[News] Ken King: Flames' owners no longer pursuing new arena with City of Calgary

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Krynn

I was in Edmonton for the UFC event and It kills me to say this that arena is amazing.

Don't worry about this aspect; any future arena in Calgary will be better than Edmonton's. They watched the whole process so that they could do it even better when it was our turn.

One of the ideas that I heard was putting a bar IN the Jumbotron, with a glass floor so that people could watch the game from a new perspective. That's just the tip of the iceberg, too.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

It is hard to listen to.

I wouldn't mind hearing what the sentiment is on this board, if we could get a properly worded poll, that would be appreciated.

Maybe make it simple, Nenshi's vision or King/Flames.

That would be a terrible poll, because in all likelihood, neither is anywhere close to what will be a final deal

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Bunk

- I'd lay out the deal they were prepared to offer - hmmmm, I bet it's something like 1/3 public contribution through land and CRL, 1/3 ticket tax, 1/3 direct owner's contrtibution. That's the obvious sweet spot for a fair deal.

Is that what was actually offered?
It would be useful to know what the city has offered and what the Flames are asking.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Muta

Don't worry about this aspect; any future arena in Calgary will be better than Edmonton's. They watched the whole process so that they could do it even better when it was our turn.

One of the ideas that I heard was putting a bar IN the Jumbotron, with a glass floor so that people could watch the game from a new perspective. That's just the tip of the iceberg, too.

When does that part start?

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Table 5

The thing that pisses me off about this whole thing, is that Ken King and the ownership group, with their incompetence, arrogance, and passive aggressive threats, have made me really start detesting the Flames organization. I can't believe I'm basically cheering against a team that I've been following since childhood.

I strongly doubt this would've been the case if Hotchkiss was still around.

I find it hard to believe that a group so arrogant and out of touch could possibly be capable of managing to build a complex project like an arena. It really is embarrassing that we have an ownership group that needs the city to hold their hand.

[Ozy_Flame]

To be fair, there was an NBA exhibition game in Calgary two years ago and some event the University of C that the NBA monitored to test market feasibility. It's not totally outlandish.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Is that what was actually offered?
It would be useful to know what the city has offered and what the Flames are asking.

So far as I know, the City hasn't offered anything at all, except the proposed land swap with the Stampede Board. Even that just opens up a possible building site in Victoria Park; I haven't seen any definite indication that the City would sell that land to CSEC, once acquired, for less than market value.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

To be fair, there was an NBA exhibition game in Calgary two years ago and some event the University of C that the NBA monitored to test market feasibility. It's not totally outlandish.

It is totally outlandish.

[Scooter]

How about Ken King for mayor

[Lord Carnage]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

LOL!

Why should Nenshi want to get something done? His position has been consistent. No public dollars for no public benefit.

God, this is just manically crazy at this point. It's like a cold shower. "If Nenshi had wanted to get something done." LOLOLOLOL! He's not the one asking the flames for money to build an arena!

...

Boy - between you and Da Chief we certainly have the insanity covered...

In this case - humorously enough - yes. Nenshi is telling them to pay for his arena/vision. I'm sure he tells himself something like this...

"I have a dream... a dream where I will have this great legacy of an East Village Entertainment district."

"And at the heart of that district, I will have the Flames pay for an arena where I want them to put it, and it will be the cornerstone of the district, and legacy, and all will praise my name..." Blah blah...

Now, would this be the better or right solution? Could well be - but he is negotiating in as bad faith as King/Edwards... he just has the "public money" argument to alter public perception.


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[Robo]

Jesus can we get a fire ken king chant on the first home game of regular season this is just embarrassing now

[DJones]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Probably what the City's accountants are saying too.

Ya probably. The NHL is not an overly profitable business compared to the expected costs.

I think it's good for a city but a lot of those benefits are intangible and very difficult to put a number too. So it's up to the city to decide how much it's worth but for the owners it's strictly a business decision.

I just don't see it ending well if people's expectations are for the owners to dump a lot of money into a bad investment

[GullFoss]

Originally Posted by SeeGeeWhy

Flames for Amazon HQ2?

i would trade the flames to seattle for amazon hq2

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So far as I know, the City hasn't offered anything at all, except the proposed land swap with the Stampede Board. Even that just opens up a possible building site in Victoria Park; I haven't seen any definite indication that the City would sell that land to CSEC, once acquired, for less than market value.

I'm assuming that the city recognized that CSEC didn't want to own the land, as per the CalgaryNEXT proposal. No sale of the land to CSEC would be required.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by DJones

Ya probably. The NHL is not an overly profitable business compared to the expected costs.

I've said it before, but the NHL needs to build infrastructure costs into its operations. The salary cap should not be 70 million if they need public financing to be viable. It should be 50 million, so each team can put away 20 million every year and have the option to build a new arena every 2-3 decades.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Lord Carnage

Boy - between you and Da Chief we certainly have the insanity covered...

In this case - humorously enough - yes. Nenshi is telling them to pay for his arena/vision. I'm sure he tells himself something like this...

"I have a dream... a dream where I will have this great legacy of an East Village Entertainment district."

"And at the heart of that district, I will have the Flames pay for an arena where I want them to put it, and it will be the cornerstone of the district, and legacy, and all will praise my name..." Blah blah...

Now, would this be the better or right solution? Could well be - but he is negotiating in as bad faith as King/Edwards... he just has the "public money" argument to alter public perception.


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Nenshi's vision for an entertainment district should be exactly what CSEC wants.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

I'm assuming that the city recognized that CSEC didn't want to own the land, as per the CalgaryNEXT proposal. No sale of the land to CSEC would be required.

No, but when the City responded to the CalgaryNEXT proposal, I believe part of their criticism was that CSEC wanted to occupy the land for nothing, and that the value of that should be included as part of the cost. So if Mr. Nenshi really means it about no public funding, he'll at least insist that CSEC pay a market-value rent for the building site.

[bob-loblaw]

There's probably quite a few NHL franchises that would love to be located in Calgary instead of where they are now. They'd love to actually be profitable.
If the owners thought that the city would want to negotiate a deal right before an election then I'm amazed at their stupidity. They talk about an arena for a decade and then try to hijack an election while using their own charity event as conduit to do it.
I love hockey, the Flames, and I love living in Calgary. I support some type of reasonable financial support for a new arena because there are some unmeasurable public benefits that do come from amateur and pro sports. But the way they decided to announce this is just dumb and I resent them thinking that they can make me vote for someone who is friendlier to them.
If they feel that an arena deal is worth debating in an election then at least tell us what they want in terms of a financial commitment and be open about it like any decent corporate citizen should.

[LouCypher]

All I have to say is this: Why create such a horrible distraction just before the season is starting up. Front office works most of the off season to get ready. Players train most of the off season to get ready. Fans talk about the team every single day in anticipation for what could be an exciting summer. Owners and city play politics as a big FU to the fans and all those with the Flames who are working to put a competative team on the ice. I might be generalizing a bit here but it's really a great way to piss off all those who are dedicated to the Flames whether they are part of the team or us fans who support them everyday.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by Table 5

I've said it before, but the NHL needs to build infrastructure costs into its operations. The salary cap should not be 70 million if they need public financing to be viable. It should be 50 million, so each team can put away 20 million every year and have the option to build a new arena every 2-3 decades.

Ya that would probably be the smart thing to do. How long of a lockout would that lead too though.