2017 Hurricane Season

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

You're just as bad as people who link everything to vaccines

Oh yes? Go on... Explain.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Oh yes? Go on... Explain.

There's a bunch of really informative and intelligent posts here. Then there's guys that just want to bang their stick against the boards and cheer for a goon.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Oh yes? Go on... Explain.

Well, I think most intelligent people agree that climate change is happening and that man is definitely contributing to it. But not every. single. weather event is caused by climate change.

There are several posts showing that there aren't more hurricanes now than there used to be, or that this isn't the worst year for forest fires in Canada but hey, climate change fits whatever political narrative you've subscribed to so you do these drive by vomit posts with no evidence whatsoever and then in condescending fashion look down at those who you think aren't as enlightened as you are. As Troutman posted, these floods are largely caused by the over development of the wetlands, but you chose to ignore that because you're so obsessed with your ideology you can't even stop and think for a minute that maybe weather, climate and the consequences related thereto are far more complicated than a result of a single contributing factor.

But don't worry, I know you'll logoff tonight and pat yourself on the back.

[Canehdianman]

Clearly it's the pirates fault.

Spoiler!

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by troutman

Houston Freeway Shark is a hoax:


http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...houston-or-an/

It's amazing what needs to actually be "debunked" as a hoax with social media these days. ****ing thick as mud storm water on roads where you can't see more than an inch through it on the news, then all of a sudden a shark calmly swimming near the surface beside a vehicle in lake clear water, where the mirror and construction barriers clearly show the vehicle isn't even tire deep.

There shouldn't be a human being alive that looks at the photo and needs to be told if it's real or not.

*not directed at you troutman, just the fact that there's a debunked story at all.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Well, I think most intelligent people agree that climate change is happening and that man is definitely contributing to it. But not every. single. weather event is caused by climate change.

There are several posts showing that there aren't more hurricanes now than there used to be, or that this isn't the worst year for forest fires in Canada but hey, climate change fits whatever political narrative you've subscribed to so you do these drive by vomit posts with no evidence whatsoever and then in condescending fashion look down at those who you think aren't as enlightened as you are. As Troutman posted, these floods are largely caused by the over development of the wetlands, but you chose to ignore that because you're so obsessed with your ideology you can't even stop and think for a minute that maybe weather, climate and the consequences related thereto are far more complicated than a result of a single contributing factor.

But don't worry, I know you'll logoff tonight and pat yourself on the back.

Where did I say this was "caused" by climate change? It's like you're reading my posts through a filter of I want Tinordi to be wrong so therefore I'm going to project all the arguments that make him wrong onto his posts.

What did I post:

That climate change is impacting the storm.

How about this post that goes into detail did you just conveniently ignore this?

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...4&postcount=99

Or the posts by others pointing out that the storms are getting more severe? Did you ignore those?

Here: http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...6&postcount=97

Here: http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...9&postcount=95

Here: http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...2&postcount=93

Here: http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...8&postcount=81

The graphic you mention has shown an upward trend in hurricanes over the decades. Did you miss that discussion?

On forest fires, we have a chart that goes to 2014. Sure, maybe cliamte has nothing to do with BC's record breaking forest fires this summer. Or maybe not:

Scientists, including Flannigan, cite climate change as the reason the amount of Canadian forest burnt has doubled since the 1970s, with Alberta starting its forest fire season March 1 instead of April 1.

“Fire seasons are staring earlier and the warmer it gets, the more lightning you get,” he said, listing off a growing number of disastrous forest blazes and fire seasons throughout Canada.

“It’s helping to confirm what we’ve believed and feared.”

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...-forestry-prof

So who's the real arbiter of impartiality on this topic. You, the guy who's just expunged the old tired arguments about how climate isn't a causal factor or me, the guy who's quoting scientists and analysis from various sources?

[Resolute 14]

We have other scientists who have pointed to increasing human population in forests and our own fire suppression efforts that hamper the ability of smaller fires to burn out deadfall that instead piles up and helps prompt larger fires as also being significant contributing factors.

