American Politics Thread: Orange is the new POTUS (Archive)

[Red Ice Player]

Those that may be trying to be neutral on this subject have to realize that there can be no let up on Trump until he starts to behave like an adult with the most powerful job in the world, which won't happen, pretty clearly. To not critique every stupid dangerous thing he and his equally unqualified inner circle do or say would be to concede to Trump, accepting his post fact world as the new normal. This is not a normal presidency in any way, shape or form. The worst thing about this orange stain is the free pass the republicans will get as they plow through with their socially regressive agenda.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by GGG

I do think the media is continuing to fail at their coverage.

They should only ask policy related questions that specifically ask how it will affect average Americans. Informing people of the consequences of Trumps and Congresses actions is the only way to hold them to account.

The bickering over truth while it should be important isn't important with Trump. Maybe just run a fact check side bar. Or a CNN type scrawl at the bottom of the screen

The media has an obligation to do both. They have a responsibility to hold the powerful in check by insuring they tell the truth. When they fabricate information, that needs to be exposed as a lie and then show the negative impact it has on policy.

[Cube Inmate]

Originally Posted by GGG

I do think the media is continuing to fail at their coverage.

They should only ask policy related questions that specifically ask how it will affect average Americans. Informing people of the consequences of Trumps and Congresses actions is the only way to hold them to account.

The bickering over truth while it should be important isn't important with Trump. Maybe just run a fact check side bar. Or a CNN type scrawl at the bottom of the screen

What is the point of "asking questions" if you're going to just accept the lies and fact-check them later? If you've got "alternative facts" anyhow, then why bother with asking the liars to lie to you? Just say "the White House was not asked to comment because they lie anyhow."

That's not to say that "they lied again!" has to be the focus of every story in media. On that, I agree. But when a candidate has such an unabashed history of deceit, the fact that it's immediately continuing into his life as head of state IS the story, IMO.

[REDVAN]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Redvan, not sure if it should change what you're trying to do here, but two posters have already played this role recently. I get what you're trying to do and I don't doubt you're more sincere in your goal but Trump really is what he is.

You're suggesting that maybe the other side isn't being represented in a fair way, but there really isn't any fair way to represent Trump's "side" without outright lying or defending insanity. Some things you can take at face value, and the crazy you see before in the white house is what it is.

I'm not playing a role... I'm just asking if all the anger against him is justified. I am not pro-Trump, I am just less anti-Trump than most here I guess.

Originally Posted by KevanGuy

Trumps own words are what people are reacting to. Not sure how you're expecting people to react when he's lying and making BS up on a daily basis. How any reasonable person could take him seriously is a better question.

No one can take him seriously, it's hard to believe he was elected! But he certainly isn't helping his own cause, with the "alternative facts" and poor appointments. I think he is woefully unprepared for the job, and he has woefully under-prepared what little staff he did choose.

I still think some of what he says (if you can positively read between the lines) is worthwhile and could actually "Make America Great Again." But I gather most people (here, there and everywhere) see the negative buffoonery he's doing and just assume the worst. I guess I can't blame them, but it's such a poor outlook to have on a President in his 4th day of office.

Until something actually happens, I will reserve judgement. I don't care about American home ownership as I believe too many own homes as it is. I do think some of the Obamacare copay stuff is bad but that's just my Canadian bleeding-heart Liberalness.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Cube Inmate

What is the point of "asking questions" if you're going to just accept the lies and fact-check them later? If you've got "alternative facts" anyhow, then why bother with asking the liars to lie to you? Just say "the White House was not asked to comment because they lie anyhow."

That's not to say that "they lied again!" has to be the focus of every story in media. On that, I agree. But when a candidate has such an unabashed history of deceit, the fact that it's immediately continuing into his life as head of state IS the story, IMO.

Devil's advocate.... I wonder if (hope that?) this will truly turn out good in the end. Instead of just trusting what is being said and reporting on it as if it is fact, journalists/reporters will now have to dig for the truth... truly work for what the truth really is.

[REDVAN]

Originally Posted by Dogbert

Dude... Trump isn't mentally ######ed. Saying so merely displays your ignorance.

Trump is a con artist. His supporters are the mongs here.

Excellent point. But it worked on over half* of American electors.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by REDVAN

Excellent point. But it worked on over half* of American electors.

Not exactly like that's a very high bar, though...

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by REDVAN

Excellent point. But it worked on over half* of American electors.

