[News] With the 21st overall pick Flames select C Mark Jankowski

[foshizzle11]

Originally Posted by guuar

Be careful what you ask for. Treliving has one very noticeable flaw.

He's stubborn.

Everybody think he is going to circle back to Jim Rutherford to acquire MAF. Treliving is most likely either going to chase Bishop or go in balls deep with Rutherford to acquire Matt Murray.

People don't realize how much sense Matt Murray to Calgary makes. He fits Calgary's Core Age. MAF fits the core age of the Penguins. By trading Murray the penguins can acquire multiple assets to make that penguins team deeper.

I cringe when I see MAF playing in the playoffs as it becomes more and more realistic. I would believe something like 2017 1st, 2018 2nd + Sam Bennett/Mark Jankowski + Andersson/Kylington + Klimchuk/Shinkaruk.

That is the kind of assets Calgary is going to give up to get a #1 goalie that meets the core of this team.

Having seen Janko play he is very likely going to be Calgary's #1 center in 3-5 years. He does everything exceedingly well. His offensive skills are as good as Sam Bennett and his defensive skills are only behind Backlund.

I do think Treliving being a stubborn OX could cost us badly.

I think you forgot the green text on the bold part above... So, you would be happy with trading say our 1st this year, Sam Bennett, Andersson and Klimchuk for Matt Murray? or 1st this year, Jankowski, Kylington and Shinkaruk. The pens make either trade in a heart beat.

No way this is good for the flames, no matter how you spin it.

edit: I didn't even see the 2nd in there the first time around, wow.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by guuar

...I cringe when I see MAF playing in the playoffs as it becomes more and more realistic. I would believe something like 2017 1st, 2018 2nd + Sam Bennett/Mark Jankowski + Andersson/Kylington + Klimchuk/Shinkaruk.

That is the kind of assets Calgary is going to give up to get a #1 goalie that meets the core of this team...

Wow. When was the last time ANY NHL team surrendered a package of assets like this in a trade? And for a goaltender, no less?

This is beyond nonsense.

[guuar]

Originally Posted by foshizzle11

I think you forgot the green text on the bold part above... So, you would be happy with trading say our 1st this year, Sam Bennett, Andersson and Klimchuk for Matt Murray? or 1st this year, Jankowski, Kylington and Shinkaruk. The pens make either trade in a heart beat.

No way this is good for the flames, no matter how you spin it.

edit: I didn't even see the 2nd in there the first time around, wow.

No I'm not down for it at all. But, that is the kind of assets that Rutherford is going to squeeze out from under Treliving.

Treliving is stubborn and believes he is getting good value. When he sees the player he wants does things that ARE NOT intelligent.

The Hamilton trade is going to be won by Boston. We got a Top 4 D that fits with our core. Two of the players Boston drafted;

Right Winger Zachary Senyshyn + Defenceman Brandon Carlo.

Carlo is already a Top4 Dman in his rookie season in the league. Zachary Senyshyn has 87 goals in 125 games his last 2 seasons in Junior.

Unless Hamilton turns into a bonafide #1 D who is Top5 in Norris voting each year we are going to end up losing this trade.

Zachary Senyshyn is easily the kind of player. Put him with Monahan and Gaudreau and the kid could be hitting 50+ in the NHL.

It just goes to show that Treliving will make decisions he knows are risky. Everyone is so quick to say we should be all over re-signing him.

What has he done that Feaster couldn't have done?

Both Feaster and Treliving have made down right idiotic UFA signings in Wideman and Brouwer. Both signings made out of utter desperation when there was nobody else worth signing left available.

Both made idiotic trades and signings in desperation to magically fix our goaltending situation. Feaster gave up a 2nd round pick for a KHL goalie named Ramo. At least Ramo had some unknowns with a potential for being a #1.

