Omar F*****G Khadr is getting $10.5 milion

[CampbellsTransgressions]

Omar Khadr should have just pulled himself up by the bootstraps, moved away from home at 6 years old and found a new family.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by V

You're really blurring Canadian and American actions.

They withheld and tortured him without even charging him. The US military's multiple explanations of the events that unfolded that day are highly suspect and suggest that it's plausible, if not likely, that he didn't even kill Speers.

[Ducay]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

They withheld and tortured him without even charging him. The US military's multiple explanations of the events that unfolded that day are highly suspect and suggest that it's plausible, if not likely, that he didn't even kill Speers.

Agreed - he was simply in Afghanistan as a tourist and the grenade was actually a fidget spinner.

Forget money for vets, indigenous people, or true victims of violent crimes in our society, instead lets playyyyyyy

[CampbellsTransgressions]

and forget about the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, Pierre Trudeau is the one that created it anyway

talk about no good

[V]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

They withheld and tortured him without even charging him. The US military's multiple explanations of the events that unfolded that day are highly suspect and suggest that it's plausible, if not likely, that he didn't even kill Speers.

Who withheld and tortured him?

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

You can acknowledge your mistakes while still holding him accountable.

What are we holding him accountable for again? Being a 15 year old in a really sh***y situation?

What could he have differently leading up to the day he was attacked? Had a 'coming to jesus' moment and wander away into the desert...to what end? What could have prompted such a moment of truth for him, anyways? Do you think he was able to expand his mind be reading about different ideas in his spare time?


What could he have done differently once he and his group had been attacked? Sit there patiently and wait to be executed, or [allegedly] throw a hail mary grenade that might somehow keep him alive? I'll even concede that if he threw the grenade it was probably out of hate and vengeance. Is that unreasonable when the only people in your life have just been killed by the 'enemy' you've been told exclusively about for your entire life?

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Calgary14

Majority of Canadians oppose Khadr settlement: http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/gren...poll-1.4198306

Is this really surprising? It's actually sad but to be expected.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by V

Who withheld and tortured him?

Canada was complicit in his torture.

[TheFlamesVan]

Originally Posted by Calgary14

Majority of Canadians oppose Khadr settlement: http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/gren...poll-1.4198306

Minority of those polled actually understand the situation.

[V]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Canada was complicit in his torture.

Follow the thread. Really, try your best.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by V

Follow the thread. Really, try your best.

Try following the case. What you've said in this thread has been talked about for years and the reason he got millions so you're a little behind.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by V

Follow the thread. Really, try your best.

I have a better suggestion, why don't you make a post that is direct in explaining what you are trying to communicate instead of this garbage?

Originally Posted by V

You're really blurring Canadian and American actions.

How so? Please explain so we know what you mean and can avoid a circular follow up to any reply like this one:

Originally Posted by V

Who withheld and tortured him?

The two parties who you were referring to in the previous post.

If you don't agree that the government of Canada not fighting for the actions of the US to be halted makes them culpable in this, then just say that instead of avoiding debating your position with the poster who gave that response by saying "Follow the thread..."

[V]

You can jump into this conversation all you want, but I'm not going to drag you along. Q said that the Canadian government is guilty of torture. That isn't remotely accurate. They didn't do enough to try to stop the torture, but they are not guilty of torture. The Americans are. The Canadian government is guilty and culpable of plenty, but people seem unable to comprehend even the simplist facts of this case.

[Snuffleupagus]

He was lucky to be alive in order to be tortured

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

He was lucky to be alive in order to be tortured

You could say the only reason he is alive is because the Americans saved him so they could torture him. They saved his life because they thought they could extract information from him. The US has said this. So he wasn't "lucky" to be alive, and I'm sure on many days in Guantanamo he wished for death. The poor kid spent all his life getting tossed from one crappy situation to another, with no real options along the way. But ya, lucky kid.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

He was lucky to be alive in order to be tortured

Not directed specifically at you but more at the anti settlement crowd in general?

Do you feel that Canada's actions contributed to Kadar getting torotured?
Do you feel that this torture was justified?

If Canada the answer to one is yes and two is no what is an appropriate punishment for Canada

[TheFlamesVan]

Originally Posted by GGG

Not directed specifically at you but more at the anti settlement crowd in general?

Do you feel that Canada's actions contributed to Kadar getting torotures?
Do you feel that this torture was justified?

If Canada the answer to one is yes and two is no what is an appropriate punishment for Canada

I think the problem is that a lot of people think the torture was justified.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by TheFlamesVan

I think the problem is that a lot of people think the torture was justified.

That frightens me. The idea that torture is justified against an enemy is not a far jump from terrorist attacks are justified against an enemy.

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

in my opinion Khadr is not a clear cut victim like milgaard and arar were. Yes torture is reprehensible and a miscarriage of justice.

So it's not ok to torture bad people, but if you do then an apology, and education bursary is sufficient? If you torture a good person, then monetary compensation is appropriate.

How do we determine where the line is on this?

Originally Posted by V

You're really blurring Canadian and American actions.

Actually, there's not where my line of questioning is going at all. It was merely is torture justified. Any blurring is you reading too much into the question.

Originally Posted by Ducay

I must have missed when Milgaard went abroad as a terrorist and killed someone

So you believe torture is justified. You can believe that if you choose, I don't; but it's ok to disagree.

Originally Posted by GaiJin

Again, he wasn't tortured for 10 year straight, and he prolonged his own stay there.

Well I don't think anyone is saying that he was tortured 24 hours a day 3,650 days straight.

And he did prolong his stay there, if he confessed when he was tortured in the beginning, the whole process would have been sped up, however he was trying to have the torture stop via the actual court process.

Originally Posted by V

You can jump into this conversation all you want, but I'm not going to drag you along. Q said that the Canadian government is guilty of torture. That isn't remotely accurate. They didn't do enough to try to stop the torture, but they are not guilty of torture. The Americans are. The Canadian government is guilty and culpable of plenty, but people seem unable to comprehend even the simplist facts of this case.

No I didn't say the Canadian Government was guilty of torture, they were complicit and aided the US but I never said they were guilty of the act of torture (I've actually been very deliberate about that). I was trying to determine whether people think torture is justified.

Do you think torture is justified? Or is it justified when it's another country, but not our own?

Some here believe that it is justified and acceptable.

It's a free country, with freedom of thought, belief and opinion. They're totally allowed to believe that, and I wouldn't want to live in a society that didn't allow free personal thought, belief and opinion.

Originally Posted by belsarius

That frightens me. The idea that torture is justified against an enemy is not a far jump from terrorist attacks are justified against an enemy.

I concur. I don't believe torture is ever justified. If a bad person is tortured, they should be compensated for the torture just as a good person would be.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by V

You can jump into this conversation all you want, but I'm not going to drag you along. Q said that the Canadian government is guilty of torture. That isn't remotely accurate. They didn't do enough to try to stop the torture, but they are not guilty of torture. The Americans are. The Canadian government is guilty and culpable of plenty, but people seem unable to comprehend even the simplist facts of this case.

The Canadian government knew what was going on, the moment they sent their own interrogators to speak with Khadr and told him there was nothing they could do unless he started talking they lost the "it was the Americans" card. Torture is not simply a physical act, the goal is to psychologically break down the victim, the government aided in this which in my view makes them guilty. I doubt anyone would say that the US government didn't torture him, that it was only their interrogators.