And you're posting that as a......counterpoint? Support of Trump in a see of hate?

[Clarkey]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

So in the end Rubio ####s himself yet again, will vote for Tillerson anyway. I don't think there's much doubt, no one is even close to being a bigger loser out of this entire campaign back into 2015 than Marco Rubio. From GOP's great hope, to it's biggest #####. He should just resign from the senate now, his career in national politics is over.

I find your sexually charged, misogynist allegory to describe your point quite offensive. Why can't arguments on your side be fact based?

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by New Era

Well, he has signed an executive order making harder for first time buyers to afford a home. He has signed an executive order making abortions harder to get. Both affect the poor the most, and help hold the poor in their current situation. Beyond that, he's been one of the bestest presidents ever!

Mortgage insurance is not a human right, he just reversed an Obama order to lower it. Its very similar to CMHC increasing mortgage insurance.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Parallex

I see the orange buffoon used an executive order to withdraw from TPP today effectively killing the pact for everyone else...

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...-agenda-234040

... in fairness it was pretty much headed for death anyways but it's still a disappointment.

Awesome. Best thing Trump has done. Trade deals negotiated in secret are terrible for the middle class.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by New Era

The media has an obligation to do both. They have a responsibility to hold the powerful in check by insuring they tell the truth. When they fabricate information, that needs to be exposed as a lie and then show the negative impact it has on policy.

I don't believe they have the time to do both?

So if your goal is to inform the public and you have one question to you ask about the crowd size at the inauguration or do you ask how he plans to deal with x as a result of an executive order. Now if there are demonstrable lies about policy challenge away but the administration lying about the mundane has become a distraction to the damage that executive orders and the legislation congress is coming up with will cause.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Locke

The Federal Hiring Freeze makes a degree of sense though, if its done intelligently....I cant believe I even just said that.

Le sigh...

Actually, it is hilarious to me because under Obama the amount of public servants decreased substantially.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Azure

Awesome. Best thing Trump has done. Trade deals negotiated in secret are terrible for the middle class.

Generally not true. Most research on trade shows significant losers in affected industries with a general reduction in cost for all consumers. In general free trade has been found to be a net positive.

One of the more recent developments is that areas that are negatively affected don't just recover and produce other economic value like was originally expected.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by REDVAN

I still think some of what he says (if you can positively read between the lines) is worthwhile and could actually "Make America Great Again." But I gather most people (here, there and everywhere) see the negative buffoonery he's doing and just assume the worst. I guess I can't blame them, but it's such a poor outlook to have on a President in his 4th day of office.
.

Or like how he drained the swamp?
He's full of cliches and full of bs.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Here's another lie he just can't let go of.

Days after being sworn in, President Trump insisted to congressional leaders invited to a reception at the White House that he would have won the popular vote had it not been for millions of illegal votes, according to people familiar with the meeting.

Trump has repeatedly claimed, without evidence, that widespread voter fraud caused him to lose the popular vote to Hillary Clinton, even while he clinched the presidency with an electoral college victory.

Two people familiar with the meeting said Trump spent about 10 minutes at the top of the gathering with Republican and Democratic lawmakers rehashing the campaign. Trump also told them that between 3 million and 5 million illegal votes caused him to lose the popular vote.

The discussion about Trump's election victory and his claim that he would have won the popular vote was confirmed by a third person familiar with the meeting.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.bda590980092

[Senator Clay Davis]

Patience people, they'll be buy one, get six free soon enough.

[Roast Beef]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

Or like how he drained the swamp?
He's full of cliches and full of bs.

That makes no sense because he did drain the swamp, exactly as he said he would. He just didn't tell anyone that his version of the "swamp" were people that he considers losers. AKA non rich people, people that didn't financially support him, and people that were not "yes men". Given his previous behavior, his version of draining the swamp comes as no surprise.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

Here's another lie he just can't let go of.



https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.bda590980092

"Two people familiar with the meeting"

[Senator Clay Davis]

Anyways this fact check of everything Spicer is lying about regarding the inauguration sums it all up well (and is being amended to add his new lies). The summary is pretty solid:

This is an appalling performance by the new press secretary. He managed to make a series of false and misleading claims in service of a relatively minor issue. Presumably he was ordered to do this by Trump, who conjured up fantastic numbers in his own mind, but part of a flack’s job is to tell the boss when lies are necessary — and when they are not.

Spicer earns Four Pinocchios, but seriously, we wish we could give five.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.579198ee165d