[News] Dreger: Still sizable gap between Bennett and Flames

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

I wonder what the difference in the gap is. If I had to guess I'd say the Flames are offering $2.25 max and Bennett wants close to $3.5-$4 million.

I really don't think Treliving budges. Everyone can say not to over react but if this situation was happening in Edmonton we'd be giddy at the situation.

This isn't just posturing from the agent, this is a significant gap that needs to be closed. Whatever the gap is, im sure Treliving is in the right as Bennett has done nothing in the league to have the ball in his court. Frankly he doesn't deserve more than Ferland.

I'd bet that the issue isn't a gap existing of 2.25 to 4M. From a cap management point of view, the Flames need Bennett's new deal to be 3 or more years in length. This is where it gets tricky - no RFA in the league with Bennett's potential is going to sign away 3+ years for 2.25M. Even on a 3 year deal, it's pretty easy to assume the number falls between 3 and 3.5M, and the fact that a deal like that isn't done makes me think they're shooting for more than just 3 years. The longer the term, the more risk there is on both sides. The Flames are betting on Bennett's future impact in a lengthy deal, and Bennett has to do the same.

My bet? Treliving is after a Josi deal. 7 years, 4M per.

From Bennett's perspective, he's a center, which is a "premium" position around the league, so limiting himself (even at 4M) for 7 years may not be ideal.

I'm hoping this deal gets done with some significant term attached.

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by robaur

I had no problem with what Gaudreau was doing. That's the difference. Gaudreau deserved every penny and probably more.

What has Sam Bennett done? Nothing. That's the difference. It IS arrogance. There's a very fine line between being passionate and being arrogant.

Weren't you leading the "Hamilton is terrible" revolt last season?

Edit - Yup. Found it. Looking for a new whipping boy?

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthr...ighlight=woahs

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Any chance there is only a 4 year or longer contract on the table? Similar to how Pastarnak has a 6 or 7 year $6 million per contract on the table.

That could cause a sizable gap between the 2 parties.

That's my thinking .. Flames have a 3 year deal and won't budget to 1 or 2 years.

[Tinordi]

Bennett's camp probably wants a Ryan Johansen type deal at two years max.

Johansen didn't sign until the second week of October if I'm not mistaken.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Yeah its clear that there has been some sort of stare down going on throughout this thing.

I highly doubt he goes over seas though, that threat rings hollow when he could get injured playing elsewhere and kiss his earning potential goodbye.

His agent, as i have stated, looks like a guy who has opened a relatively new agency and Sam is his biggest name client by a fair margin. I do wonder if the agent isnt trying to make a name for himself on the back of Bennett...which is horrible to think about but hardly anything new in the agent/client business in any industry.

Bad advice could not only derail Bennetts season, but could have reprecussions throughout his short term career and possibly longer.

Sam has little to no leverage in this negotiation and it appears that he is not aware of that. Staring down Treliving will rarely work out in your favor.

Agreed, whether it's Bennett or his agent, something isn't adding up.

There is zero chance Treliving gives up more than an inch for a player still trying to prove himself in the NHL.

This isn't remotely close to the Gaudreau situation and Gaudreau actually had something to point to and could say with a straight face he deserved more money.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Why would this even matter? You want to be petty and punish him or something?

No, I don't want him pulling a Gaudreau and taking the first month to find his game. I would prefer that when he steps on the ice with the team he is in game shape and ready to go.

If Bennett wants to hand Jankowski his spot I'm not sure thats the wisest move as I think Janko would run with it. If Bennett really wants to stay at centre he'd better be signed before camp.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Bennett is possibly going to pass up on the one opportunity he has to establish himself as a core player for this team at the position of his choice. He has the opportunity to step up and establish himself as the number two center on this team. Gulutzan is going to give him opportunity to succeed. You would have to think that both Jankowski and Backlund are dancing in their jammies reading this this morning. The hopes of Backlund getting $6M from the Flames will increase with each day that passes without Bennett being on the ice and proving he can carry the load as the #2 center. Real bad strategy by his agency.

[I_H8_Crawford]

The other thing to keep in mind is IMO the pressure point is all on Bennett's side - if he holds out, misses camp, etc. then gets a 1 year deal, he is already behind the 8-ball, and his chances of earning a big pay day decrease quite a bit.

We saw how missing TC affected Gaudreau and Monahan last year (yes, I know new system as well, but it's still going to take time to work off the rust, get chemistry, etc.)

[robaur]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Weren't you leading the "Hamilton is terrible" revolt last season?

Not my finest hour.

I would like to say that Hamilton did start off the season terribly and still had a team-worst -27 penalty differential as shown in the other thread. Some parts of his game are downright infuriating. As he ages, I think he will gloss over these areas.

But yes, not my finest hour.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I'd bet that the issue isn't a gap existing of 2.25 to 4M. From a cap management point of view, the Flames need Bennett's new deal to be 3 or more years in length. This is where it gets tricky - no RFA in the league with Bennett's potential is going to sign away 3+ years for 2.25M. Even on a 3 year deal, it's pretty easy to assume the number falls between 3 and 3.5M. This deal gets trickier the longer the term is because of all the potential Bennett has and because he's starting to make good on the promise of that potential.

My bet? Treliving is after a Josi deal. 7 years, 4M per.

