American Politics Thread: Orange is the new POTUS

[GGG]

Originally Posted by peter12

With regards to Canada, there is very little Trump is saying that hasn't been said in America since the 1950s. Maybe it is high time, we silly Canadians actually get with the times and eliminate supply management, and increase military spending to levels acceptable to our most valued, and generous ally.

If the US gets rid of their Corn and Soy subsides and requires reasonable water treatment of its oil resources maybe we can sit down and talk about the elimination of subsidies and quotas.

Long term true free trades under universal standards would be fantastic but the US protectionism and pork will be a nightmare to get rid of.

[octothorp]

Politically, eliminating supply management is a delicate conversation in Canada, and Trump tweeting about it likely makes it more politically toxic for Canadian politicians. Working back-channels would be a far more effective way of trying to bring about that change, as would staying in TPP (which would, over time, push Canada away from supply management). Effectively killing TPP only strengthens supply management in Canada. Trump's approach is the opposite of negotiation and entirely counter-productive to the change he claims that he wants. But the traditional ways of negotiating this change are far less flashy and do not produce the rallying cries with his base that are ultimately Trump's short term objectives here.

I have no problem with the US pushing for an end to supply management in Canada... in fact, as an avid consumer of poultry and dairy products myself, it's something I'd like to see. So it pisses me off when Trump spouts off and involves himself in the conversation in an incredibly toxic way.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by peter12

With regards to Canada, there is very little Trump is saying that hasn't been said in America since the 1950s. Maybe it is high time, we silly Canadians actually get with the times and eliminate supply management, and increase military spending to levels acceptable to our most valued, and generous ally.

Or, considering that the US has a 400 Million dairy trade surplus with Canada and that Wisconsin alone produces as much milk as what Canada produces, we can tell Trump to pound sand

Get with the times? This system has been in play since the 70s and NEVER caused any issues until Trump decided to stump for it...

Nato spending is something i thing is a fair point and could be discussed, but the Dairy "tiff" is a manufactured wedge issue that Herr Leader has manufactured so he can look tough on foreign trade....its a supply issue, and if the US is producing more milk than it can find buyers for that's their issue.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

So should we read this as Chaffetz finally putting country over party? Cause that would be bigly incredible.

Quite the opposite. Quitting because you don't want to explain to the public that your party's leader is a crook? That's the slimiest way out

[troutman]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

If a bipartisan committee is being told to take a hike, where does this stop? Does it? Or is it just the beginning?

Wil Wheaton‏Verified account @wilw
Your reminder that Republicans put party ahead of country: House Benghazi committee had 46 investigators. Senate #RussiaGate has 7.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Ivanka Trump elicited groans and hisses on Tuesday from some members of the audience at a conference in Germany after she defended her father’s attitude and record on women, calling him a “tremendous champion” of families.

An entrepreneur and an adviser to the president, Ms. Trump, 35, was in Berlin to represent the United States at a meeting on female business leaders.

Speaking on a panel that included Angela Merkel, the chancellor of Germany, and Christine Lagarde, the managing director of the International Monetary Fund, Ms. Trump was asked about her role in the White House and President Trump’s previous comments about treating women disrespectfully.

Her father has been “a tremendous champion of supporting families and enabling them to thrive,” Ms. Trump said. That comment prompted some members of the audience to groan and hiss.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/25/w...smtyp=cur&_r=0

[FlameOn]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

So should we read this as Chaffetz finally putting country over party? Cause that would be bigly incredible.

I think this is him putting self preservation over country and party. This is fallout he doesn't want his name attached to.

[troutman]

Trump blocked by so-called Judges again, for his sanctuary city Order. So much winning:



https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/a...-federal-judge

Then, militia group posts Judges picture, address and phone #.
United Militias

@JYezman

[peter12]

Originally Posted by GGG

If the US gets rid of their Corn and Soy subsides and requires reasonable water treatment of its oil resources maybe we can sit down and talk about the elimination of subsidies and quotas.

Long term true free trades under universal standards would be fantastic but the US protectionism and pork will be a nightmare to get rid of.

No. They are a huge economy, and we are a small dependent economy. We can tow their line a little bit more.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

Or, considering that the US has a 400 Million dairy trade surplus with Canada and that Wisconsin alone produces as much milk as what Canada produces, we can tell Trump to pound sand

Get with the times? This system has been in play since the 70s and NEVER caused any issues until Trump decided to stump for it...

Nato spending is something i thing is a fair point and could be discussed, but the Dairy "tiff" is a manufactured wedge issue that Herr Leader has manufactured so he can look tough on foreign trade....its a supply issue, and if the US is producing more milk than it can find buyers for that's their issue.

No, Canadian supply management is a joke. I am not saying he is right, but we could make moves in the general direction of opening up dairy markets to global competition, and guess what, you and I would be far better off.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by troutman

Trump blocked by so-called Judges again, for his sanctuary city Order. So much winning:

Then, militia group posts Judges picture, address and phone #.

but, Muslims.

