Arena negotiation discussion. UPD: Flames release their proposal

[GreatWhiteEbola]

Originally Posted by Par

Let's just pray that Nenshi loses the elections.

Nice edit... not fast enough though.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Par

Let's just pray that Nenshi loses the elections.

Good edit, you've been spreading Muslim hate on here for too long, you should be smart enough to not have to post it and then re-think it. Brutal.

Let's just pray that Nenshi loses the elections but with the Muslims(they are a lot of them here, thanks to Nenshi), he will likely win(just pray to Jesus that he does not win.)

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Par

Let's just pray that Nenshi loses the elections.

Why? All I've seen out of Nenshi lately is a politician refusing to bend backwards and not allowing some very wealthy people to significantly add to their bank accounts with money coming from the pockets of taxpayers. That's the kind of man that I'd want representing myself in city hall.

Edit: holy crap, jayswin, that's what Par originally posted? I'd be surprised, but that's really Par for the course with him.

[dammage79]

Ooooh, thats a paddlin.

[robaur]

Originally Posted by Par

Let's just pray that Nenshi loses the elections but with the Muslims(they are a lot of them here, thanks to Nenshi), he will likely win(just pray to Jesus that he does not win.).

This poster should be banned. That's terrible.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by robaur

This poster should be banned. That's terrible.

Reported.

[Hockeyguy15]

Pretty sure guys like MMF or peter have been banned for less than what Par said.

I would be surprised if he was around for long.

Edit: And he's gone. That was record time!

[GGG]

If the CESC built the arena by themselves and CSEC Arena Corp charged a ticket tax to pay for the arena and the Flames charged the regular ticket price would people argue that the CSEC did not fund the whole building?

Yes it isn't 1:1 increase as people will be willing to pay more if they believe it's part of paying for the building but that is marketing. It doesn't change that all ticket revenue is the CESCs revenue and any disbursements whatever you call them are the Flames contributions

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

The public knows this now, who would vote for Smith and CalgaryNext?

I would!

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Pretty sure guys like MMF or peter have been banned for less than what Par said.

I would be surprised if he was around for long.

Edit: And he's gone. That was record time!

I hadn't noticed MMF got banned. That comment by Par was disgraceful, glad to see him gone now.

[Manhattanboy]

Wondering if the end game is a CalgaryNEXT type facility (perhaps separate structures) in Victoria Park.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by mccalgary71

Of course it cuts into Flames revenue. When setting prices they have to take the tax into account when figuring out how high the market will pay. Cone on. Common sense.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

That is an "opportunity cost" then. It's not "their money" - and they have no guarantee that the price they set is a price that fans will pay.

ie $200 for a ticket + $20 facility fee = happy fan
but $220 ticket = unhappy fan

Just like we're all grumpy to pay GST (try living in BC where you have to pay PST on a **used** vehicle as well) - we accept that is the cost of doing business. Does it stop us? Not much. But an absolute increase in price of a particular good or service might. (Cigarettes are an example - steep price rise has contributed to a decline in smoking.)

It's not Flames money - but it "might be" money they could otherwise charge. "Might be" is a long way from "is".

[CaramonLS]

Just got around to watching that hot mess of a press conference. King came off as smug, arrogant and completely out of touch. His comments about how if it was really about money, they would have been gone a long time ago certainly left a bad taste. Between his smirks, ridiculous and condescending body language - the entire package was revolting. King is definitely trying to paint this as some brain child of Nenshi (not council) and I think this is going to back fire.

If anything, I think that this is going to galvanize people into supporting Nenshi for standing up to the big, bad CESC.

Not quite sure why King decided not to release the CESC proposal in his press conference, has it not been written up yet? Did they spill something on their napkins they were on? Is it being dressed up for the public? This just continues to feed into the narrative that this group just isn't prepared at all.

Kudos to the few reporters that did their job in that press conference. The others know where their bread is buttered and didn't ask much of substance.

