[Rumour] Friedman: Flames trying to find a right shot d-man to play with Brodie

[heep223]

This seems so simple to me. Bump Engelland up to play with Brodie. Send Wideman far away or just sit him. 3rd pair have whatever combination of d-prospects you need and play them like 6 minutes a night in a super sheltered role until they prove they're ready for more.

Because Wideman continues to hurt this team and it's getting worse.

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Or you send a player who is also expansion eligible (ie Poirier) who we might lose in the draft and hope the d you pick up slides through. Or cut a deal with Vegas not to select the player.

I already said that you can cut a deal with Vegas in my post, but if it was that cheap to cut a deal why wouldn't these players original teams just cut those deals and keep those players themselves?

Hoping a player you acquire via trade a few months before the expansion draft is just bad asset management... imagine the optics for any GM that gives up picks/prospects and then loses said player in the expansion draft anyways.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by HappyGilmore

Am I the only one who thinks Brodie is grossly overrated? He flourished under Robert and that's all. Maybe the brass for Hockey Canada wasn't so out to lunch afterall with the snub.

You're gonna buy into one not great 2/3 of a season versus the 3-4 decent to elite ones that preceded it?

Yeah i think you're the only one.

People have short memories around here.

[Tron_fdc]

I'm fine keeping Wideman as a depth player if we make playoffs and can't trade him. As a depth player I mean we pick up a top 4 rental (keep in mind expansion draft) and he plays bottom 6, or in case of emergency/injury comes up to top 4.

If the right deal comes along move him. Don't do it just to get rid of the guy, he has more value than that to a playoff team as a depth player on an expiring contract.

Tricky situation for Treliving. He needs what everyone else needs, and no way do I want to get into a bidding war for someone we lose as a rental, or all of a sudden have to protect in the draft exposing Gio or Brodie.

[calumniate]

Also, Iggy wants out of Colorado. Maybe he could play d? Hehe

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by ClubFlames

What about Rasmus Andersson? I don't think we can trade Wideman, no value. Let his contract expire and start fresh with Andersson and Brodie as a pairing.

I think it's worth giving him a 'look' this month to test the organizational waters and see if they can fill the hole from within so as to avoid the whole expansion draft issue.

He's got excellent rookie stats.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

I'm fine keeping Wideman as a depth player if we make playoffs and can't trade him. As a depth player I mean we pick up a top 4 rental (keep in mind expansion draft) and he plays bottom 6, or in case of emergency/injury comes up to top 4.

If the right deal comes along move him. Don't do it just to get rid of the guy, he has more value than that to a playoff team as a depth player on an expiring contract.

Tricky situation for Treliving. He needs what everyone else needs, and no way do I want to get into a bidding war for someone we lose as a rental, or all of a sudden have to protect in the draft exposing Gio or Brodie.

Are we really at a spot in the rebuild to be spending the massive assets it would require to get a top four D-man just as a rental?

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

I already said that you can cut a deal with Vegas in my post, but if it was that cheap to cut a deal why wouldn't these players original teams just cut those deals and keep those players themselves?

Hoping a player you acquire via trade a few months before the expansion draft is just bad asset management... imagine the optics for any GM that gives up picks/prospects and then loses said player in the expansion draft anyways.

Maybe those teams don't have the assets or are willing to part with assets to protect said player from the expansion draft. We are losing assets for the draft regardless. We have built up some depth so we are perhaps in a better position than others to offer Vegas pieces to protect players we want to keep.

Yes, optics would be horrible if we traded for a piece then lost it. And maybe treliving or whoever is gm waits until after the draft as a result. But deals can be cut and we are one of the teams that is better positioned to do so given our depth.

[home_sweet_dome]

If the Flames are hell bent on keeping Brodie on the left side, the easiest in house solution is to move up Engelland to play with him for this season and try to find a better solution over the summer after the expansion draft issues are gone.

Brodie-Engelland a couple years ago when Gio got injured worked a lot better than Brodie-Wideman has this year.

