[News] Calgary Flames sat down with the league to talk about penalties drawn on the team

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by Locke

I was actually talking about people who were recently concussed.

Again, Dennis Wideman has had exactly one crazy incident in his 11-year NHL career.

Once in 11 years seems like 'not a lot.'

Should he not be given the benefit of the doubt, given the extenuating circumstances surrounding the incident, to be able to continue on his NHL career without reprisal?

Evidently not.

Doesn't mean you can go hurt people. It's not like he was thrown in jail for his actions, he was suspended, rightfully so.

It's like an accidental stick, sure you didn't mean it but it happened and you were caught and have to be penalized for it.

Concussed or not, he physically hit an official. What's the league supposed to say? "it's alright you were concussed." Don't think so.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Locke

Really?

I thought we had respect around here for people who arent responsible for their actions because of influences that are outside of their control?

He wasn't concussed so what are you getting at?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

Doesn't mean you can go hurt people. It's not like he was thrown in jail for his actions, he was suspended, rightfully so.

It's like an accidental stick, sure you didn't mean it but it happened and you were caught and have to be penalized for it.

Concussed or not, he physically hit an official. What's the league supposed to say? "it's alright you were concussed." Don't think so.

Sure, and I have no problem with that.

Its the: "Sure you were, now we're going to watch the Flames with a fine-tooth comb because Dennis Wideman is an unleashed psychopath' syndrome that I have issue with.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by monkeyman

fact: Bettman already said teams would be punished if he didn't get what he wanted. No new stadium=no all-star or other special NHL events.

Why would they want to hold marquee events at an old stadium? When they have better options.

Would it be different if you were choosing a venue for your special event, say a wedding? 30+ year old venue or less then 5 years old venue? We usually go for the new shiny thing, don't we?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

He wasn't concussed so what are you getting at?

Was he not?

I must have missed that official statement.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by Locke

Sure, and I have no problem with that.

Its the: "Sure you were, now we're going to watch the Flames with a fine-tooth comb because Dennis Wideman is an unleashed psychopath' syndrome that I have issue with.

Nah, that came from Flames defending the whole situation. Some times you got to cut your losses and look at the future.

The league will not admit to anything but the bias is obviously there because the Flames organization went as far as they did to overturn the suspension.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

Nah, that came from Flames defending the whole situation. Some times you got to cut your losses and look at the future.

The league will not admit to anything but the bias is obviously there because the Flames organization went as far as they did to overturn the suspension.

I'm sorry, based on the situation I dont see how you can blame the Flames Organization for defending their player.

Sorry man, I'm with the Flames on this one.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by Locke

I'm sorry, based on the situation I dont see how you can blame the Flames Organization for defending their player.

Sorry man, I'm with the Flames on this one.

No worries. I just think they didn't have to go as far as they did, appeal, if upheld you move on.

I'm just waiting to see if things will be different next year with no Wideman.

[monkeyman]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

Why would they want to hold marquee events at an old stadium? When they have better options.

Would it be different if you were choosing a venue for your special event, say a wedding? 30+ year old venue or less then 5 years old venue? We usually go for the new shiny thing, don't we?

I'd argue it's less about a stadium and more about the fan base. why not reward a fan base whose stuck with a team? lets be honest, 95% of the fans experiencing the all-star game is done so via television, their experience won't be affected one way or the other by the stadium. the other 5% will enjoy it regardless, especially in one of the strongest markets in the NHL.

[doctajones428]

I can't believe a storyline like this has been going on in a national league for a year now, this is some serious WWE stuff between the incident, the appeal, the vendetta on the team, the sit down meeting...

You know it's bad when CBC starts to call out the NHL's BS

[Robo]

Out of curiosity not that I would ever consider it. But is this something fans can actually sue the refs association or nhl for? I mean theses fans are paying big money to watch these games and for the most part they are getting screwed just as much as the team. Again I would never consider it myself but i was wondering if it actually could happen theoretically

[codynw]

http://elbownews.com/news/2017/2/19/...-for-officials

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

This meeting is all ass backwards by the Flames. The real controversy is all the hundreds of non calls that are clear infractions of slashing, hooking, holding the stick, interference and tripping that refs seem to flat out ignore. Pretend they don't see.
Every since the Flames backed Wideman on his stupidity this long list of garbage reffing has been ramped up.

And thus was born this frustrated version of Gaudreau that has let the bs non calls get into his psyche and hasn't recovered since.

That or its hand related, which traces straight back to the ignorance from guys in stripes for the entire 60 minutes of that match where there was ample foreshadowing in the dozen or so vicious hacks leading up to the finger breaker.

