Kerry Concedes

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally posted by albertGQ@Nov 4 2004, 02:20 AM
At one point in time, homosexuality was also taboo, was in the form of abuse and not that common either. It has become more and more accepted and common nowadays. Who knows, maybe incest is following a similar but slower path.

At some points in history, homosexuality was also accepted in societies. For example, homosexual practices between warriors and young men training to be warriors was considered legit in ancient Mediteranean cultures. Alexander the Great is said to have had a male lover. I also read before that some aboriginal cultures in North America (pre-colonialism) accepted homosexuality.

Another quirky fact is that homosexuality is present in many animal species - not just human. Bonobo chimps are pretty indiscriminate when it comes to sex. Oddly enough, giraffes are another species that display quite a bit of homosexuality.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by albertGQ+Nov 3 2004, 09:13 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (albertGQ @ Nov 3 2004, 09:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-RougeUnderoos@Nov 3 2004, 08:10 PM
What effect would two twin brothers getting married have on me? None. How's that?

What effect does that have on this issue? None.

Since it has no effect on you, you probably vote for it right?

My scenario not having an effect on the gay marriage issue is your opinion [/b][/quote]
Actually it's my opinion that your twisted little marriage fantasy would never come to a vote because it is not within the realm of possibility therefore it is a pointless, useless, hopeless argument.

There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions of gay people in NA out there who want to get married. You've said repeatedly that you don't care what they do, but you'd still say they shouldn't do it.

If two insane twin brothers out there want to get married then well, that's their business. They can fight their own battles. Why you insist on tieing the real issue of gay marriage to some fantastic, fictional scenario is beyond me.

[albertGQ]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos+Nov 3 2004, 08:32 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RougeUnderoos @ Nov 3 2004, 08:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Since it has no effect on you, you probably vote for it right?

My scenario not having an effect on the gay marriage issue is your opinion

Actually it's my opinion that your twisted little marriage fantasy would never come to a vote because it is not within the realm of possibility therefore it is a pointless, useless, hopeless argument.

There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions of gay people in NA out there who want to get married. You've said repeatedly that you don't care what they do, but you'd still say they shouldn't do it.

If two insane twin brothers out there want to get married then well, that's their business. They can fight their own battles. Why you insist on tieing the real issue of gay marriage to some fantastic, fictional scenario is beyond me. [/b][/quote]
Just because it is not common in todays world does not mean it doesn't exist

[KootenayFlamesFan]

The question is; why is it illegal and what can be done to change that?

I assume it is illegal since incest can result in very deformed (physically and mentally) children. Why do you think it is illegal?

And then ask yourself why you shouldn't be able to marry your dog or cat or both.

Ummmm......ok.

'Why can't I marry my dog or cat or both?"

Answer..........because my wife probably wouldn't be cool with that.

Seriously.........why can't someone marry a cat or dog? Is it illegal?

Gay marriage has as little effect on me as someone marrying a cat so I should have no problem with that either, right?

If it is legal, why would I have a problem with someone marrying their cat? It's their life.......not mine. Unlike others on this board, I am not threatened with what other people do with their lives. If you want to marry a cat..........go to Veags with your cat. And put 20 bucks on red for me while you're at it.

There could be a lot of questions asked and they will be with time. When you think about it am I a free person if I am not allowed to do drugs in the privacy of my own home?

After the marrying the cat comment, why am I not surprised you do drugs?

And what does this question have to do with anything?

Some lawyers may have a good case with those and if you throw out religion and morals as your defense then what do you have left to keep things the way they are?

Nothing. Once again........I am NOT religious. I am not close-minded. Lots of things gross me out, but that doesn't mean I don't think other people shouldn't have the right to do it.

Heck, my wife grosses me out quite often.

I think those are valid questions, don't you?

Valid?...............sure, I guess.

Interesting?.........hell, yeah.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by albertGQ+Nov 3 2004, 09:35 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (albertGQ @ Nov 3 2004, 09:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Actually it's my opinion that your twisted little marriage fantasy would never come to a vote because it is not within the realm of possibility therefore it is a pointless, useless, hopeless argument.

