[Trade] Sens trade Lazar and Kostka to the Flames for a 2nd + Jokipakka

[MacFlame]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

If Lazar can be a quality 3rd line winger that is a cheap contract, that will allow the team to spend additional funds on other needs like say keeping Mikael Backlund and may lessen the blow if they need to move a guy like Frolik or Brouwer to cut costs down the road.

That's very important.

Either way, we'll have a decent quick depth forward for the next 5-6 years.

Alex Chiasson is getting about 11 minutes a game right now. If Lazar can replace him on the wing and his ice time can be bumped up by about a minute or so per game, that's plenty of ice time for Lazar to develop and the Flames likely have an upgrade at the position. That's all I'm hoping for right now with this this trade. Anything over and above that is gravy...

[Heavy Jack]

Remember when Ferland had 10 goals in his first 145 games?? He has 7 in his last 12 and doesn't seem to be slowing down - I think for the short time being he's locked himself on that top line and I believe that could grow into a tandem like the 3M line if given the time.

I'm looking at Lazar's tough season here in much the same way I'm looking at Ferland and when you break down this trade it just makes a ton of sense for Calgary and the cost is relatively low. Jokipakka could have been had for free today and no one took him, our D is already deep enough as it is both in the NHL and with our prospects so Kevin is a none factor in this trade. Thor come back the other way is strictly a contract count thing I'm guessing and is an AHLer so again no real factor. So it's Lazar for a 2nd in a crappy draft... that's not bad value - actually much lower than it would have been at the start of the season for Lazar - so we should be starting a car or something right now I think.

Just my 5 cents... dammit I miss pennies, this is getting expensive.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Plus: When the Flames pick 30th Over-All in the 2017 Entry Draft, it'll be almost like picking in the second round! So there's that.

[Matty81]

Solid move from my perspective. He's an established NHL who has had an injury plagued year. He has shown that he can be a positive possession player who is good in his own end and put up 20ish points as his floor. Shoot right and isn't a big fighter but has some toughness. Perfect third liner, great penalty kill skillset and low salary cost with lots of years of control left.

That's what he has already shown he's capable of and he's only played 2.5 seasons in the league. Maybe his ceiling is even higher but if not, still good value imo.

Great way to invest a 2nd. As long as he returns to his form from his first two years he easily replaces Brouwer on the 3rd line RW slot at a much lower cost on the 3rd line.

[FireGilbert]

Originally Posted by reggie dunlop

plus: When the flames pick 31st over-all in the 2017 entry draft, it'll be almost like picking in the second round! So there's that.

fyp

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by FireGilbert

fyp

Duly noted

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I'm not even arguing that I don't like it, in fact, I'm actually saying there is a very solid chance I will like it, but I'm responding to the notion that 2nd round picks are valueless, or that it's just as easy to trade a player as it is a pick, or that it's a good thing to not have many quality prospects in the minors and other notions that some fans on this board have come to believe.

The Flames got into the position they were/are in because they failed to prioritize the draft, and now they are again deficit spending on draft picks to augment the roster. I don't necessarily disagree with that, it remains to be seen if Lazar will work out, but on the whole the Flames still need to be picking more frequently than their peers to find a diamond in the rough or two.

While I do agree with you.. I remember a dark time where we embarrassingly had just 3 draft picks playing on the Flames that was not too long ago.. we now have 8 - 7 forwards / 1 D - and then when you look at a guy like Hamilton where we traded a 15th overall and a couple of 2nds for a guy like Dougie we are basically just fast tracking those picks to get a young, talented guy that we could only hope would turn into a Dougie Hamilton. Sure it's a bit of a gamble but the Flames do have enough prospect depth to make a few of these trades now and when you look at a trade like this Lazar one I see it as the Flames investing in a higher percentage of a chance to get an impact player who is young still but ready now. Conny said the biggest thing they were looking for was a player that could help now and in the future, someone in the same age group as the core and Lazar is exactly that.

We still have our first, we have key prospects like Jankowski, Andersson, Kylington, Hickey all pushing (I really feel something special is in store for Phillips, the kid is a magician.. I think he's a potential Gem) so when I look at where we've come from via the draft 5 years ago, to where we've gotten now I can accept a trade like this a lot easier than I ever could have 5 years ago which is truly a nod in the direction of our scouting and development.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Plus: When the Flames pick 30th Over-All in the 2017 Entry Draft, it'll be almost like picking in the second round! So there's that.

