PGT: President-Elect Donald J Trump

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by nik-

Your blood pressure is dangerously high from all that sodium.

You said something incredibly stupid. Own it and move on.

Originally Posted by zamler

I'm sure that prediction will be just as accurate as all the rest. As for the media what do you expect after they do stuff like this -
NY Times Calls Mrs. Trump a 'Mannequin' & 'Trophy Wife.'

If the press said that about Michelle Obama the media would be flinging #### for months if not years. 95% of the media has no credibility outside the echo chambers, including your favourite.

You're going to have to point out what collusion took place. Because a reporter contacted the Clinton campaign by email is not evidence of collusion. email is the primary way that reporters reach elected officials now, so I'm not sure what you think is wrong here? I'm sure that the exact same reporters contacted the Trump campaign in the exact same manner.

I also have to give you major props. Using two blogs run by conservative operatives as proof of this is amazing. An amazing example of confirmation bias. Even the conservatives make fun of the Independent Journal Review.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/03/bu...ervatives.html

On the bright side IJR did make the list of top fake news sites.

http://metro.co.uk/2016/11/16/full-l...avoid-6261851/

But it is important that we recognize media is not a problem. Journalistic integrity is not a problem. Not when we have this problem of disinformataion and blatant propaganda injecting itself into the political discussion. Right nik?

I will remind people that you are allowed to have your own opinion, but you are not allowed to have your own facts. These fake news sites are creating a shadow reality that is providing rubes with their own "facts." The information is never fact checked nor is cross referenced. It is yellow journalism at its worst. This is a serious problem as it directly impacts our democracy. No first world nation has maintained itself without a proper functioning free press. These sites are destroying the press and every responsibility the fourth estate has with the electorate.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

This is not a problem with the conservative media, this is a problem with for-profit media and the massive companies that own them.

CNN is more culpable for the decline in the standard of presented journalism that Fox News by a country mile.

I have to disagree with you Flash. Fox broke the system. CNN was once a good news organization, but Fox started beating CNN's ass in the ratings game, so CNN started to change and adopted the Fox methodology. The problem is they didn't have that strong dictator up stairs that could hold the whole thing together. Roger Ailes made Fox and was able to hold that ####show together. CNN chased Fox's example of how to make money, but the formula doesn't work for a diverse audience, and it blew CNN to pieces. You can't do journalism based on talking points unless you are speaking directly to a specific demographic. CNN never figured that out.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Things like this make me wonder about both the amount internal communications in Trump land and how much attention his own people pay to what he's doing. It seems to me a lot of it is "You're on your own and if you get asked a question just lie about it, if that doesn't work just decline comment and move on". Also one of Obama's final acts needs to be to put a wind farm at the White House and in front of every Trump golf property in America.



http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/21/bu...arm-fight.html

[AltaGuy]

That Trump is still only interested in his mediocre hotels and developments around the world despite the fact that he's about to become POTUS reaffirms my sincere belief that the man is actually, simply, and very much insane.

- President Trump, there's been another coup in Turkey! Thousands of people are feared dead!
- Oh crap, what's going on with the Trump-Constantinople hotel and casino?
- Sir, it's fine. It's been unaffected. What should I do?
- Get the prime minister of Turkey on the line: I need to make sure that hotel is protected at all costs! Get the general who led the coup on the line too, just in case.

[CliffFletcher]

The business model of the traditional media has collapsed, fatally undermined by Kajiji, Craigslist, and the move to online consumption. I know people who have worked in the media for 25 years and they admit this is the twilight of the newspaper as we know it. Most of their colleagues have been laid off and moved into corporate communications It's no longer a viable business. Not when the money from classifieds has vanished, and digital ads on websites earn a small fraction of what print ads earn (and that's even accounting for ad-blockers).

So the media that are left are desperately chasing an audience. And how do you appeal to a broad audience in this day and age? Sensationalism. Click-bait. Superficial coverage that generates heat without generating light.