There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions of gay people in NA out there who want to get married. You've said repeatedly that you don't care what they do, but you'd still say they shouldn't do it.

If two insane twin brothers out there want to get married then well, that's their business. They can fight their own battles. Why you insist on tieing the real issue of gay marriage to some fantastic, fictional scenario is beyond me.

Just because it is not common in todays world does not mean it doesn't exist [/b][/quote]
Okay. If they exist and they want to fight a legal battle for the right to get married then I won't get in their way. Again I gotta ask -- what does this have to do with the rather popular, legitimate movement to have gay marriage legalized? This movement actually does exist. The "twins marrying movement" has been very quiet -- so quiet that I'm almost positive they don't exist.

[albertGQ]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos+Nov 3 2004, 08:48 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RougeUnderoos @ Nov 3 2004, 08:48 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Just because it is not common in todays world does not mean it doesn't exist

Okay. If they exist and they want to fight a legal battle for the right to get married then I won't get in their way. Again I gotta ask -- what does this have to do with the rather popular, legitimate movement to have gay marriage legalized? This movement actually does exist. The "twins marrying movement" has been very quiet -- so quiet that I'm almost positive they don't exist. [/b][/quote]
Okay. I just wanted you to answer my question thats all. Of course the gay marriage topic is a hot topic because it is way more common. I never said it wasn't. But don't be surprised if one day incest marriage becomes a hot topic too. Most likely it won't, but there is a possibility. Decades ago, who would've thought gay marriages would be a hot topic during an election of the most powerful nation in the world?

Things change. All it takes is one wacko couple (twin sisters, twin brothers, whatever) to challenge it to the courts to make headlines

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by albertGQ@Nov 3 2004, 09:52 PM
Okay. I just wanted you to answer my question thats all. Of course the gay marriage topic is a hot topic because it is way more common. I never said it wasn't. But don't be surprised if one day incest marriage becomes a hot topic too. Most likely it won't, but there is a possibility. Decades ago, who would've thought gay marriages would be a hot topic during an election of the most powerful nation in the world?

Things change. All it takes is one wacko couple (twin sisters, twin brothers, whatever) to challenge it to the courts to make headlines

I will be very surprised if incest marriage ever becomes a hot topic. There just aren't enough lunatics to make a big deal out of it.

Anyway, "Sibling Marriage" has as much to do with "hetero marriage" as it does with "homo marriage". In other words, nothing. Your argument keeps tying them together though and really, it shouldn't.

Bla bla bla -- it's been fun. I'm going to read a book by a guy who wrote a story about a hotel in New Hampshire and, oh never mind.

[Red]

Originally posted by KootenayFlamesFan@Nov 3 2004, 08:42 PM
The question is; why is it illegal and what can be done to change that?

I assume it is illegal since incest can result in very deformed (physically and mentally) children. Why do you think it is illegal?

And then ask yourself why you shouldn't be able to marry your dog or cat or both.

Ummmm......ok.

'Why can't I marry my dog or cat or both?"

Answer..........because my wife probably wouldn't be cool with that.

Seriously.........why can't someone marry a cat or dog? Is it illegal?

Gay marriage has as little effect on me as someone marrying a cat so I should have no problem with that either, right?

If it is legal, why would I have a problem with someone marrying their cat? It's their life.......not mine. Unlike others on this board, I am not threatened with what other people do with their lives. If you want to marry a cat..........go to Veags with your cat. And put 20 bucks on red for me while you're at it.

There could be a lot of questions asked and they will be with time. When you think about it am I a free person if I am not allowed to do drugs in the privacy of my own home?

After the marrying the cat comment, why am I not surprised you do drugs?

And what does this question have to do with anything?

Some lawyers may have a good case with those and if you throw out religion and morals as your defense then what do you have left to keep things the way they are?

Nothing. Once again........I am NOT religious. I am not close-minded. Lots of things gross me out, but that doesn't mean I don't think other people shouldn't have the right to do it.

Heck, my wife grosses me out quite often.

I think those are valid questions, don't you?

Valid?...............sure, I guess.

Interesting?.........hell, yeah.

I assume it is illegal since incest can result in very deformed (physically and mentally) children.