Treliving was such an intelligent GM he handed out a 2 year contract to Jonas Hiller. Easily the worst signing in the history of the franchise. Treliving had to top Feaster though so he traded a 2nd round pick for a goalie known to fail under pressure in Brian Elliot.

What has Treliving done, really tell me? He's don't nothing more or less than any reasonable replacement would have done. If anything we are behind where we should be as a result of the dumb moves he's made.

He is stubborn and will make stupid decisions as a result. Like his big daddy, Jimbo, he doesn't like admitting he's wrong or that he's failed.

[guuar]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Wow. When was the last time ANY NHL team surrendered a package of assets like this in a trade? And for a goaltender, no less?

This is beyond nonsense.

3 prospects and 2 draft picks? The value really isn't as bad as you'd think. Treliving is like a race horse with blinders. He can only see a small view of what's going on and only sees what is ahead.

He knows he just needs a young #1 goalie and this team is set.

Murray has played 62 regular season games in 2 seasons. Nobody knows if he's the next Jim Carey or Patrick Roy.

For what it's going to cost to find out we are better off giving 23 year old Jon Gillies the opportunity he deserves.

All this talk about trading away very good young players for something we may already have.

The entire situation just reminds of J.S. Giguere and I want to cry into my pillow.

Answer the question though.

IF we gave up;

2017 1st Round Pick
2018 2nd Round Pick
Mark Jankowski
Oliver Kylington
Jon Gillies

for

Matt Murray

How much better are the Calgary Flames in 2017-2018.

If Murray is as advertised Calgary is Top 2 in the pacific. Top 3 western conference and very much in the discussion for the Stanley Cup.

You aren't giving up a single asset on your team today. Quite frankly to not consider making this trade would be stupid. Treliving has proven he's mad enough to make deals like this that are just as risky.

Calgary just needs to get 1 forward and 1 dman from Stockton to make the jump next season. It's reasonable to think Klimchuk can play on our 3rd line and Andersson can play #5/#6D.

Why wouldn't you make the trade for a 22 year old #1 Goalie.

[Yoho]

I'd rather sign Bishop for 10 years than do that trade.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by guuar

What has Treliving done, really tell me? He's don't nothing more or less than any reasonable replacement would have done. If anything we are behind where we should be as a result of the dumb moves he's made.

He is stubborn and will make stupid decisions as a result. Like his big daddy, Jimbo, he doesn't like admitting he's wrong or that he's failed.

Not only is your trade proposal nonsense, considering the Pens will lose one of Murray or MAF for nothing and you've outweighed Murray's value by a significant margin to the Pens, but your characterisation of Treliving is poor. I'd relax a little on the "big daddy Jimbo" type trash (it seems petty and dramatic). It's also not clever or funny.

Anytime you call signing Hiller for 2 years the "worst signing in franchise history" and saying that paying a 2nd for Elliott is worse than anything Feaster ever did, it calls into question whether you know what you're talking about. Especially when criticising Treliving for Elliott, while saying Ramo "at least had a shot at being #1." There is no reality where Elliott didn't have a 100x better shot at being a starter, and it's not like Ramo was acquired for nothing.

Further proof: Carlo was not taken with a draft pick that was part of the Hamilton trade, he was taken long before the second round picks we sent over. None of the players taken with the draft picks we gave up are in the NHL. Senyshyn scoring 50 in the NHL seems unlikely, when his NHLe (which is a more or less accurate prediction of transferable success) is currently at 18 goals and 8 assists over 82 games.

Most top players outperform that stat line if they're in the OHL still at 20 years old. To put that into perspective, Tkachuk had 107 points during his draft year (as a 17/18 year old), and his NHLe was 49. He scored 48 points in what was an incredibly successful rookie season playing on a very productive line. But Senyshyn is going to score 50+ NHL points with a measly 65 OHL points in his 20yr season? lol.

