Political Junkies: Predictions for U.S. Mid-Terms?

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Really. Every time we get into Iraq and the resolution to the problem you tend to disappear pretty quickly. Seems that when we actually start getting itno the nuts and bolts of the region and the ethnic alignment you disappear. Stick to driving Johnny. The only time you "hold your own" is when you're standing in front of a urinal!

Ahh done already are ya Lanny. Once your position is toast all you have left is the insult move. I'd say I pretty well won already.

I started with saying and stuck to why should a Republican change his vote and couldn't see a reason why. Still haven't heard one. Your answer was might as well for a change ---not much of a reason is it?

Your point on partition being particularily funny. Ever read Biden's stuff?

[Vulcan]

I think Lurch made a point by point post of why the Republicans suck but everything you don't like is whining. What a load of crap you shovel.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

I don't get it... Democrats are complaining that US soldiers are being sent to die in a (losing) war predicated on a lie... and they're 'whining'? Seems like you made up your mind regardless of what the situation in Iraq is. Republicans are responsible for the fiasco... but because the Democrats are talking about it, they're whiners... nice.

Ahh and devoid of a alternative you whine right along with them. Do you have alternative policy other than whining about the Reps? What about the moderate Republicans that voted against the war and are in the most difficulty? Do you want them to lose their seat? They voted against the WAR in the first place.

You can't even convince me and I don't even have a vote!

[transplant99]

Democrats are complaining that US soldiers are being sent to die in a (losing) war predicated on a lie...

They were as big a part as sending the US military overseas as anyone.
Congress had to approve...not the Republicans.

[Devils'Advocate]

If I had a vote, I would vote for the Republicans. They are the ones borrowing trillions upon trillions of dollars, devaluing their currency and thus the Canadian hockey teams are able to compete better against the American teams. When the Democrats are in power, they are actually fiscally responsible, pay down the debt and that's when the Canadian hockey teams really struggle.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by transplant99

They were as big a part as sending the US military overseas as anyone.
Congress had to approve...not the Republicans.

Fair enough... so which Party has finally come around to the fact that the war is a disaster? I know one of them has... are we talking about when both parties approved the war, or the upcoming election and the policies now?

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Ahh and devoid of a alternative you whine right along with them. Do you have alternative policy other than whining about the Reps? What about the moderate Republicans that voted against the war and are in the most difficulty? Do you want them to lose their seat? They voted against the WAR in the first place.

You can't even convince me and I don't even have a vote!

Uh... what is the Republicans plan that you're attracted to? It sounds like you're accepting the Republicans by default. The Democrats plan (I believe, I don't pay close attention) is to get out of Iraq at some point very soon. It sounds like the Republican plan is to 'stay the course'. Seems pretty clear, I don't know how that = 'devoid of an alternative'. Are both parties attitudes towards Iraq identical? I didn't think so...

I'm also not 'trying to convince' you... you've convinced yourself about both sides, why bother pretending like you're listening to both sides?

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Ahh done already are ya Lanny. Once your position is toast all you have left is the insult move. I'd say I pretty well won already.

Just answering your insults there Johnny. The thread is completely littered with them.

I started with saying and stuck to why should a Republican change his vote and couldn't see a reason why. Still haven't heard one. Your answer was might as well for a change ---not much of a reason is it?

Hmmmm, interesting reasoning Johnny. You're in a ball kicking contest, and you haven't landed a shot in months, but your opponent has hit you so many times your junk is somewhere up around your navel, so what do you do? Call it a day, or continue to let that guy make ground beef of your genitals?

Your point on partition being particularily funny. Ever read Biden's stuff?

Nope. What does Biden have to say? Probably stuff a helluva lot more intelligent than you have brought up. You have proven repeatedly that you know nothing of the region, nothing of the peoples, and can only repeat what has come from the day's GOP talking points. Good lord man, your lack of knowledge on the Kurdish issue is downright embarassing.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Uh... what is the Republicans plan that you're attracted to? It sounds like you're accepting the Republicans by default. The Democrats plan (I believe, I don't pay close attention) is to get out of Iraq at some point very soon. It sounds like the Republican plan is to 'stay the course'. Seems pretty clear, I don't know how that = 'devoid of an alternative'. Are both parties attitudes towards Iraq identical? I didn't think so...