That's the dilemma - behave like traditional news organizations did and have a tiny audience. Or let the market dictate your content, and become no different than any other online echo chamber resounding with bias and outrage.

Take the example of the Globe and Mail. As the online version became its main platform, it gradually shed the in-depth, fact and research-heavy pieces and replaced them with columns. And not even even-handed and judicious columns, but flat-out polemics meant to champion a cause or other and outrage any who disagreed. Great for generating clicks and angry rejoinders in the comments section. Problem is that people can get dogmatic jerimiads and calls to action from any of a limitless number of blogs and forums. And the reliance on columns only fuels the belief that newspapers are all highly biased, and are not credible on important issues.

So are the media acting against their own interests? Or do they recognize that the audience for serious, thorough, balanced news is vanishingly small, and not viable in any commercial sense?

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by New Era

I have to disagree with you Flash. Fox broke the system. CNN was once a good news organization, but Fox started beating CNN's ass in the ratings game, so CNN started to change and adopted the Fox methodology. The problem is they didn't have that strong dictator up stairs that could hold the whole thing together. Roger Ailes made Fox and was able to hold that ####show together. CNN chased Fox's example of how to make money, but the formula doesn't work for a diverse audience, and it blew CNN to pieces. You can't do journalism based on talking points unless you are speaking directly to a specific demographic. CNN never figured that out.

I think CNN started down that slope, then Fox upped the ante and they both slid down to rock bottom IMO.

I remember when Bush Sr. was pushing the War in the Gulf(tm) and CNN figured out how lucrative war was. They started increasing production values and making everything so dramatic. Every SCUD missile that flew overhead was the next Hiroshima. I swear some of the false alarms were complete fabrications. The commercials became longer and more produced as well until the War in the Gulf was more like a TV show.

Then the war ended and CNN became a big presidential cheerleader for Bush and Clinton and the news entertainment template was firmly in place. Then Fox News came along and started along the same path of news entertainment and both sides started to stake out their audiences. Whether this was the cause or a symptom of the post-9/11 polarization, I am not sure. Of course, it didn't help that the 2 guys who owned the networks were partisan clowns.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

So are the media acting against their own interests? Or do they recognize that the audience for serious, thorough, balanced news is vanishingly small, and not viable in any commercial sense?

Well that's just it, isn't it? People who are decrying the media aren't wrong... but how can you blame the media really?

At this point they're just giving people what they want. It's not about facts or "real" issues, it's appealing to the mob. It's pure pathos. Bread and games. Literally just giving people what they want to hear. It's not a right/left issue (though who did it first is questionable, the current form was definitely first popularised by Fox News). It's not even a new concept. This sort of thing has been going on forever, there is tons of evidence of it from the Cold War.

It's the same thing that carried Trump to the White House. Near-mindless pandering to emotion, to the point where policy didn't really matter.

There's still real news out there. Just like there are leaders with actual experience and thought-out policy. Problem is, you'll find neither with their own show on a major network.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Speaking of actual high quality journalism....

President-elect Donald Trump’s charitable foundation has apparently admitted to the IRS that it violated a legal prohibition against “self-dealing,” which bars nonprofit leaders from using their charity’s money to help themselves, their businesses, or their families.

That admission was contained in the Donald J. Trump Foundation’s IRS tax filings for 2015, which were posted online Monday evening at the nonprofit-tracking site Guidestar. A Guidestar spokesman said the forms were uploaded by the Trump Foundation’s law firm, Morgan, Lewis and Bockius.

The Post could not immediately confirm if the same forms had actually been sent to the IRS.

In one section of the form, the IRS asked if the Trump Foundation had transferred “income or assets to a disqualified person.” A disqualified person, in this context, might be Trump — the foundation’s president — or a member of his family, or a Trump-owned business.

The foundation checked “yes.”

Another line on the form asked if the Trump Foundation had engaged in any acts of self-dealing in prior years. The Trump Foundation checked “yes” again.

Such violations can carry penalties including excise taxes, and the charity leaders can be required to repay money that the charity spent on their behalf.