So what, is it illegal to have deformed children? Can the government tell me what kind of children I have? There has to be more to that. I know what it is and you do as well, but it's a touchy reason, one that has been unsuccessfully used to deny gays marriage rights. It's religion and morals, both have been defeted by gay movement so what's stopping the other groups from pressing now? We can't stop it and time will tell that.



If it is legal, why would I have a problem with someone marrying their cat? It's their life.......not mine.

Ok, so you think it's ok to marry a cat. Interesting view of marriage.

After the marrying the cat comment, why am I not surprised you do drugs?

And what does this question have to do with anything?

If you can't answer the question just say so, but don't attack me for asking. And the question is valid, but only the very ignorant wold miss that.

Nothing. Once again........I am NOT religious. I am not close-minded. Lots of things gross me out, but that doesn't mean I don't think other people shouldn't have the right to do it.

Heck, my wife grosses me out quite often.

Being religeous is close minded? Which university did you learn that from?
If your wife grosses you out then it becomes quite obvious why you support gay/animal marriage :P
________
BODY SCIENCE

[albertGQ]

I assume it is illegal since incest can result in very deformed (physically and mentally) children.
So what, is it illegal to have deformed children? Can the government tell me what kind of children I have? There has to be more to that. I know what it is and you do as well, but it's a touchy reason, one that has been unsuccessfully used to deny gays marriage rights. It's religion and morals, both have been defeted by gay movement so what's stopping the other groups from pressing now? We can't stop it and time will tell that.

Another question that can arise from the incest marriage should be illegal because of deformed children is...what about the incest marriages that do not result in deformed children. I am talking about a mom (in menapause) with her brother or son, or a dad (that is sterile) with his sister or brother. Also what about gay incest marriages then? They don't result in deformed babies. Does that mean a man can marry his brother or dad? Does that mean a woman can marry her sister or mom?

A whole can of worms can be opened if/once gay marriages become legal

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally posted by Red@Nov 3 2004, 10:17 PM
So what, is it illegal to have deformed children? Can the government tell me what kind of children I have? There has to be more to that. I know what it is and you do as well, but it's a touchy reason, one that has been unsuccessfully used to deny gays marriage rights. It's religion and morals, both have been defeted by gay movement so what's stopping the other groups from pressing now? We can't stop it and time will tell that.



If it is legal, why would I have a problem with someone marrying their cat? It's their life.......not mine.

Ok, so you think it's ok to marry a cat. Interesting view of marriage.

After the marrying the cat comment, why am I not surprised you do drugs?

And what does this question have to do with anything?

If you can't answer the question just say so, but don't attack me for asking. And the question is valid, but only the very ignorant wold miss that.

Nothing. Once again........I am NOT religious. I am not close-minded. Lots of things gross me out, but that doesn't mean I don't think other people shouldn't have the right to do it.

Heck, my wife grosses me out quite often.

Being religeous is close minded? Which university did you learn that from?
If your wife grosses you out then it becomes quite obvious why you support gay/animal marriage :P

So what, is it illegal to have deformed children?

No. When the hell did I say it was? Obviously, the chances of having deformed children through an incestial relationship is much, much, much, much higher than other relationships. That's why I said I assume that's why it is illegal.

Can the government tell me what kind of children I have?

What are you talking about?

Ok, so you think it's ok to marry a cat. Interesting view of marriage.

If it is legal to marry a cat, then yes........marry a cat. Obviously night and day between a person and an animal and 2 humans. Right now, I am for 2 homosexuals being able to marry. Not tough to understand.

If you can't answer the question just say so, but don't attack me for asking. And the question is valid, but only the very ignorant wold miss that.

Anyone else spot the irony in this statement?

So......I can't attack you, but I'm ignorant.

Being religeous is close minded?

The vast majority of people against gay marriage hide behind the bible. The bible tells them what to feel, they don't think for themselves.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally posted by Red@Nov 4 2004, 04:17 AM
Ok, so you think it's ok to marry a cat. Interesting view of marriage.

See, the problem with this scenerio is that cats are unable to consent to a marriage and therefore a marriage could never be legal since in our society, consent is necessary for legal marital union and to consummate the marriage.

The only valid scenerios are ones involving situtations that are already legal.

