American Politics Thread: Orange is the new POTUS

[Senator Clay Davis]

Nevermind that Trump was against military intervention.

[Drak]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

He just cannot help himself

Trump is a fool

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by Makarov

In fairness, it was Obama's backing away from his "drawing a red line in the sand" rhetoric that left him vulnerable to criticism in that case.

well, I guess he should have went into Syria militarily then, so as not to leave himself open to criticism.

But hey, now Trump has the chance to fix those mistakes, which was why I wondered what he was going to do going forward. Fight his pals, the Russians in Syria?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

well, I guess he should have went into Syria militarily then, so as not to leave himself open to criticism.

Either that or not offered the ultimatum in the first place. Once issued, they had to follow through. It was definitely an error.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Either that or not offered the ultimatum in the first place. Once issued, they had to follow through. It was definitely an error.

So, he should have taken military action in Syria, because he made the mistake of saying that, to avoid criticism in the future?

Trump said he was going to torture people and kill the families of terrorists, and he hasn't done it. what a loser.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

The decision to engage militarily needed to be made prior to taking that stance publicly. Doing otherwise damaged U.S. credibility.

But if he did authorize an intervention, it wouldn't be to "avoid criticism" so much as to protect people from the horror of having chemical weapons used against them. Obviously. I can't even believe I have to write that.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

The decision to engage militarily needed to be made prior to taking that stance publicly. Doing otherwise damaged U.S. credibility.

But if he did authorize an intervention, it wouldn't be to "avoid criticism" so much as to protect people from the horror of having chemical weapons used against them. Obviously. I can't even believe I have to write that.

I see, he should not be allowed to say something and then realize it was a mistake, without following through on his original statement. Maybe he didn't have the support he counted on, who knows, maybe something happened to make the plans change.

Must be nice to never say something you later realized was a mistake.

What about all of Trumps claims? I mentioned 2, he hasn't followed through on. Does he operate at different standards than past presidents?

Anyways, it seems the Trump administration is not too concerned about it.

Secretary of State Rex Tillerson said on a trip to Turkey that the "longer-term status of President Assad will be decided by the Syrian people."

And in New York, US Ambassador to the UN Nikki Haley was even stronger about the Trump administration's decision not to push for Assad's departure.

"Our priority is no longer to sit and focus on getting Assad out," Haley told wire reporters last week, according to AFP.

"Do we think he's a hindrance? Yes," she said. "Are we going to sit there and focus on getting him out? No."

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

So, he should have taken military action in Syria, because he made the mistake of saying that, to avoid criticism in the future?

Trump said he was going to torture people and kill the families of terrorists, and he hasn't done it. what a loser.

To be fair Trump has killed the families of terrorists. Granted it was a horrible judgement call that resulted in needless deaths, strained relations, international condemnation and a reduced capacity for the United States to have operations in foreign countries, but he did kill the families... see sticking to your word isn't a good idea if your word isn't good to start with.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakla_raid

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

What about all of Trumps claims? I mentioned 2, he hasn't followed through on. Does he operate at different standards than past presidents?

What the hell? Wasn't everyone complaining about "whataboutism" from Trump supporters? No, he doesn't operate on some different standard; even if he did Trump is a disaster by any standard in this and basically every other possible way, but it's not at all relevant to what I posted.

I see, he should not be allowed to say something and then realize it was a mistake, without following through on his original statement.

####ing hell, does everything you post have to be a straw man? No wonder this thread sucks.

Your apparent failure to understand how taking a public position on foreign policy intervention - warning a country against taking certain actions and then failing to live up to that warning - does damage to your country's credibility is baffling. That isn't even a controversial statement.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Your apparent failure to understand how taking a public position on foreign policy intervention - warning a country against taking certain actions and then failing to live up to that warning - does damage to your country's credibility is baffling. That isn't even a controversial statement.

