 at the beginning of the 3rd was the turning point imo

Really? You sure it wasn't the turnover by Tkachuk? Or the lazy and dumb play by Brodie on the pk? Or the fact nobody decided to cover for a pinching Kulak?

The refs missed a lot on the Flames as well. Gio alone got away with 2 or 3 clear penalties. This game wasn't lost because of reffing.

[JFK]

Why gotta argue with everyone.

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by BigFlameDog

I just don't get this. How do you know he has no passion? Just because he doesn't act like an a-hole on the bench? He should be screaming at refs? Maybe smacking helmets on the bench?

Pretty sure the guy is passionate about his dream NHL coaching job. Once of 31 jobs like it in the world and all that.

Because they don't come out with extra jump or fire like they have in past years when they were the cardiac kids. There is a clear difference in desperation when they are behind this year than in years past and he usually responds to being down by throwing out the 4th line instead of going with his offensive horses to get the goal back.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Last night was more of the same problem that has plagued this team under Gulutzan: We're too easy to beat. People looking for a meaningless moral victory will point to our Corsi domination, but that lacks any value when you look at how this team repeatedly gave Vancouver easy goals via stupid play. I guess that was something of a departure from our usual stupid and uninspired play that has told the story of most of the rest of our losses this year.

Like we always do under Gulutzan, we started the game chasing the opponent. And like we so often do, we ended it with a whimper. Everybody knew the game was over the second we gifted Vancouver those two third period goals. The middle part would have been alright if not for the fact that Brodie especially turned into a gibbering idiot at the worst possible time.

I notice a stark contrast between Harltley and Gulutzan in that when the Flames were down in 3rd period he would shorten the bench to the point the 4th line would be lucky to see a shift in the 3rd period. This resulted in a lot of comebacks and 3rd period scoring as he had his best players out as much as possible. In the same situation Gulutzan just keeps rolling the lines often having 4th liners playing late into the 3rd period and the result is that the Flames often lose with a whimper when facing a deficit in the 3rd period. I find his methodology infuriatingly frustrating at times.

[calgaryblood]

Did you also notice how we were down going into the third more often than under Gulutzan? Surely since Hartley is such a superb coach that managed the lines so well we would have been blowing out teams and not having to come back so often.

Gulutzan makes questionable decisions but let's not pretend Hartley was much better.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I notice a stark contrast between Harltley and Gulutzan in that when the Flames were down in 3rd period he would shorten the bench to the point the 4th line would be lucky to see a shift in the 3rd period. This resulted in a lot of comebacks and 3rd period scoring as he had his best players out as much as possible. In the same situation Gulutzan just keeps rolling the lines often having 4th liners playing late into the 3rd period and the result is that the Flames often lose with a whimper when facing a deficit in the 3rd period. I find his methodology infuriatingly frustrating at times.

I definitely agree with this. I have read it on a few games that GG was looking for SOMEONE to make a difference - and had no problem with the strategy.

But Gaudreau and Jankowski were two very dangerous players last night. There were multiple times I noticed neither of those guys on the ice for far too long a stretch considering we needed 2.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Did you also notice how we were down going into the third more often than under Gulutzan? Surely since Hartley is such a superb coach that managed the lines so well we would have been blowing out teams and not having to come back so often.

Gulutzan makes questionable decisions but let's not pretend Hartley was much better.

Lets also not pretend that someone actually stated that. I don't believe Hartley was a better coach but I'm not sure if Gulutzan is amounting to much of an upgrade.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Lets also not pretend that someone actually stated that.

But you know someone was thinking it.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

But you know someone was thinking it.

Well yeah there's a few posters that probably think Hartley was better but it's never been me as I was never a big fan of his.

[Flames_Gimp]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Really? You sure it wasn't the turnover by Tkachuk? Or the lazy and dumb play by Brodie on the pk? Or the fact nobody decided to cover for a pinching Kulak?

The refs missed a lot on the Flames as well. Gio alone got away with 2 or 3 clear penalties. This game wasn't lost because of reffing.

lol

[JJFlash]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Well yeah there's a few posters that probably think Hartley was better but it's never been me as I was never a big fan of his.

Hartley was not the coach to get us to the next level but he had the team playing exciting hockey. GG does not appear to be the coach to get us to the next level and he has had much more talent to work with.

GG has a propensity to make questionable decisions that lack basic tactical understanding. I think GG eventually gets it right but it is about 3 weeks After the average CP poster had already figured it out. He clearly is not frequenting the site enough.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I notice a stark contrast between Harltley and Gulutzan in that when the Flames were down in 3rd period he would shorten the bench to the point the 4th line would be lucky to see a shift in the 3rd period. This resulted in a lot of comebacks and 3rd period scoring as he had his best players out as much as possible. In the same situation Gulutzan just keeps rolling the lines often having 4th liners playing late into the 3rd period and the result is that the Flames often lose with a whimper when facing a deficit in the 3rd period. I find his methodology infuriatingly frustrating at times.

The use of the 4th line has been puzzling.

You want to put your young guys in positions to use their skills and grow with the game through these opportunities. How does that happen with a 4th line that is neither going to showcase any above average skills, speed or even grow beyond those average skills. What about the guys with speed, skill and youthful stamina? If I recall, Hartley talked about pushing young guys and playing them a lot to showcase their talents and said something about using this approach when he coached with the Avalanche.