I'm almost not surprised Johnny has been in a funk for the most part given that the season opened with that hacking non-call to the McDavid gimme sequence and hasn't let up much since.

Though the whole team does need to let management take care of these issues with the officials and just come to expect it rather than get riled up each and every time. They need to just laugh it off. Keep playing, and let BB and Tree bombard the league with the footage until one of the boneheads realizes they're on to something.

[Bourque's Twin]

Everyone blames Wideman for the Flames' problems. Everyone is right.

[lazypucker]

Do you guys think the "curse" follows the team or the player? When Wideman moves on next season will the Flames be still cursed?

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by lazypucker

Do you guys think the "curse" follows the team or the player? When Wideman moves on next season will the Flames be still cursed?

I think the "curse" has less to do with Wideman, or the incident, and more to do with the fact that the Flames appealed the suspension. So, I guess I'm saying the it sticks with the Flames.

If I were an official, I'd probably be more butt hurt about the Flames backing the player than the actual incident it's self. I'm sure it's a combo of both tbh, but I'm willing the wager the bigger issue (in the officials eyes) was the Flames not just rolling with the suspension. I also think that if this were just about Wideman, at this point in time all we'd be seeing is Wideman getting the raw end of the stick, not the entire team.

[dying4acup]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

I think the "curse" has less to do with Wideman, or the incident, and more to do with the fact that the Flames appealed the suspension. So, I guess I'm saying the it sticks with the Flames.

If I were an official, I'd probably be more butt hurt about the Flames backing the player than the actual incident it's self. I'm sure it's a combo of both tbh, but I'm willing the wager the bigger issue (in the officials eyes) was the Flames not just rolling with the suspension. I also think that if this were just about Wideman, at this point in time all we'd be seeing is Wideman getting the raw end of the stick, not the entire team.

The Flames didn't appeal the suspension though. The player and the union did. The Flames (rightfully) supported their player.

This was a battle between the league and the union to set a precedent. There is a reason Vermette was only given a 10gamer for whacking an official. The league didn't want to get overturned again. Vermette has appealed, and I suspect he will lose.

I'm sooooooo over this whole incident. It's time everyone moved on! League, team, player, and officials.

Love or hate Wideman, it sucks that this issue is still a story line. It's like how Bertuzzi-Moore was a 10yr thing. At some point it's time to move on.

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I chose to show the last 3 seasons because the roster was roughly similar from year to year.

The numbers do not lie:
- The Flames going from 1st to 30th in minor penalties taken
- The Flames going from a generally positive penalty differential team to a significantly negative penalty differential team directly after the Wideman incident doesn't scream coincidence to me
- I've watched every game this season, the numbers seem to corroborate with the eye test from what I've seen

Most of the Flames top guys haven't shown a big increase in their penalty minutes though.

Guys like Giordano, Brodie, Backlund etc arent way up. A couple may be but you have guys like Gaudreau and Brouwer with minutes way down.

I'm looking at Bennett, Hamilton, Hathaway and Tkachuk as the main drivers in the increase in penalties. Tkachuk's number is pretty absurd for a guy that doesn't really fight.


Look at the guys the Flames moved at the deadline last season. Hudler, Jones, Russell, and Granlund. All super low pims guys. Who did they replace them with? Did Hathaway play more down teh stretch?

Maybe this needs to be looked into deeper before jumping to conspiracy theories.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Oil Stain

Most of the Flames top guys haven't shown a big increase in their penalty minutes though.

Guys like Giordano, Brodie, Backlund etc arent way up. A couple may be but you have guys like Gaudreau and Brouwer with minutes way down.

I'm looking at Bennett, Hamilton, Hathaway and Tkachuk as the main drivers in the increase in penalties. Tkachuk's number is pretty absurd for a guy that doesn't really fight.


Look at the guys the Flames moved at the deadline last season. Hudler, Jones, Russell, and Granlund. All super low pims guys. Who did they replace them with? Did Hathaway play more down teh stretch?

Maybe this needs to be looked into deeper before jumping to conspiracy theories.

Or, has been shown at post #12, you could compare the pre-incident PIMs +/- with the post-incident PIMs +/-.

[puffnstuff]

For the oiler fan, once again, its NOT the total number of penalties the Flames take thats the real issue here. Its the way in which things are being called.
Prime example. Lucic jabs Manning, Manning sells it. 2 for slashing, 2 for embellishment. Right?
The day before. Chiasson jabs Cousins, Cousins sells it at least as much.
5 for spearing and a game, no embellishment.
See the difference? Thats the issue.