[FlameOn]

Originally Posted by troutman

Wil Wheaton‏Verified account @wilw
Your reminder that Republicans put party ahead of country: House Benghazi committee had 46 investigators. Senate #RussiaGate has 7.

Nice info-graphic on GOP intransigence about Russia investigation comparing this to past investigations. GOP is just stalling.



http://fingfx.thomsonreuters.com/gfx...1Q6/index.html

[troutman]

President Donald Trump is averaging 2.2 false claims per day.
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...k-updates.html

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by peter12

No, Canadian supply management is a joke. I am not saying he is right, but we could make moves in the general direction of opening up dairy markets to global competition, and guess what, you and I would be far better off.

As long as you and I are not dairy farmers, because otherwise kiss your livelihood goodbye. Supply management is very successful at ensuring the market doesn't get oversaturated with product and drop prices to the point where the only ones that can make a viable profit are the giant corporations who rely on the economies of scale. Very successful program for ensuring that massive corps don't dominate our food industry while allowing enough profit for families to survive.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by belsarius

As long as you and I are not dairy farmers, because otherwise kiss your livelihood goodbye. Supply management is very successful at ensuring the market doesn't get oversaturated with product and drop prices to the point where the only ones that can make a viable profit are the giant corporations who rely on the economies of scale. Very successful program for ensuring that massive corps don't dominate our food industry while allowing enough profit for families to survive.

How much did you get paid for this blatantly ridiculous and false post?

[FlameOn]

Originally Posted by peter12

How much did you get paid for this blatantly ridiculous and false post?

Originally Posted by peter12

No, Canadian supply management is a joke. I am not saying he is right, but we could make moves in the general direction of opening up dairy markets to global competition, and guess what, you and I would be far better off.

I would not say that is false or ridiculous and maybe you should take a look at the facts first. It doesn't look like we would be far better off at all. Take a look at this case study from dairy deregulation across the world in the EU, Australia, UK, etc. Studies support his claim.

In the UK case, deregulation led to a sharp decrease in the number of farms that consolidated into huge numbers cows per farm. Drinking milk prices remained flat for the consumer while producer prices decreased. Deregulation hurt farmers in the UK overall until subsidies were put back into place afterwards while giving a huge foothold to foreign producers.

The deregulation era in the United Kingdom had significant impacts on the dairy
industry, which did not succeed in its attempt to continue growing over the last
20 years.

However, the impact on producers has been mitigated due to subsidies
and due to the emergence of direct contracts with retailers. The farms still operating
today are larger and more productive. They still benefit from the government
support through Common Agricultural Policy budgets. Cheese imports, in particular,
have strongly increased and foreign processors leveraged the weakness of the local
industry to gain solid establishments.

As for local processors, they particularly
suffered through these changes. We will now have to wait to assess the impact of
the quotas abolition in Europe, which also applies to the United Kingdom.

Producers:

• Strong decrease in the number of farms after deregulation
• Decreased total milk production despite the allocation of
  additional quotas
• Remaining producers are more profitable, partly due to CAP
  subsidies on which they are more dependent

Retailers:

• Gain of negotiating power through direct supply from
  producers

Consumers:

• Drinking milk price relatively stable, even when producer prices
  were decreasing

Findings from the Boston Consulting Group Study on dairy deregulation:

• Producers Consolidation and shift toward low-cost regions
• Increased pressure on small and local processors, consolidation
  and arrival of new entrants
• Benefit the most from the opening, due to an access to several
  supply sources, part of the gains are protected
• Limited impact except through some decrease of retail prices
• Depending on the desire to keep a dairy industry, intervention
  is materialized through substantial measures to support the
  sector

Results for the Canadian Dairy Industry as a whole:

The situation in Canada differs from the situation in the majority of benchmarked
countries, mainly due to the proximity of the United States, given that it has a dairy
industry about 11 times larger than Canada, operates at more competitive costs and
could represent a real alternative to supply Canada.

• The equivalent of the whole Canadian dairy livestock exists within 250km of Canadian
  plants at a lesser cost;
• US plants also have lower costs and can competitively supply the Canadian market;
• 10 billion litres of exported products could be redirected toward Canada;
• Canadian consumers are already used to buying US branded products and could do
  the same for dairy products;
• 24% of food products consumed in Canada already come from the United States.
  An immediate opening would put 40% of the Canadian dairy industry at risk
• In the case of raw milk price convergence, 37% to 50% of farms would be at risk
  (between 4,500 and 5,000 farms). This amounts to 40 % of production;
• Drinking milk volumes are more protected because raw milk prices are higher, and
  transportation costs offset the low processing cost advantage of US plants;
• The processing of industrial consumer goods would be more likely to shift toward
  the United States (cheese, butter, yogurt);
• Part of the value at risk would be transferred downstream from processing and
  production;
• The benchmark does not enable us to determine which part of that value, if any,
  would be passed on to the consumers through a price decrease.
  Finally, an opening of the system would represent a risk of net loss of $2.1 to 3.5 B for
  the Canadian GDP and would threaten 24,000 direct jobs
• $1 to 2.4 B of value is at risk of being transferred downstream from processing and
  production: the benchmark does not enable us to determine whether the profit
  would be passed on to the consumers through a retail price decrease;
• Other possible impacts: $6 to 7 B at risk (potential loss) for the banking sector due to
  loans to insolvent producers, economic and social impacts on municipalities, political
  risk, etc.