From Bennett's perspective, he's a center, which is a "premium" position around the league, so limiting himself (even at 4M) for 7 years may not be ideal.

I'm hoping this deal gets done with some significant term attached.

Bennett being a center should not factor in the negotiating or at least not in his favor. He hasn't been a good center in the league, not even average. He plays like a winger and shouldn't be paid on potential. $28 million guaranteed would be such a gamble for Bennett who so far has proven to be a $2.5 million dollar player at best.

Not sure why we'd wanna risk 7 years at $4 million. Bennett should jump at that deal if it's being offered.

[robaur]

I keep saying this again and again. This is nothing like the Gaudreau situation.

Gaudreau was coming off a 78 point season.....

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Bennett's camp probably wants a Ryan Johansen type deal at two years max.

Johansen didn't sign until the second week of October if I'm not mistaken.

Didn't Johansson put up 63 points before his "hold out"? I mean if an agent is trying to use that as a comparable in a negotiation with Treliving... good luck with that

[btimbit]

Agent posturing to the media. I'm not worried

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by robaur

Not my finest hour.

I would like to say that Hamilton did start off the season terribly and still had a team-worst -27 penalty differential as shown in the other thread. Some parts of his game are downright infuriating. As he ages, I think he will gloss over these areas.

But yes, not my finest hour.

I give you a tonne of credit for owning stuff like this. No issues with being a passionate fan, that's normal. But owning up to an over reaction separates you from many.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Bennett being a center should not factor in the negotiating or at least not in his favor. He hasn't been a good center in the league, not even average. He plays like a winger and shouldn't be paid on potential. $28 million guaranteed would be such a gamble for Bennett who so far has proven to be a $2.5 million dollar player at best.

Not sure why we'd wanna risk 7 years at $4 million. Bennett should jump at that deal if it's being offered.

I disagree with your assessment of what Bennett is today, and clearly have higher hopes for him than you do at this stage. He's played 1 year at centre, and the growth contained within that 1 year was significant. If you go watch AC's Bennett highlight video, just watch at how many plays he makes in the defensive zone that lead into offensive chances/goals. This kid is going to be a 200 foot powerhouse when all is said and done - which is why I believe Treliving is trying to get a long term deal done. Capitalize on Bennett's "development year" by using it to get a lower cap-hit on a long term deal.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by New Era

No, I don't want him pulling a Gaudreau and taking the first month to find his game. I would prefer that when he steps on the ice with the team he is in game shape and ready to go.

Well he can agree to a conditioning stint. But he's an NHLer and we're not sending him down outside of a conditioning stint.

[TheKurgan]

The longer Bennett holds out the more reps Jankowski will be taking at third line Centre. If I was Bennett I would be signing a bridge contract ASAP

[ComixZone]

Johansen is an interesting comparable, but at this stage of his pro career, Johansen had 3 full years of pro plus one additional year in the WHL.

Johansen:

Draft +1: Played in the WHL

Draft +2: 21 points in the NHL (67 games played), 20 points in the AHL (40 games played)

Draft +3: 12 points in the NHL (in 40 games)

Draft+4: 63 points in the NHL (82 games)


Bennett:

Draft +1: Lost to injury (1 point in 1 game, 4 points in 11 playoff games in the NHL)

Draft +2: 36 points in the NHL (77 games)

Draft +3: 26 points in the NHL (81 games)

Then look at Johansen's two following contracts:

3 years, 4M per.
8 years, 8M per.

That's 6.29M AAV in the first 7 years after his ELC burned up. I stick by my guns saying that Bennett projects out better than Johansen, and that the Flames are trying to get a lengthy deal done right now in order to pay more up front, and get it cheaper on the back-end and this is what they're negotiating right now.

I feel a lot of people on CP show a serious amount of impatience towards actual player development. It's either instant success, bust, or long-term project that has infinite amounts of potential until they're inevitably a bust.

[CroFlames]

This is pure agent tactics. It happens all the time. People posturing what kind of attitude the player has is just plain dumb. This is between agent and GM, and the agent is playing games.

I can't wait to see the heads of uninformed fans truly explode when Francis gets a hold of this and runs with it. CP will have to hire several full time counselors to bring people back from the brink.

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

This is pure agent tactics. It happens all the time. People posturing what kind of attitude the player has is just plain dumb. This is between agent and GM, and the agent is playing games.

I can't wait to see the heads of uninformed fans truly explode when Francis gets a hold of this and runs with it. CP will have to hire several full time counselors to bring people back from the brink.

Are you telling me I've gotten the Scotch bottle out for nothing?

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

That's 6.29M AAV in the first 7 years after his ELC burned up. I stick by my guns saying that Bennett projects out better than Johansen, and that the Flames are trying to get a lengthy deal done right now in order to pay more up front, and get it cheaper on the back-end and this is what they're negotiating right now.

I feel a lot of people on CP show a serious amount of impatience towards actual player development. It's either instant success, bust, or long-term project that has infinite amounts of potential until they're inevitably a bust.

I'm with you ... don't want to get Oiler fans in a tizzy but I think the Draisaitl/Bennett argument will rear it's head again in the next couple of seasons.

He's younger, he missed a year, and he really came on last season. Treliving probably knows a one year deal will really hurt the team so he's playing hard ball on 3+ to make sure they get some value before he enters the big pay day club.