I'm also not 'trying to convince' you... you've convinced yourself about both sides, why bother pretending like you're listening to both sides?

I'm not listening to snivelling -- You are correct. I've heard the Bush government plans. More Iraqui troops -- more training for the police -- more responsibility for them both = American troops gradually pull out.

What is the Dem's plan?

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Congress had to approve...not the Republicans.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Republicans control congress? The Democrats had to win a vote there was no way for them to possibly win. Also, they (both Dems and Repubs) voted for action in the event diplomacy failed, and Bush didn't bother to try much diplomacy after he got the vote he needed.

[transplant99]

so which Party has finally come around to the fact that the war is a disaster?

Ummm...members/candidates of BOTH perhaps? Have you followed this at all? I doth believe you have been swayed by the media you do hate so much.

are we talking about when both parties approved the war

Yes...since that was the context...what's hard to grasp about that?

I was and am all about going into Iraq. That's pretty much been documented ad nauseum around here.

What has happened since? Is a debacle. I hated the fact Bush got re-elected, for many reasons, I hate the fact the US is so divided for obvious reasons, and I hate the fact that so many, (including you now) have no seeming ability to seperate what was, from what is, and who it is that is saying what.

Its all R vs D for you.....why?

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

I'm not listening to snivelling -- You are correct. I've heard the Bush government plans. More Iraqui troops -- more training for the police -- more responsibility for them both = American troops gradually pull out.

What is the Dem's plan?

Funny, I thought that was the Dem's plan, only WITH a timetable?

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Just answering your insults there Johnny. The thread is completely littered with them.



Hmmmm, interesting reasoning Johnny. You're in a ball kicking contest, and you haven't landed a shot in months, but your opponent has hit you so many times your junk is somewhere up around your navel, so what do you do? Call it a day, or continue to let that guy make ground beef of your genitals?



Nope. What does Biden have to say? Probably stuff a helluva lot more intelligent than you have brought up. You have proven repeatedly that you know nothing of the region, nothing of the peoples, and can only repeat what has come from the day's GOP talking points. Good lord man, your lack of knowledge on the Kurdish issue is downright embarassing.

Man you are an empty idiot. When you know what Biden and Gelb proposed then you can talk about something with some actual facts -- not just your empty head squawking -- you don't know even one iota more than any other talking head idiot I've heard.

Talking about partition and don't know the Biden plan --- fart what a fake piece of dung you are!!!

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

I'm not listening to snivelling -- You are correct. I've heard the Bush government plans. More Iraqui troops -- more training for the police -- more responsibility for them both = American troops gradually pull out.

Ah yes, 'Vietnamization', train the Iraqis to secure themselves, then leave. I'm surprised you don't see where that will go... the Iraqi security forces right now are by and large a complete joke. They desert in massive numbers when violence occurs, funnel US supplied arms directly to militia's/insurgents. Right now US forces are the only thing holding Iraqi security forces together. It will cost billions of dollars and thousands of American lives to figure out that, and as in Vietnam, it won't work. I guess we'll just wait 1-3 years and I'll "I told you so" then.

What is the Dem's plan?

As I stated (and you conveniently ignored twice now) I think the plan is to skedaddle. The occupation is a mess, disasterous. Its getting worse after years of heavy American involvement. Billions have been wasted and gone missing. They're screwed there, its only a matter of when they choose to recognize it and leave. As far as I can tell the Democrats recognize this (whining apparently) and the Republicans don't.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Man you are an empty idiot. When you know what Biden and Gelb proposed then you can talk about something with some actual facts -- not just your empty head squawking -- you don't know even one iota more than any other talking head idiot I've heard.

Talking about partition and don't know the Biden plan --- fart what a fake piece of dung you are!!!

