[Trade] Sens trade Lazar and Kostka to the Flames for a 2nd + Jokipakka

[bubbsy]

I am OK with the trade. I would have been annoyed at spending this on any of the other options (vrbata, etc).

It would be awesome if he and Bennet could find some chemistry.

[Stay Golden]

The knock on Lazar was not being comfortable with Bouchers boring system.

Once Lazar has proven in practice he has caught on to the Flames system then and only then put him on the 4th line with Stajan and Bouma. Bump down Chaisson. Personally I like Freddie Hamilton over Chaisson.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

The only reason I don't like it is what that second rounder could have been used for as currency at the draft. You package up that second and next year's first or second and it could land you someting unreal that wasn't available at the trading deadline.

I mean I know that's a stretch, but we saw it here with Hamilton.

That said hope Lazar can find his potential here. I haven't watched him enough at the NHL level to know if hes even shown flashes of his junior career.

Couldn't that package be put together just as easily with Lazar as with a 2nd?

[StrykerSteve]

People aren't kidding when they mention Conroy and Lazar as two peas in a pod. What a great interview.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Couldn't that package be put together just as easily with Lazar as with a 2nd?

I don't know how Lazar is valued around the league. I guess if a team had him rated high. I do wonder how many other teams, if any, were trying to acquire him today.

Some teams would rather let their scouts do their thing with a draft pick. Picks over known prospects.

Will be interesting to see how he is used and what he is able to do down the stretch.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Couldn't that package be put together just as easily with Lazar as with a 2nd?

no, it can't.

Roster spots, max contracts, cap and salary all play a part in the consummation of a trade.

Also, not every team values every player in the same way. What if the team you want to include Lazar with thinks the flames overpaid with a 2nd? Does Lazar then carry that same value?

A team can absorb a draft pick without consequence, it's one of the reasons you see these trade returns primarily in the form of draft picks. I don't think there was a trade completed today where there was an imbalance of players on one end of the trade. Either 1 for 1 or a player for picks.

[EVERLAST]

I've seen enough of Chiasson and want to see Lazar in his spot on that line with a Bennet and Brower .

Lazar has some serious wheels

[Da_Chief]

Anyone have a link to Treiliving interview?

[StrykerSteve]

Originally Posted by getbak

Lazar interview: http://www.sportsnet.ca/960/the-big-...unity-calgary/

Treliving interview: http://www.sportsnet.ca/960/the-big-...-lazar-target/

Quoted for new page

[Reggie Dunlop]

When he's been cast in a leadership role, he's won championships. That's huge.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

no, it can't.

Roster spots, max contracts, cap and salary all play a part in the consummation of a trade.

Also, not every team values every player in the same way. What if the team you want to include Lazar with thinks the flames overpaid with a 2nd? Does Lazar then carry that same value?

A team can absorb a draft pick without consequence, it's one of the reasons you see these trade returns primarily in the form of draft picks. I don't think there was a trade completed today where there was an imbalance of players on one end of the trade. Either 1 for 1 or a player for picks.

Those two bolded bits really contradict one another.

Again, when we're talking about a late 2nd round pick in *this* draft, there's nothing saying if we were in the midst of a multi-part deal that we couldn't add a prospect that has as much - or more - value than this 2nd round pick in question. It's really not that valuable of an asset in and of itself.


Every trade is a calculated guess. I suppose we'll see... but the fact you find losing this 2nd round pick so troublesome seems really overblown.

[Gaskal]

We like, totally got ourselves Bergeron 2.0! Woo!

http://thehockeywriters.com/curtis-l...rice-bergeron/

In his first season, Lazar has already demonstrated that he can keep up with the speed of the NHL game, has the work rate and tenacity to play bottom line minutes, and that he can maintain positive possession numbers (50.8 SAT%) while also improving those who play with him (1.1 SAT Rel%). As we saw with Alex Barkov’s improved second half, after putting up good possession numbers but low point totals in the first fifty games, positive possession numbers are a good indicator of future offensive success. Simply put, Lazar is creating shots on net and that is how you score. Shoot enough and those shots start going in.

The less ideal player comparisons for Lazar are former Senators Mike Fisher and Antoine Vermette. Again, defensively responsible centers who can play in all situations, but ones whose point totals essential cap out between 40 and 50, unless of course you play a season with Rick Nash on your wing.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by VilleN

Secondly, a 2nd round pick will likely not play nearly as many games or put up as many points in the NHL as Lazar has, this is just a statistical fact (as has been pointed out previously).

It's a useless fact though when judging a trade. By that logic, we should have traded a 1st rounder for Iginla since most will never play as many games or have that production. Ok, that is extreme, but the point is, we don't get Lazar's past games or production. We get whatever going forward. Will he play more than another 177 games in the NHL? Will he give you better production than David Hale?

Everyone knows most 2nd rounders don't pan out. And looking at Lazar's adjustment to the NHL and his current production, he is close to busting.

Don't get me wrong, I am not against the trade. It's a complete unknown. It's not a mystery box for a boat. It's a mystery box for another mystery box, just one that we will know the contents of sooner. A 2nd round pick is like a $2 lottery ticket and this trade is like winning a free ticket. No one buys the ticket hoping they win another ticket, just like no one drafts in the 2nd round hoping for a player that can just make it past 150 games played.

At this point, it's just wait and see.

[Cambardi]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

The knock on Lazar was not being comfortable with Bouchers boring system.

Once Lazar has proven in practice he has caught on to the Flames system then and only then put him on the 4th line with Stajan and Bouma. Bump down Chaisson. Personally I like Freddie Hamilton over Chaisson.

https://youtu.be/4VV1PrbkK3E

Don't know how to embed.

[Geeoff]

a 40 or 50 point 2-way player like Vermette or Fisher sounds like a great return on a 2nd.

[1qqaaz]

I think he'll a great role player and he's just what the Flames need personality-wise.

But I just don't think he has much offense in him, at least at the NHL level.
Hopefully he can turn things around like Stone did

[tsquared1967]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

no, it can't.

Roster spots, max contracts, cap and salary all play a part in the consummation of a trade.

Also, not every team values every player in the same way. What if the team you want to include Lazar with thinks the flames overpaid with a 2nd? Does Lazar then carry that same value?

A team can absorb a draft pick without consequence, it's one of the reasons you see these trade returns primarily in the form of draft picks. I don't think there was a trade completed today where there was an imbalance of players on one end of the trade. Either 1 for 1 or a player for picks.

Toronto got Eric Fehr, Steve Oleksy and 2017 4th round for Frank Corrado who went to Pitsburgh.

Tampa got Mark Streit and gave Philadelphia Filippula, 4th round and conditional 7th.

[bluejays]

While I don't think the price paid was high (because of this years' weak draft), I do think giving up a 2nd rounder in any year for a guy who's played that many games and not shown anything, wasn't worth it. So it's far from the end of the world as I don't think they lost much, but I'd have preferred they hold the second to acquire some other body at the draft. I think Lazar's shown what he is, and those of us hoping for a reclamation project won't get what we're hoping for.

[taxbuster]

I'm going to figure that the general Flames brain trust - which seems to be quite a few people with direct knowledge of Lazar as a player - know a heck of a lot more about what he brings to the table than anyone here (certainly me). Given that, I'm thinking they paid what they consider a fair price, and I'm not sad about losing the pick.

The kid is obviously intelligent - think that will go well with GG - and he can yak the ear of Craig Conroy. Well-spoken and thoughtful. I'm thinking good things will happen with him here. Time will tell.

[thymebalm]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

a 40 or 50 point 2-way player like Vermette or Fisher sounds like a great return on a 2nd.

I see what you did there.