Aw man, we're gonna lose in the Stanley Cup finals?!

....*edit aw man, someone else already caught this?

[Henry Fool]

Presumably they've scouted him and know where he is right now and still really like him.

Not knowing anything about Lazar beyond this thread, kind of sounds like a 50-50 deal at best. Can't help but feel that despite all the positivity about the trade here he kind of sounds like a bust. But like I said I don't know him.

I dislike the arguments devaluing the second round pick. You can always argue that dealing a second rounder for any mediocre NHLer is good value because of the odds. In general I'd rather they keep the pick and give themselves a chance to get lucky but we'll see.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I also wouldn't summarize the Lazar acquisition as deficit spending.

Lazar is still very much a prospect. Though he hasn't lit the world on fire yet, there are still very tangible skills that he brings to the Flames, with potential to develop further.

This isn't the Flames acquiring a rental. I much prefer this over Vrbata. Vrbata is OLD, has been inconsistent in the last couple of years, and would probably leave at the end of the season. This seems like a much more solid long-term investment in my eyes, especially since this draft is apparently a much weaker one.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by doctajones428

You sure put a whole lot of effort into a whole lot of nothing

You sure put a whole lot of effort into a completely useless post

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by doctajones428

You sure put a whole lot of effort into a whole lot of nothing

A bit of trivia. I appreciated it.

[Timbo]

In case I missed it.
Has anyone opposed to this given us a reasonable player that would be availabe as a later 2nd round pick in the 2017 draft as opposed to Lazar?

[LouCypher]

I didn't know anything about Lazar other than his name before today. I think he fits into what they need for prospects up front and fits into the lineup now as well as next year better than the 2nd rounder which would be a player a few years away. High price but justified IMHO when you see it as filling a need.

[Reggie Dunlop]

The news from Ottawa

http://www.ottawasun.com/2017/03/01/...t-the-senators

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

We still have our first, we have key prospects like Jankowski, Andersson, Kylington, Hickey all pushing (I really feel something special is in store for Phillips, the kid is a magician.. I think he's a potential Gem) so when I look at where we've come from via the draft 5 years ago, to where we've gotten now I can accept a trade like this a lot easier than I ever could have 5 years ago which is truly a nod in the direction of our scouting and development.

Yep, here's a bit of how our most recent draftees have been doing:

1 (6) - Tkachuk - LW on one of the NHL's most elite lines
2 (54) - Parsons - Wins everything
2 (56) - Dube - Silver medalist, outstanding at WJC
3 (66) - Fox - Hobey nominee, gold medalist WJC, crazy numbers in NCAA
4 (96) - Lindstrom - ???
5 (126)- Mattson - ???
6 (156) - Tuulola - Doing quite solid in 1st year in North America on Everett
6 (166) - Phillips - High scorer in WHL
7 (186) - Falkovsky - Giant yet quick dman who is somehow finding a goal scoring touch playing in the ECHL

Compared to the years before that, things look significantly more promising with this batch.

[bigrangy]

What gives me a little optimism:

In 20115-16, Lazar (as a 20 year old) was juggled around the lines to a ridiculous degree, and ended up playing mainly alongside noted sniper Chris Neil. He still managed to score 20 points.

Give him a stable deployment and I bet that he'd at least be able to do that for the Flames. He hasn't been put in a position to succeed and he still did. Bennett is going through the same bs this year, where he's played most of his games alongside the pile of trash that is Brouwer and the offensively inept Chiasson. You want some more production out of the guy but what do you expect when you saddle him with two of the worst offensive players in the league?

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

The news from Ottawa

http://www.ottawasun.com/2017/03/01/...t-the-senators

It looks like the link is no good or the Ottawa Sun server is down.

[Freddy]

I'm going to go full homer and suggest the Flames can win a championship running 2 Good Cop centres (Monahan & Jankowski) and 2 Bad Cop centres (Bennett & Lazar) in the future. The more I learn about Lazar the more I think both him and Bennett will flourish being a consistent identity of a heavy, drive the games tempo kind of presence down the middle.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by doctajones428

You sure put a whole lot of effort into a whole lot of nothing

That's pretty rude of you especially considering he put a lot of effort in the Deadline thread. His OP has contributed more to CP than you ever have.