Newborn baby may be the first to be registered ‘gender unknown’

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

It's patently obvious that there's no scientific basis for suggesting that being transgendered is something that needs "curing". That's why you've failed utterly to justify the position other than through reference to incidents of the oppression of transgendered people in society as it currently is (which, hilariously, you seem only too happy to pile onto by treating them as if they were sick).

On the flip side, I've made zero claims in here that a geneticist could or would disagree with (other than possibly wording something clumsily).

If anyone's the anti-vaxxer in this argument, it's you. You're making value judgments based on your gut and suggesting treatments for children without any defensible basis or reasoning for those propositions.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

It's patently obvious that there's no scientific basis for suggesting that being transgendered is something that needs "curing". That's why you've failed utterly to justify the position other than through reference to incidents of the oppression of transgendered people in society as it currently is (which, hilariously, you seem only too happy to pile onto by treating them as if they were sick).

On the flip side, I've made zero claims in here that a geneticist could or would disagree with (other than possibly wording something clumsily).

If anyone's the anti-vaxxer in this argument, it's you. You're making value judgments based on your gut and suggesting treatments for children without any basis or reasoning for those propositions.

Cool story bro

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

I have very few beefs with this post because it seems you are willing to entertain, if not already accept its a biological function. As for the end, why fix it if people are happy and healthy, well, it's clear that trans people and people with gender identity are anything but. Depression and suicide are astronomically higher in these groups and while I agree a lot of its due to society being society, if we accepted these groups fully (which we should) I suspect the depression and suicide issues would still be higher than other groups.

Is the depression directly related to their gender identity, or it is because of how they are treated? If there is a genetic link, that would be something worth exploring. If it's environmental, then it would be better to focus on treating the depression as a separate issue.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

Not at all. Being homosexual is just a preference for one gender or the other.

Gender identity is you're born a man, but, think you're a woman. How is that not a defect?

Because evolution/nature/biology ect...isn't black and white - it's an experiment in survival. These characteristics haven't died out, so there is some evolutionary advantage

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Handsome B. Wonderful

Exactly.

"screening and removing down syndrome"

I am not wrong.

Good news Mr Smith, the cancer has been removed from your wife! Bad news is, she died too.

Yeah, you're not wrong in a way I guess.

[IrishSpring2013]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

Cool story bro

this thread will deeply embarrass you in 2-3 years.. 5 tops...

[SebC]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

It's patently obvious that there's no scientific basis for suggesting that being transgendered is something that needs "curing".

If this is the case, why is sex reassignment surgery a government-funded procedure? And do you agree with that? What would differentiate this from pre-birth procedure that aims to align sex and gender?

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by IrishSpring2013

this thread will deeply embarrass you in 2-3 years.. 5 tops...

In what way? I'm advocating for people to treat transgender people in the same way society has treated homosexuals; with understanding and compassion and to treat them like anyone else.

If it's true that in 5 years science will throw in the towel (cant help that pun Corsi) and peer reviewed data clearly shows that gender identity is non biological and is a choice people make after birth, then what? Do you really think society will move forward and not treat people with trans gender issues like ####? They will just say 'you chose that lifestyle why should I care'. That would be a disaster.

Or maybe you just mean that in 5 years people will treat transgender people no differently than homosexuals now? You know, the thing I am advocating for? I don't get it, what position are you thrusting upon me that I will feel shame about soon?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by SebC

If this is the case, why is sex reassignment surgery a government-funded procedure? And do you agree with that? What would differentiate this from pre-birth procedure that aims to align sex and gender?

Sex reassignment surgery is voluntary. That's a pretty huge distinction right off the bat. It's a matter of individual assessment (and self-assessment) in a particular case and not a generalization, for two. The fact that not every transgendered person wants to go through with it is telling on its own.

As to whether it should be government funded, that's a reasonable question. I'm not sure I have a strong opinion one way or the other. You could argue that if a medical professional assesses the individual case and says "for this person, this procedure is likely to produce a significantly better quality of life", and the person's willing to do it, it's justifiably something that should be funded. But as to which "quality of life improving" surgeries should get government funding and which shouldn't, I'm sort of agnostic about where that line should fall.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by devo22

how dare you assume its species!