[smiggy77]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

That is an "opportunity cost" then. It's not "their money" - and they have no guarantee that the price they set is a price that fans will pay.

ie $200 for a ticket + $20 facility fee = happy fan
but $220 ticket = unhappy fan

Just like we're all grumpy to pay GST (try living in BC where you have to pay PST on a **used** vehicle as well) - we accept that is the cost of doing business. Does it stop us? Not much. But an absolute increase in price of a particular good or service might. (Cigarettes are an example - steep price rise has contributed to a decline in smoking.)

It's not Flames money - but it "might be" money they could otherwise charge. "Might be" is a long way from "is".

Agreed that the wording KK used was poor, but it's a legitimate point.

To a diehard fan, maybe they look at the price as $200 plus $20 ticket tax for the new arena. To the general consumer, They're paying $220 for the ticket, simple as that.

If $200 is the tipping point for maximizing sales, the Flames have to drop their price down to $180 to accommodate the $20 cuz the fee won't change (unless it is a percentage based, but still a percentage that the Flames do not take, but need to account for when pricing).

One thing people are forgetting is that at the same time, the Flames will need to come up with their $185mil also, primarily from ticket revenue as well, requiring them to have to bump up their price. If the tipping point is still the $200 to sell the ticket, they will have to cut their share of the price, hence reducing their revenue.

This of it like this. Property tax goes up for a local downtown restaurant. Carbon tax get's implemented as well. The restaurant have two options to absorb this increase, either by reducing their revenue or by increasing the price of their food.

If their food gets too expensive and people decide they don't want to eat there anymore, they'll lose revenue. If they drop their price too much, they won't make money or even won't be able to cover their cost and make no margin on their business. The diehards may accept the extra charges because they really like the food the restaurant is spitting out, but unfortunately, the restaurant needs to plan to what the general consumer would pay for, not for the few that will pay the premium.

[jayswin]

Gotta love Rick Bell and the Calgary Sun in their not so subtle quest to get Nenshi out. The front page of the Sun today was a big picture of Nenshi and King, highlighting the battle.

Their Nenshi picture is their typical angle where his face looks as big as possible and he's angry and in the middle of a heated debate and King is this perfect, smiling photo where he's likely hamming it up with media he trusts.

Just so Calgary Sun. At least they don't even try to hide it, I guess.

[Bunk]

How about a poll in a new thread based on the past week:

Who is winning the PR battle:

Ken King & The Flames
Naheed Nenshi & The City of Calgary

I'd be curious.

When CSEC proposal becomes more clear - a poll on the two proposals thus far.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Bunk

How about a poll in a new thread based on the past week:

Who is winning the PR battle:

Ken King & The Flames
Naheed Nenshi & The City of Calgary

I'd be curious.

When CSEC proposal becomes more clear - a poll on the two proposals thus far.

That would be decent, but a little too obvious, imo. Even huge supporters of the Flames owners like Bingo are admitting the Flames are handling this poorly from a PR standpoint.

I think the most informative poll would be this:

1. I support the Flames in this negotiation

2. I support the City in this negotiation

3. I support the City in this negotiation, but changed my position from supporting the Flames

4. I support the Flames in this negotiation, but changed my position from supporting the City



It still doesn't factor in everything but gives a clear indication of where people sit. I'd be really interested to see how may fall into number 3.

[Bunk]

I'd be more interested to see that poll after more is known about the Flames' proposal.

Either way.

Originally Posted by jayswin

That would be decent, but a little too obvious, imo. Even huge supporters of the Flames owners like Bingo are admitting the Flames are handling this poorly from a PR standpoint.

I think the most informative poll would be this:

1. I support the Flames in this negotiation

2. I support the City in this negotiation

3. I support the City in this negotiation, but changed my position from supporting the Flames

4. I support the Flames in this negotiation, but changed my position from supporting the City



It still doesn't factor in everything but gives a clear indication of where people sit.

[CaramonLS]

The only poll we've had on this topic has been a poorly worded one, designed to solicit a specific reaction. As much as I'd like to see the sentiment here, I wouldn't hold your breath on getting one.

[GGG]

I really like the first question of who is winning he PR battle because it measures a shift of opinion rather than just opinion.

And once the flames offer is on the table you can ask the other question.