But I like how you respond to an accusation that you obsessively focus on a single issue to push your smug sense of superiority by.... obsessively focusing on a single issue to push your smug sense of superiority. Even the scientists believe that there are multiple factors at play insofar as forest fires are concerned. And before you reply (probably by trying to set up a strawman or two), note that stating this is not the same thing as arguing climate change is not a significant factor.

But don't forget to pat yourself on the back tonight, Tinordi. After the day you've had, you clearly need the self-congratulatory pick-me-up.

[Wormius]

How affected is downtown Houston? I have only seen what look like images outside of the downtown core.

[Tinordi]

Yes, there's lots of factors, climate change is one very important one. Which I've been saying in this thread. Because I don't caveat every post with a statement like "there are lots of factors" you seem to think that that's a flaw in my opinion.

I'm not obsessively focusing on climate change for my own superiority complex - it's for my sense of dread. That we still don't see this catastrophes for what they are. A massive warning sign that significant disruption, cost, and loss of life is on the horizon unless we do something. So should we sit back and dare not discuss how climate is a factor in this story because there are so many other factors that scolds like you can latch onto for no other reason that trying to feel smug and superior yourself?

Better said here: https://www.vox.com/energy-and-envir...climate-change

But again, at the same time, it’s grossly irresponsible to leave climate out of the picture. We know it’s going to get worse. We know it’s going to make every other challenge more challenging, every damage more damaging, every expense more expensive.

Whether the climate signal is discernible now, it surely will be by the end of the century. By then, our opportunity to prevent some of it will be long past.

Everything human beings do, we do in a climate (except hang out on the space station, I suppose).

Our climate has been in a rough temperature equilibrium for about 10,000 years, while we developed agriculture and advanced civilization and Netflix.

Now our climate is about to rocket out of that equilibrium, in what is, geologically speaking, the blink of an eye. We’re not sure exactly what’s going to happen, but we have a decent idea, and we know it’s going to be weird. With more heat energy in the system, everything’s going to get crazier — more heat waves, more giant rainstorms, more droughts, more floods.

That means climate change is part of every story now. The climate we live in shapes agriculture, it shapes cities and economies and trade, it shapes culture and learning, it shapes human conflict. It is a background condition of all these stories, and its changes are reflected in them.

So we’ve got to get past this “did climate change cause it?” argument. A story like Harvey is primarily a set of local narratives, about the lives immediately affected. But it is also part of a larger narrative, one developing over decades and centuries, with potentially existential stakes.

We’ve got to find a way to weave those narratives together while respecting and doing justice to both.

So what's your point? You agree with me? Thanks.

[Leeman4Gilmour]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Better said here: https://www.vox.com/energy-and-envir...climate-change

Good read and, you're right, it was better said

From the article;

How many cycles of destruction and rebuilding can a city cope with? How many simultaneous cities in crisis can a country handle?

I asked myself this in regards to Houston and area. September is high hurricane season. What if they get hit again next month? Heck, what if they get hit again this hard in 2,3,4, or 5 years. As the article asks, how much is too much?

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Houston had 41 inches of rain in three days, the annual rainfall in Seattle was 37 inches.

It's almost as if the climate is changing....

Some people are worried about if these poor people are ok. Some people have asked where they can donate to help with the relief. Tinordi merely decided to log on and use an event that is killing a few, and abandoning tens of thousands to stand on a soap box. That would be ugly, even if your point was valid. But it is ridiculous. Tropical storms carry tons of water in them, that is not new. this one had the bad luck of meeting an equal and opposite front from the north. The storm wanted to work north, and a front wanted to push it south. So it sat there for 2-3 days. Right on the coast so it could constantly bring gulf water south of he storm up and drop it east of the storm. It rains hard a lot in Houston, comparing it to the drizzle Seattle gets is just disengenous, but it sounded good. That's all that matters.

Maybe global warming is happening, maybe not, but to take a concept you don't begin to understand, ignore the human element and basically take a victory lap around your proud beliefs that I bet you have no formal training in, outside of social media is disgusting.