Washington state couple chooses to raise their child species-less

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

Or maybe you just mean that in 5 years people will treat transgender people no differently than homosexuals now? You know, the thing I am advocating for?

Bull####. You explicitly said that you would never advocate for curing homosexuality because it's no big deal. Those were your words. You've also explicitly said that being transgender is a defect and that we should work towards curing it.

You don't get to pretend to take the high road now. In no way have you advocated for treating homosexuals and transgender people the same way, you've been very clear that you do not believe we should...for reasons.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Bull####. You explicitly said that you would never advocate for curing homosexuality because it's no big deal. Those were your words. You've also explicitly said that being transgender is a defect and that we should work towards curing it.

You don't get to pretend to take the high road now. In no way have you advocated for treating homosexuals and transgender people the same way, you've been very clear that you do not believe we should...for reasons.

So this troubles me a little. Because I would advocate to prevent people from having gender identity issues in the future I would want to treat them differently now?

What about mentally ######ed people. Let's say that we could eliminate all occurrences of mental ######ation by offering specific gene therapy that's as non invasive as a pill. Would my advocacy of that pill equal a contempt for the mentally handicapped?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

Would my advocacy of that pill equal a contempt for the mentally handicapped?

Nope. It's your suggestion - made multiple times in this thread - that being transgendered is analogous to being mentally handicapped or having down's syndrome that speaks volumes.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/393442...by-registered/



If you want to convince me that gender identity is hard wired into our brain, a biological function that during birth can be messed up and that's why .05% of the population polled has these issues, you will have my buy in. I'd likely treat it as a mental disorder though, and would want that condition to be cured and perhaps something we could "inoculate" against in the future.

If you want to convince me there's nothing about gender that is biological, and it's strictly a societal construct, you've lost me. Science doesn't agree with that, and is pretty solidly against it. Take a biology class.

This woman has essentially given this child a 100% chance to have gender identity issues against the small .05~% chance that they will have a legitimate gender identity issue.

I have no clue where my Birth Certificate is, nor have I ever looked at it, for all I know my father is George Best (that would be cool as all hell!!)
I doubt this kid will be affected by their mothers slightly over the top actions.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

This almost sounds like Doty, they whatever is going to create a gender confusion with this child.

Indoctrination and brainwashing is not just a religious thing.

[Yamer]

Transgendered people:
-Defective
-Should be cured through eugenics
-Are equivalent to the mentally ######ed

Multiple instances of confusing sex, gender, gender identity, and gendered roles...sometimes into a singularity.

Denying substantial socio-cultural influence in constructing all of those, and how we interpret them.

Dismissive jokes throughout.


Not judging anyone, but this is definitely one of those threads that, 10 years down the road, you can't believe existed.

[FireGilbert]

While this is certainly an interesting story that is worthy of discussion it is frankly disturbing the OP has used it to go on a transphobic rant comparing to mental illness and suggested they be cured.

Agreed if this thread was bumped in 10 years some of the posts would look incredibly ignorant and backwards.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Yamer

Transgendered people:
-Defective
-Should be cured through eugenics
-Are equivalent to the mentally ######ed

Multiple instances of confusing sex, gender, gender identity, and gendered roles...sometimes into a singularity.

Denying substantial socio-cultural influence in constructing all of those, and how we interpret them.

Dismissive jokes throughout.


Not judging anyone, but this is definitely one of those threads that, 10 years down the road, you can't believe existed.

In a post defending one group that is treated poorly by society you really show a lack of tact in discussing other groups challenges. It seems like you are implying that the mentally challange are in someway defective.

[Dan02]

While we're at it can we get rid of all these defective lefties too. Just think of the right handed utopian paradise it would be where no one knocks elbows at the dinner table, the scissors always work and you can always borrow a buddies pair of golf clubs.

[GGG]

We also shouldn't try to treat deafness in children because they are a unique cultural community that should be preserved instead of fixed.