During the presidential campaign, The Washington Post reported on several instances in which Trump appeared to use the Trump Foundation’s money to buy items for himself, or to help one of his for-profit businesses.

But the new Trump Foundation tax filings provided little detail, so it was unclear if these admissions were connected to the instances reported in The Post.

The Trump Foundation tax forms did not, for instance, describe any specific acts of self-dealing. They also did not say whether Trump had paid any penalties already. That kind of detail would be submitted on a separate IRS form, which was not included in the information posted online Monday.

Spokespeople for Trump’s presidential campaign did not respond to a request for comment sent early Tuesday morning.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...dd0_story.html

[nik-]

Originally Posted by New Era

You said something incredibly stupid. Own it and move on.

Please. You just ignored the multitude of information that came out that painted Trump as garbage because he happened to win.

You're whining, and you sound as sad as the Trump supporters complaining about the media, own it and move on.

[photon]

Conway says Trump won't pursue prosecution of Clinton. Not sure if it's because he realizes that he's not the FBI or DoJ, or if he just realizes it's futile and divisive.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...dd3_story.html

EDIT: I like how she phrased that the lock her up stuff was just to win votes but he didn't really mean it: “Look, I think he’s thinking of many different things as he prepares to become the President of the United States, and things that sound like the campaign are not among them,”

[Senator Clay Davis]

Lock! Her! #### we got played. I hope they get used to the feeling of getting played.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by photon

Conway says Trump won't pursue prosecution of Clinton. Not sure if it's because he realizes that he's not the FBI or DoJ, or if he just realizes it's futile and divisive.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...dd3_story.html

EDIT: I like how she phrased that the lock her up stuff was just to win votes but he didn't really mean it: “Look, I think he’s thinking of many different things as he prepares to become the President of the United States, and things that sound like the campaign are not among them,”

I don't think it's Trumps decision one way or the other. He can request it, but ultimately the FBI or DoJ will make the decision to pursue or not pursue. Just one more example of how Trump doesn't really understand how government works and what the job of the president is.

I also like that he says he doesn't want to hurt them and they are good people, yet at least twice during the campaign, he joked about assassinating Clinton.

[nik-]

I dunno, from what we heard about the FBI, it seems like they would happily pursue it. The DoJ is another story obviously.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Early Trump cult consensus: He's saying he won't prosecute her so Obama won't pardon her and he can get her later on. In 40 years when she still hasn't been locked up, I wonder what they'll be clinging to then.

[SeeBass]

I believe the old saying did not apply to Trump's campaign.

"Never argue with someone who buys ink by the barrel"

I am surprised that it was a 70 year old man that proved it first.

[GGG]

The best part of this is Trump walking back the obvious lies. The worst part is it's replaced with hard right republicanism. Although as we discussed earlier the best case scenario for a Trump president is that he is a puppet.

[Kybosh]

I wonder if the Democrats are building a playbook to impeach him due to conflicts of interest and other potential transgressions, or if they're more ok with Trump as POTUS than Pence?

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by photon

Conway says Trump won't pursue prosecution of Clinton. Not sure if it's because he realizes that he's not the FBI or DoJ, or if he just realizes it's futile and divisive.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...dd3_story.html

EDIT: I like how she phrased that the lock her up stuff was just to win votes but he didn't really mean it: “Look, I think he’s thinking of many different things as he prepares to become the President of the United States, and things that sound like the campaign are not among them,”

From the mouth of Sarah Palin: "how's that hopey changey thing workin out for ya"

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Kybosh

I wonder if the Democrats are building a playbook to impeach him due to conflicts of interest and other potential transgressions, or if they're more ok with Trump as POTUS than Pence?

They will have to control the Senate first to get anything other than an acquittal on impeachment.

[Senator Clay Davis]

I would not even be slightly surprised if the Dems avoid impeachment altogether, and if the GOP tried to remove Trump that they sided with Trump to avoid Pence.