Alberta Politics Thread

[Jason14h]

spending will have to come down substantially for the two to meet.

And there lies the problem!

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by GaiJin

Love this logic, we're a train wreck, but it's not as bad as the other train wrecks so keep on wrecking.
This thread should be renamed ground hog day.

Which states, in your opinion, are better governed, and provide a better quality of life for most of its citizens, than the train wreck of Canada?

I feel like some people have lost all perspective.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Makarov

Which states, in your opinion, are better governed, and provide a better quality of life for most of its citizens, than the train wreck of Canada?

I feel like some people have lost all perspective.

Lol. "Lost"

In all seriousness I think the biggest issue is people are letting their hatred of the NDP distort the facts, I like some things the NDP make a priority, but disagree with other things they do. I have no allegiance to any party, but I can't count the number of times posters in this thread and others have made claims that I'm a full fledged NDP koolaid drinker. Some people seem to think in politics you need to pick a team and support it no matter what.

[chemgear]

Originally Posted by Makarov

I feel like some people have lost all perspective.

I'd happily suggest that if you live in Canada, anywhere in Canada you are likely better off than 95% of the world's population. Hell, we might indeed be in the clear first percentile or even better.

I'd also argue that you could very easily say the same for the United States.

But that isn't a laurel I'd blindly rest on to wipe away our ability criticize and desire to have governments that govern logically and better than the one before it; just like my parents hoped and worked to give a better life for myself and my family enough though I hope I'm mature enough to recognize how damn lucky we already were.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

I can't count the number of times posters in this thread and others have made claims that I'm a full fledged NDP koolaid drinker. Some people seem to think in politics you need to pick a team and support it no matter what.

It's not necessarily that. When someone makes a point that doesn't seem logical, or the thought pattern behind it is either being explained poorly or not being explained at all, it is much more likely that said person gets written off as a mindless supporter of ______.

Simply speaking, if you're not good at justifying your position, it looks like you came upon it out of convenience.

[GaiJin]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

So every other province in Canada is a trainwreck. And presumably every country in Europe. And most, if not all the states in the U.S.

Alberta - that last free, good place on earth.

When are people in this province going to wake up to the fact that the energy industry gravy train is over? Not just in the private sector, but in the massive subsidy it pumped into our public services? Taxes and spending will have to come into alignment. And the gulf between the two is so huge that taxes will have to go up substantially and spending will have to come down substantially for the two to meet.

I don't disagree, I just chuckle at the "but we have this so don't mind the next ass raping".

[Flash Walken]

One man's ass raping is another man's Cancer centre.

[GaiJin]

Originally Posted by Makarov

Which states, in your opinion, are better governed, and provide a better quality of life for most of its citizens, than the train wreck of Canada?

I feel like some people have lost all perspective.

You've gone from all of Canada, then to States. Make up your mind what entity you want to argue about, I am really not interested in misdirection mouse trap conversations.

[GaiJin]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

One man's ass raping is another man's Cancer centre.

One mans subsidized solar facility is one mans Cancer centre .

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by chemgear

I'd also argue that you could very easily say the same for the United States.

I'm not actually confident that's true anymore. I would argue that the average person (and certainly those below the average) are markedly better off in Canada.

But that isn't a laurel I'd blindly rest on to wipe away our ability criticize and desire to have governments that govern logically and better than the one before it; just like my parents hoped and worked to give a better life for myself and my family enough though I hope I'm mature enough to recognize how damn lucky we already were.

Certainly. However, it does wipe away your ability to describe Canadian provinces as "train wrecks" or to suggest that marginal tax increases in the jurisdiction with the highest standard of living and the lowest taxes in Canada (the country with one of the highest standard of living on earth) is the end of the world.

I'm still waiting to hear the list of low tax states with high quality of life and just societies that we should be emulating. I could certainly propose some states even more social democratic than Canada (with higher tax burdens to match) that arguably have higher standards of living for the average person (onviously its a complex comparison but still an interesting discussion to have).

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by GaiJin

You've gone from all of Canada, then to States. Make up your mind what entity you want to argue about, I am really not interested in misdirection mouse trap conversations.

I'm curious to hear and discuss examples from either within or outside Canada.