Well, there's some insults from Johnny! You must be getting your ass handed to you, bus driver!

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Ummm...members/candidates of BOTH perhaps? Have you followed this at all? I doth believe you have been swayed by the media you do hate so much.

Well, I guess you'd know better than I. I was under the impression that Republicans (generally) wanted to 'stay the course', and Democrats (generally) want to end the war quickly and bring the soldiers home. I hate the media so much? Not sure where that comes from.

Yes...since that was the context...what's hard to grasp about that?

I don't get why the level of respect has to instantly drop. I don't recall belittling your intelligence here.

I was and am all about going into Iraq. That's pretty much been documented ad nauseum around here.

What has happened since? Is a debacle. I hated the fact Bush got re-elected, for many reasons, I hate the fact the US is so divided for obvious reasons, and I hate the fact that so many, (including you now) have no seeming ability to seperate what was, from what is, and who it is that is saying what.

Ok... so basically you're saying that both parties want both things, and that for me to imply Republicans want to stay and Democrats want to leave is flat out wrong? I don't recall saying every single Democrat/Republican was for one way or another... but they are different parties, with different official platforms. Some Republicans want to leave and think its a disaster? Admirable, my kind of people... if I was in a riding where the Republican wanted to end the occupation, and the Democrat wanted to keep it going, I'd vote Republican (if that was the only issue at stake). You're very quick to pigeon-hole.

[Moderator]

More insults and the thread gets locked.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Ah yes, 'Vietnamization', train the Iraqis to secure themselves, then leave. I'm surprised you don't see where that will go... the Iraqi security forces right now are by and large a complete joke. They desert in massive numbers when violence occurs, funnel US supplied arms directly to militia's/insurgents. Right now US forces are the only thing holding Iraqi security forces together. It will cost billions of dollars and thousands of American lives to figure out that, and as in Vietnam, it won't work. I guess we'll just wait 1-3 years and I'll "I told you so" then.


As I stated (and you conveniently ignored twice now) I think the plan is to skedaddle. The occupation is a mess, disasterous. Its getting worse after years of heavy American involvement. Billions have been wasted and gone missing. They're screwed there, its only a matter of when they choose to recognize it and leave. As far as I can tell the Democrats recognize this (whining apparently) and the Republicans don't.

Nope and nope. Iraqi units have been fine and in fact done well in combat. The police on the other hand haven't been trained and that is being done. Dem's in fact do have a plan -- It has been discussed and changed by the Baker bi -partisan commission and is likely to end up as it's recommendation.

[Looger]

predictions?

democrat-dominated house, narrowly republican senate.

doesn't really matter however, sadly, look how the democrats have voted in the past for all the same ridiculous bull****.

HR 6166 passed the senate 100-1.

100-1 !

holy well-timed foley scandal batman! the day before the vote...

both parties are bought and paid for by globalist / big business interests.

the only race that matters to me is lt. col. bob bowman (democrat) 15th district, florida, which is apparently closer than many interests hope it is.

101 combat missions in vietnam, headed the star wars program in the 1970s while it was still secret, is a rocket scientist, and stands against the federal reserve.

met the man, and he is the genuine article.

if he gets in he's pledged to do what he can to investigate 9/11 which as a congressman is a hell of a lot.

http://www.bowman2006.com

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Nope and nope. Iraqi units have been fine and in fact done well in combat. The police on the other hand haven't been trained and that is being done. Dem's in fact do have a plan -- It has been discussed and changed by the Baker bi -partisan commission and is likely to end up as it's recommendation.

Fair enough... hopefully we're both around here in a couple years and we'll find out how that works out. I think the country is going to sink into violent chaos (and the US military has colour-coded charts showing that this is the present state of affairs) and the US will leave bloody-nosed with a ruined international reputation. Since neither of us can forecast what will actually happen, we'll just have to wait and see, we can re-discuss when its over. Regardless of which way the US votes, its a disaster... I just think that its up to them how disasterous it will end up being.

I can certainly agree to disagree.