[longsuffering]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Some people are worried about if these poor people are ok. Some people have asked where they can donate to help with the relief. Tinordi merely decided to log on and use an event that is killing a few, and abandoning tens of thousands to stand on a soap box. That would be ugly, even if your point was valid. But it is ridiculous. Tropical storms carry tons of water in them, that is not new. this one had the bad luck of meeting an equal and opposite front from the north. The storm wanted to work north, and a front wanted to push it south. So it sat there for 2-3 days. Right on the coast so it could constantly bring gulf water south of he storm up and drop it east of the storm. It rains hard a lot in Houston, comparing it to the drizzle Seattle gets is just disengenous, but it sounded good. That's all that matters.

Maybe global warming is happening, maybe not, but to take a concept you don't begin to understand, ignore the human element and basically take a victory lap around your proud beliefs that I bet you have no formal training in, outside of social media is disgusting.

I agree 100% with the sentiment. NOW is not the time to debate the role of climate change on this storm. There will be plenty of time for that later.

Have we already forgotten how we collectively felt when internet posters and commentators said that Calgary got what it deserved in 2013? It was BS then and its BS now.

There is a humanitarian crisis developing (actually happening) before our very eyes. Let's keep that and the people impacted in our thoughts, not wage some silly dick measuring contest.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by longsuffering

I agree 100% with the sentiment. NOW is not the time to debate the role of climate change on this storm. There will be plenty of time for that later.

Have we already forgotten how we collectively felt when internet posters and commentators said that Calgary got what it deserved in 2013? It was BS then and its BS now.

There is a humanitarian crisis developing (actually happening) before our very eyes. Let's keep that and the people impacted in our thoughts, not wage some silly dick measuring contest.

BULLCRAP

Your useless thoughts and prayers are about as good to the people of Houston as a sack of horse manure right now.

Spare the sentimental crap. If now isn't a good time to talk about climate change, when is?

People are perfectly capable of supporting humanitarian aid AND at the same time discussing the role of climate change, thank you very much.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by icecube

BULLCRAP

Your useless thoughts and prayers are about as good to the people of Houston as a sack of horse manure right now.

Spare the sentimental crap. If now isn't a good time to talk about climate change, when is?

People are perfectly capable of supporting humanitarian aid AND at the same time discussing the role of climate change, thank you very much.

The point being made is that guys like Tinordi and others here offering nothing but tubthumping are not accomplishing anything. Talking about climate change isn't that.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by icecube

BULLCRAP

Your useless thoughts and prayers are about as good to the people of Houston as a sack of horse manure right now.

Spare the sentimental crap. If now isn't a good time to talk about climate change, when is?

People are perfectly capable of supporting humanitarian aid AND at the same time discussing the role of climate change, thank you very much.

Haha cool. I'm at the convention center right now. Since you and tinordi are doing both what can I pen down as your donation?

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Maybe global warming is happening, maybe not, but to take a concept you don't begin to understand, ignore the human element and basically take a victory lap around your proud beliefs that I bet you have no formal training in, outside of social media is disgusting.

Nope.

Regardless, advocating not talking about climate change during a severe storm that is linked to climate change reminds me very much of the NRA crowd after every mass shooting in the US: "Now's not the time, folks. Let's talk about the victims."

It is a good time - it pretty much always is.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Haha cool. I'm at the convention center right now. Since you and tinordi are doing both what can I pen down as your donation?

Mark me down for a 20 spot brah.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by icecube

Mark me down for a 20 spot brah.

PMed

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

Nope.

Regardless, advocating not talking about climate change during a severe storm that is linked to climate change reminds me very much of the NRA crowd after every mass shooting in the US: "Now's not the time, folks. Let's talk about the victims."

It is a good time - it pretty much always is.

So if we talk about how climate change is happening when we have a tropical storm do we get to talk about it on the days when there are not any storms?

It is standard procedure to laugh at what people thought 15, 30 or whatever years ago and to think we have all the answers now is asinine. Weather is tricky, people don't understand it, no matter what reports or proofs that are written we as a society over estimate what we know.

Social is manufacturing he largest example of groupthink in the history of humanity causeing is to all 'know' stuff that our kids will one day laugh at.

[Flash Walken]

*sigh*