[para transit fellow]

Originally Posted by GGG

Airlines and trucking companies implement fuel surcharges all the time to compensate for high gas prices and usually peg them to some gas price.

Yes it's marketing but it does allow them to keep consistent pricing accross multiple regulatory environments

I deal with five vendors that are still issuing the same fuel surcharge they initiated in 2007.

Funny how they never dropped their surcharge when the pump prices dropped...

.. and now they are going to raise that 2007 fuel surcharge another point to 16%

Truth is.... People lie.

[para transit fellow]

Originally Posted by Bownesian

So, Koch withdrew a 60000 bpd phased application in March, and an approved 10000 bpd pilot this month and added a new application for a joint venture 12500 bpd operation.

Is that a win in your books?

Wouldn't it have been better to have had all three?

Dude,

As I understand it, Koch recently applied for 10 - 12 projects... And dropped one.

I would say that was close to a win..

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Makarov

I'm curious to hear and discuss examples from either within or outside Canada.

No you aren't.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by transplant99

No you aren't.

I sincerely am. I can't promise I'll agree but I think it would be an interesting discussion.

[stampsx2]

Well goodbye canadian buissness. Trump is lowering corporate and small buisness tax's while canada continues to increase theirs. If a buisness could move south why wouldn't they now? In the mean time, u.s. markets are lovin' it.

Jack Mintz - Canada's about to get trumped.

http://business.financialpost.com/fp...o-ready-for-it

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Makarov

And yet Alberta still has the lowest corporate and personal tax burden in the entire country.

SOURCE: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgar...erta-1.3562716

The hyperbole in this thread is comical.

Oh my God...you have to be the third or fourth person to trot this nonsense out.

The report relies on data through 2011 for personal taxes and 2012 for business taxes.

Yup. 2011 and 2012. Nothing has changed since then. Or has it? No. Surely not!!

However, University of Calgary economist Trevor Tombe said its findings are likely still accurate.

"Overall, the report's pretty clear that the tax burden in Alberta compared to other provinces is much lower," Tombe said.

"And even the changes that we've seen over the last couple of years, that's not going to change that general conclusion. So taxes in Alberta are below average."

Nothing like being definitive right?

Sure, nothing much has changed right? Everything in Alberta is pretty likely the same as it was in 2011 and 2012?

No changes at all? Nothing?

All good, sorry for ever doubting. Oh! And I apologize for using my brain for thinking rather than trotting out tired old articles using outdated information about statistics that were used before....wait for it....

- Corporate Taxes Increased
- Personal Taxes Increased
- Property Taxes Increased
- Carbon Tax was invented

You're right! Everyone carry on with your regularly scheduled...whatever.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by cal_guy

What administration costs are you talking about. There's no way that an retail operation has a facility that emits more than 100,000 tonne of CO2e which would require emissions monitoring, and if did have a facility that emitted more than 100,000 tonne of CO2e they would already be paying the costs under the SGER.

They sell fuel.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by stampsx2

Well goodbye canadian buissness. Trump is lowering corporate and small buisness tax's while canada continues to increase theirs. If a buisness could move south why wouldn't they now? In the mean time, u.s. markets are lovin' it.

Jack Mintz - Canada's about to get trumped.

http://business.financialpost.com/fp...o-ready-for-it

Considering Trump's proposed tax rates would be at best near-even with Canada's, and in many cases still a decent amount higher (which the graph plainly shows, I don't know why Mintz glossed over that), I wouldn't be quite so dramatic.

Plus, if Mintz believes Trump will easily get exactly what he's proposing, then he should also believe that the American dollar is going to continue to rise and American exports are going to plummet.

Canadian businesses are welcome to become American and take advantage of a 0.7% better tax rate while losing significant margin and selling only to an American market that will be increasingly unable to buy American.

[Ozy_Flame]

Don't really care how bad the other provinces are doing, TBH. I believe Alberta is in a relatively unique situation with regards to the revenue/spending problem vs. natural resource base. Not sure there are other provinces we can look to for "get out of the hole" inspiration.

Quite worried about our debt servicing costs though ($1 billion this year) and skyrocketing fast. This in addition to the amount of borrowing. By 2018, the carbon tax revenue will barely be able to support the servicing costs if you look at the budget numbers as a whole. There has to be cost cutting measures because new taxes are barely going to do any damage.