[DJones]

I think we need a top 4 guy for at least the rest of this year and next.

Rasmus and Kylington look great but putting them in a top 4 role right now isn't very smart.

[Ozy_Flame]

Would love to somehow grab Brandon Carlo out of Boston. Big, young, stay-at-home defenseman that shoots right. Drafted in the 2nd round in 2015 and already has 12 points this year. A bit young to play top four right now, but I think this is the kind of defenseman we need to pair Brodie with. Perfect Engelland replacement.

[N-E-B]

The Flames have shown in the past that they're not afraid to sit Wideman. If they had a better option, they'd play him.

The fact of the matter is that our #4-7 defenseman are pitiful. Engelland has been great for what he is but he really isn't an upgrade on Wideman. Jokipakka, Kulak, and Wotherspoon have been terribly underwhelming. Andersson and Kylington clearly aren't ready or they'd be here right now.

The Flames don't have any better options right now and I don't think they'll have a better option until free agency. Like it or not, Wideman is here to stay this year. Perhaps they could flip him at the deadline for a pick if they retain salary, but there's no internal promotion coming.

[Harry Lime]

Short term option simply swap Englland and Wideman? Is the worry then that the third pairing would be too weak defensively? If Wotherspoon is our strongest purely defensive prospect, why not bring him up to play with Wideman. He has been around long enough that I don't think that there is a danger of bad tendencies being picked up.

Giordano-Hamilton
Brodie-Englland
Wotherspoon-Wideman

and just play the season out. Look for that D at the draft.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Lots of studies and coaching theory teach that LH defenceman on left side is best, particularly for the transition game, but overall in all three zones. It's not just the Flames who do this. Look at Babcock and the Olympic team.

See also:


https://hockey-graphs.com/2016/03/04...of-handedness/

http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/109...ded-defensemen

http://www.iplayhockey.ca/671/right-...t-handed-shots

Obviously everyone knows this is true in most cases. However, every situation is unique, and we know that Brodie performed exceptionally as a RD in the NHL for 3 seasons and has been poor to middling as a LD this season. Brodie has one of the best backhand passes in the league and that spin move he makes in the corner fools opponents consistently. But he can't do either with regularity on the left side. He is an elite RD and a borderline 2nd pairing LD.

[Erick Estrada]

If they are going to waste a season trying to convert Brodie to the left side we need to see some progress because if he's not adapted by training camp next season it's going to be rinse and repeat.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Are we really at a spot in the rebuild to be spending the massive assets it would require to get a top four D-man just as a rental?

Nope. As I said:


and no way do I want to get into a bidding war for someone we lose as a rental


I won't be surprised at all if we do nothing at the deadline. Unless of course Edmonton offers up Eberle for Wideman, and we pick up Mike Green for nothing. Neither of which is likely to happen though.

[robertsfanatic]

I would wager that if they don't trade Wideman by the deadline then they would be more inclined to sit him in the press box for games. I don't think they want to hurt his trade value by sitting him too much and as others have said, not sure there is an upgrade internally.

[northcrunk]

We need to get rid of Wideman ASAP. There is a shortage of D on the market. Move him now before more come available.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by heep223

This seems so simple to me. Bump Engelland up to play with Brodie. Send Wideman far away or just sit him. 3rd pair have whatever combination of d-prospects you need and play them like 6 minutes a night in a super sheltered role until they prove they're ready for more.

Because Wideman continues to hurt this team and it's getting worse.

BUT, he only hurts the team because of his contract. If he were being paid $1m, he's not that bad.


*ahem.

Serious point on Brodie; I think he flourishes on the right, because he prefers to have playing position open to the entire ice. When you're on the same side you shoot, your options are much more linear; North/South.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

Nope. As I said:


and no way do I want to get into a bidding war for someone we lose as a rental


I won't be surprised at all if we do nothing at the deadline. Unless of course Edmonton offers up Eberle for Wideman, and we pick up Mike Green for nothing. Neither of which is likely to happen though.

Mike Green, will never, play for the Flames.