To me that reads deregulation of the industry will lead to minimal changes in pricing for the consumer and will squeeze out local producers and competition in favor of higher yield industrial farms with higher profit going to retailers. Regulations help keep local industries alive based on political will to support those measures at a national level.
http://www.agropur.com/pdf/Analysis_...nudstry-EN.pdf

I am not saying that there the supply management system we have in place is right, but deregulation of the industry worldwide has clearly brought about changes that would be detrimental for local producers. Except in New Zealand which benefits from near perfect year round grazing conditions. We would end up with worse quality milk with significantly more hormone content (less regulations around that in the States), at the similar costs, while driving local producers into the ground for American profits. Remind me why Canadians would want that?

EDIT: I did not expect to ever spend two hours of my life reading about cows and milk. Ever.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by peter12

How much did you get paid for this blatantly ridiculous and false post?

Man, you play a slippery game.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by peter12

No, Canadian supply management is a joke. I am not saying he is right, but we could make moves in the general direction of opening up dairy markets to global competition, and guess what, you and I would be far better off.

Global competition?! for milk?!

You hear a lot of squawking about this from the perspective of Australia or New Zealand for example - but that's just more hot air and political bluster...

How in god's name is a perishable item going to go from halfway across the earth and be cheaper that what can be produced here?

Fact remains, the Canadian market produces only the dairy products that Canada can consume; it doesn't export the stuff...or is very limited in that

As previously stated, the US has a 400 Million dairy trade surplus with Canada... surplus.

I'd gladly pay a the extra $0.25-50 on a litre of milk if it means ensuring that the dairy producers of canada actually have jobs.... And no, I absolutely disagree that "you and I would be far better off" by destroying our dairy industry so we can save a couple of bucks on our grocery bill...

No.

I have zero intention to "Make America Great Again" on the ruins of Canadian Dairy Farmers...

[direwolf]

More evil s--t from team Trump and the GOP. I don't think any of us should be surprised at this point, but still, what a bunch of d-bags. Hopefully this won't make it past Congress.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7701631.html

Donald Trump plans to strip all funding from a State Department bureau that promotes the rights of women around the world, it has emerged.

Oxfam America led criticism of the move, saying said cutting funds for the Office of Global Women’s Issues would have “dire consequences for millions of people, as well as our global standing”. Documents first leaked to Foreign Policy showed plans to reduce the office’s 2016 budget of $8.25 million (£6.43 million) to zero in 2018, though the President’s budget will still have to make it past Congress.

“It’s clear that women’s empowerment and gender equality are on the chopping block in this budget,” Oxfam vice president for policy, Paul O’Brien, said.

Oxfam’s intervention came as Mr Trump tweeted he was “proud” of his daughter Ivanka “for her leadership” on women’s empowerment.

Leaked budget documents show the President also intends to strip funding from a series of other soft-power and scientific programmes within the State Department - including slashing two-thirds of the Bureau for Food Security's resources, and 95 per cent of funds for the Bureau of Oceans and International Environmental and Scientific Affairs.

The $2.5 million budget for USAID's work with blind children is also set to disappear, according to the leaked documents. USAID is the agency that administers American foreign aid.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Ottawa, Ontario
April 25, 2017
Prime Minister Justin Trudeau spoke today with United States President Donald J. Trump.
‎
The Prime Minister and the President reaffirmed the importance of the mutually-beneficial Canada-US trade relationship. On the issue of softwood lumber, the Prime Minister refuted the baseless allegations by the U.S. Department of Commerce and the decision to impose unfair duties. The Prime Minister stressed that the Government of Canada will vigorously defend the interests of the Canadian softwood lumber industry, as we have successfully done in all past lumber disputes with the U.S. The two leaders agreed on the importance of reaching a negotiated agreement, recognizing the integrated nature of the industry between Canada and the United States.

The Prime Minister and the President also discussed Canada-US trade in dairy products, trade which heavily favours the US: Canada imports over $550 million of dairy products from the US, but exports just over $110 million to the US. The Prime Minister reaffirmed that Canada upholds its international trade obligations, including the North American Free Trade Agreement, under which the US continues to have duty-free and quota-free access for milk protein substances, including diafiltered milk, and that Canada would continue to defend its interests.

The Prime Minister and the President agreed to continue their dialogue on these important bilateral issues.