Would you rather have a 20yo winger that can maybe score 30 points, and maybe one day grow enough to score 50 points if put on the top line? Or a (soon to be) 24 year old defenceman that score 50, and plays big minutes on the top pairing? Doesn't seem like a tough choice.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by guuar

Murray has played 62 regular season games in 2 seasons. Nobody knows if he's the next Jim Carey or Patrick Roy.

IF we gave up;
2017 1st Round Pick
2018 2nd Round Pick
Mark Jankowski
Oliver Kylington
Jon Gillies

for
Matt Murray

How much better are the Calgary Flames in 2017-2018.

If Murray is as advertised

Nobody gives up a package like that for an "if". For that package, you have to be 390% sure that what you're getting is the real deal, and then still don't do the deal as you're giving up insanely too much.

[calculoso]

Wtf. Why are the quotes so jacked up? Stupid Tapatalk

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Not only is your trade proposal nonsense, considering the Pens will lose one of Murray or MAF for nothing and you've outweighed Nurray's value by a significant margin to the Pens

FYI, MAF wont be lost for nothing, his NMC dictates Murray will be a Knight unless he agree's to a trade or Pittsburgh pays a price to Vegas before the expansion draft.

Rumors are a trade is going to be tough as Fleury's trade list was to teams that would not likely trade for him

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

FYI, MAF wont be lost for nothing, his NMC dictates Murray will be a Knight unless he agree's to a trade or Pittsburgh pays a price to Vegas before the expansion draft.

Rumors are a trade is going to be tough as Fleury's trade list was to teams that would not likely trade for him

If MAF pushes this too far he'll just be bought out by the Pens, they're not losing Murray.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Yoho

If MAF pushes this too far he'll just be bought out by the Pens, they're not losing Murray.

I'm sure he's worried about that , after his PO performance he probably would welcome it rather than agreeing to a trade to a place he doesn't want to play.

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

I'm sure he's worried about that , after his PO performance he probably would welcome it rather than agreeing to a trade to a place he doesn't want to play.

So back to your point that Murray will potentially be a Knight is wrong.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by guuar

Unless Hamilton turns into a bonafide #1 D who is Top5 in Norris voting each year we are going to end up losing this trade.

Zachary Senyshyn is easily the kind of player. Put him with Monahan and Gaudreau and the kid could be hitting 50+ in the NHL.

Overage year in juniors, scores just over a point a game and shows very little improvement over the previous year. Poirier did better than that, why isn't he a 50 goal guy by now?

Looking at the time stamp I'm going to assume those were drunk posts.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Yoho

So back to your point that Murray will potentially be a Knight is wrong.

Maybe Pittsburgh doesn't want to throw away $7.7m in real money and $1.9m in cap space over the next 4 years to buy out a popular teammate who's playing his way to an invitation to Disney World.

[Jacks]

Just realized this is the Jankowski thread, why is the conversation about goalies and Hamilton?

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Just realized this is the Jankowski thread, why is the conversation about goalies and Hamilton?

Because it is the Jankowski thread. All other topics except Jankowski shall be discussed here.

If you want to talk about Jankowski, use any other thread except this one.

Are you new to CP?

[Kovaz]

If Treliving was willing to pay that kind of price for a goalie, Cam Talbot would be a Flame right now. If Bennett is on the table we easily outbid the 2nd+3rd the Oilers gave up.

... Also Jankowski has to be an NHLer next year.

[Cycling76er]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Just realized this is the Jankowski thread, why is the conversation about goalies and Hamilton?

Welcome to calgarypuck.com!

[icecube]

Guuar trying to put together a package to land Eric Lindros in his prime lol.

[Justin]

Living on the East coast and watching a lot of MAF games from his junior days with Cape Breton right to last nights game: I really don't want to give up much for Fleury.

Far too many times we've watched MAF collapse in big time do-or-die games. Sure, he's having a great stint right now but so did Elliot at some point.

I'd give up a pick or two for him, but i wouldn't dare touch any of the Flames future prospects.

I'd be far more content with taking Bishop than I would Fleury.