[Gaskal]

One thing that Hartley was very good at was when to do the goalie switch. Many times it woke the team up, the guy coming in played out of his mind and we were able to comeback and win.

Gulutzan does not utilize this at all. Usually he doesn't go with a goalie yank unless it's far too late where the game is unsalvageable (the Ottawa blowout). Glen is good at a lot of things but I really wish he'd add this to his repetoire as Hartley has proven that it can win you a freaking elimination game in the playoffs. Bob would have likely given the thumb to Smith after the shorthanded goal and who knows... but I bet it would have at the very least given the team some jump, which is why he did it.

[BigFlameDog]

Originally Posted by Psytic

Because they don't come out with extra jump or fire like they have in past years when they were the cardiac kids. There is a clear difference in desperation when they are behind this year than in years past and he usually responds to being down by throwing out the 4th line instead of going with his offensive horses to get the goal back.

And? What does that have to do with HIS passion?

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by BigFlameDog

And? What does that have to do with HIS passion?

Well there is one of two conclusions we can draw:

A. He has no passion and thus his team does not have the fire and will to come back from a deficit like they have in years past

B. He does have the passion but is an ineffective motivator and thus his team does not have the fire and will to come back from a deficit

I'm sure he is a good systems guy but we need someone who can motivate them as well. I almost think we should of kept Hartley and GG on together. They would make up for each others flaws.

[heep223]

The Flames dominated the canucks last night but couldn’t score when it counted. The canucks scored on every chance they had.

That’s pretty much it.

[icarus]

Originally Posted by heep223

The Flames dominated the canucks last night but couldn’t score when it counted. The canucks scored on every chance they had.

That’s pretty much it.

And they could score when it didn't count.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[The Familia]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

This is not at all what I was implying, and you damn well know it. You will notice that I have not called out the several other posters in this thread for their over-the-top complaints, and the reason for that is that I also see them in the FOI on at least a semi-regular basis—with numerous points to make about more than just their irrational hatred for the Flames' coach or specific players.

Here is the thing: since this is a fan forum all sorts of emotions surrounding the Flames are going to be escalated—we get that. But if all a poster ever does is whine, it is going to get noticed. Without balancing that out in discussions about hockey, about individual players, about the day-to-day goings on of the team you can be sure that the nature of a poster's contributions are going to get noticed. You will see by just a quick perusal of the PGTs and other threads that there are PLENTY of highly critical posters with LOTS of fair criticism of players and coaches—we are not asking for members to be cheerleaders. But if all you have to offer is complaints? Well, then I think it is fair for us to wonder about your motivations for posting in the FOI.

[/I]
Well, since I am a moderator it is kind of my job to, you know—"moderate."

And seriously? It takes all of a couple mouse-clicks to see anyone's recent post history. You posted in celebration in the Anaheim PGT. Prior to that you openly hoped for the Flames to move to Seattle after their opening night loss. But since then the Flames have won six games, and your only three other contributions in the FOI in that time are gripes about the team.

Like I said, this is certainly your right, but given the trend I think it is more than fair for others of us to openly question your motivation in the absence of any actual constructive conversation.

Well I never realized people could get so worked up over an internet message board. I’ve been on this site since 2003 and longer then most. I was never the biggest poster around but contributed more frequently back in the day. Times change and I no longer have the time or desire to post on here.

Perhaps I’ve become more cynical, but as I look back I’ve realized this team has given me one truly joyful season in my entire life. One magical run in 2004. Other then that it has been disappointment, mediocrity, and downright ####. So forgive me if I have become jaded with this team, these overpaid players, and this corrupt league. The product no longer matches the price of admission. Perhaps that is the stem from my negative comments.

With that said, obviously this site means the world to you since you have dedicated a large portion of your life to moderate it, so I will remove myself from the FOI forum. I won’t clutter up your board. My only posts will be my weekly CFL picks going forward. Go Flames!

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

It actually does make sense when you consider how bad the Sedins have been this year. That was Henrik Sedin's first goal of the season and just his 5th point. They're basically the 3rd line for Vancouver now. If the 4th line can't handle those guys at this point in their career, then they all need to be benched.

They simply did not perform to a reasonable expectation for the 4th line. You don't have to create offense, but you have to take care of your own zone. They failed miserably because nobody covered on Kulak's pinch, which I'm sure he was given the green light to do in order to get back in the game.

Context, understanding, reasonability. If you have those you can see that Gulutzan didn't want to waste his best players on covering the Sedins. Backlund's line shut down the Horvat line most of the night quite well. Perhaps he could have utilized the 3rd line, but I would think that the veterans on the 4th line know what their job is at that point in the game and they've defended against offensive players before last night.

Second guess it if you must, find fault if you must, criticize if you must, but at least put some thought into it other than just "Gulutzan = bad".

Yes, the Sedins have been bad this year.

But the bolded comments perfectly illustrate my frustration with Gulutzan on that sequence...

The game was in Calgary. Gulutzan had the last change. It's his choice how to dictate the matchups and the game strategy. So what is his mindset?

With the Sedins standing at centre, and the Canucks having just scored a go-ahead goal in the middle of the third period in a game that the Flames have dominated, Gulutzan has a choice: he can throw out the 1st line and try to recapture the momentum, or he can take the defensive approach, and send out the fourth line, (assumingly) thinking that they can handle the Sedins.

It's all about mindset. And I am increasingly finding that Gulutzan's mindset is defensive and reactionary.