I agree, Obama agrees, it was a mistake, quit being Fox dramatic and move on, there's nothing anyone can do about it now.
There's a new sheriff in town now that will set all of the past administrations, wrongs to rights.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

####ing hell, does everything you post have to be a straw man? No wonder this thread sucks.

I think you quoted the wrong part there, try again.

[RougeUnderoos]

He is such a shameless person, no secret there and we all know that, but jesus. They are showing dead children being loaded into a van and the first thing he thinks is "Oh goody, something to blame on Obama!"

The only one happier about this is Bill O'Reilly.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

He is such a shameless person, no secret there and we all know that, but jesus. They are showing dead children being loaded into a van and the first thing he thinks is "Oh goody, something to blame on Obama!"

Multiple people here fell for it.
Trump is playing 4d chess. Lol.

[flizzenflozz]

Originally Posted by aaronck

I'm not being defensive! You're the one who's being defensive! Why is always the other person who's being defensive? Have you ever asked yourself that?

haha.. that was exactly what i was thinking of when i was watching that..

I couldn't stop imagining Jerry Lundergard in Fargo too.. I'm cooperatin' here! Darn tootin'.

What a P.O.S that guy is.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

He is such a shameless person, no secret there and we all know that, but jesus. They are showing dead children being loaded into a van and the first thing he thinks is "Oh goody, something to blame on Obama!"

To be fair even some democrats are criticizing Obama today, when Assad's regime first used chemical gas on his people breaking the famous red line something should have been done, even a small show of force like taking out a military airport under stealth would have sent a message but doing nothing but bartering with a crazy man showed
incredible weakness. and now that the Russians are there it's now a new ball game.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

To be fair even some democrats are criticizing Obama today, when Assad's regime first used chemical gas on his people breaking the famous red line something should have been done, even a small show of force like taking out a military airport under stealth would have sent a message but doing nothing but bartering with a crazy man showed
incredible weakness. and now that the Russians are there it's now a new ball game.

Oh for sure it was a terrible move on Obama's part, but the president really shouldn't be coming out with that as a response to an attack like this is all I'm saying. You'd think the president might have something of more substance to say, but instead he comes across like a child crying "I didn't do it!" as if that's the biggest issue.

It's not his fault. Everyone knows it.

You'd expect The Boss to be the boss. Sadly, none of us do expect that, and today is just another good reason not to.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

To be fair even some democrats are criticizing Obama today, when Assad's regime first used chemical gas on his people breaking the famous red line something should have been done, even a small show of force like taking out a military airport under stealth would have sent a message but doing nothing but bartering with a crazy man showed
incredible weakness. and now that the Russians are there it's now a new ball game.

I don't recall the timeline exactly but didn't Russia intervene with a peace initiative shortly after the gas incident, potentially forestalling US military action? Less a case of the US failing to take action and more of (maybe) being talked out of it?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by edslunch

I don't recall the timeline exactly but didn't Russia intervene with a peace initiative shortly after the gas incident, potentially forestalling US military action? Less a case of the US failing to take action and more of (maybe) being talked out of it?

Congress wouldn't debate it either Obama asked them for permission and they refused to table it

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Congress wouldn't debate it either Obama asked them for permission and they refused to table it

The president technically doesn't need Congress to launch a strike. Reagan didn't ask congress to approve the strike against Libya he showed them.

Obama was a good president in many ways but he was also weak militarily and had many foreign policy missteps. one could even say his handling of Syria showed Russian his weakness and paved the way for them to invade and annex Crimea. If that wasn't a show of weakness watching 300 people blown from the sky by a Russian missile and doing nothing certainly was.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

The president technically doesn't need Congress to launch a strike. Reagan didn't ask congress to approve the strike against Libya he showed them.

Obama was a good president in many ways but he was also weak militarily and had many foreign policy missteps. one could even say his handling of Syria showed Russian his weakness and paved the way for them to invade and annex Crimea. If that wasn't a show of weakness watching 300 people blown from the sky by a Russian missile and doing nothing certainly was.

And what was the correct response? WWIII?