[MrMastodonFarm]

I have got to hand it to AlbertGQ, he has no credible arguments, he has no legs left to stand on, and he stopped making sense a long time ago, but yet he is still going. I think even Jordon in is heyday would have stopped long ago.

[albertGQ]

Originally posted by MrMastodonFarm@Nov 3 2004, 10:10 PM
I have got to hand it to AlbertGQ, he has no credible arguments, he has no legs left to stand on, and he stopped making sense a long time ago, but yet he is still going. I think even Jordon in is heyday would have stopped long ago.

You want to start again?

Your ONLY points for supporting gay marriages is that it is between two individuals and that it does not affect you. I brought up another scenario with the exact same points yet you dismiss them as different.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally posted by albertGQ@Nov 3 2004, 11:30 PM
You want to start again?

See, Jordon would be proud!!!

[albertGQ]

Originally posted by MrMastodonFarm+Nov 3 2004, 10:31 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (MrMastodonFarm @ Nov 3 2004, 10:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-albertGQ@Nov 3 2004, 11:30 PM
You want to start again?

See, Jordon would be proud!!! [/b][/quote]
You're the one that started it up again. I am just happy to oblige

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally posted by albertGQ@Nov 3 2004, 03:58 PM
Lesbians are okay and ******s are not. IMO

With gems like that, I don't need to argue anything with you to prove I'm right. You have shot yourself in the foot to many times to count already.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by MrMastodonFarm@Nov 3 2004, 11:10 PM
I have got to hand it to AlbertGQ, he has no credible arguments, he has no legs left to stand on, and he stopped making sense a long time ago, but yet he is still going. I think even Jordon in is heyday would have stopped long ago.

Not so fast -- his side does deserve some credit. They've turned the issue of consenting, rational, normal adults marrying each other into a theoretical argument a possible Man/Feline wedding ceremony. That's pretty slick.

In other news, some people think that certain large breeds of dogs should be banned but I think that would lead to extremely high gas prices. I mean if you won't allow certain breeds of dogs, what next?

[Daradon]

Originally posted by albertGQ+Nov 3 2004, 11:30 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (albertGQ @ Nov 3 2004, 11:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-MrMastodonFarm@Nov 3 2004, 10:10 PM
I have got to hand it to AlbertGQ, he has no credible arguments, he has no legs left to stand on, and he stopped making sense a long time ago, but yet he is still going. I think even Jordon in is heyday would have stopped long ago.

You want to start again?

Your ONLY points for supporting gay marriages is that it is between two individuals and that it does not affect you. I brought up another scenario with the exact same points yet you dismiss them as different. [/b][/quote]
Sigh, only in your mind do the two have any similarity. Many people have debated against you on this topic and you just keep throwing out ridiculous what if scenarios that have no chance of happening. The gay marriage thing works as a large rule. The scenarios you put out are individual cases, so the incest does not work as a large rule.

Not only that, but in the course of these debates we have found your position to be a little selfish as you pick and choose which of your religions rules are truly important, and which can be bent and broken. IE Gay sex wrong, since it's easy for you to not do, but pre-marital sex not so wrong, since it's hard to avoid. Don't you think that Gay sex for gays would be just as hard to avoid for them as premarital (or sex at all) would be for you?

ON TOP OF ALL THAT, you even joked that two women would be more desirable then two men because it's not as disgusting. You later retracted that statment, but that just seemed to prove to all of us that your position isn't backed by logic, or even religious dogma, but an outright fear and disgust.

Drop it. I think it's fair to say you lost. And if you truly believe you've made your point, then just be happy with that.

EDIT: Spelling grammer

[albertGQ]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos+Nov 3 2004, 10:37 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RougeUnderoos @ Nov 3 2004, 10:37 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-MrMastodonFarm@Nov 3 2004, 11:10 PM
I have got to hand it to AlbertGQ, he has no credible arguments, he has no legs left to stand on, and he stopped making sense a long time ago, but yet he is still going. I think even Jordon in is heyday would have stopped long ago.

Not so fast -- his side does deserve some credit. They've turned the issue of consenting, rational, normal adults marrying each other into a theoretical argument a possible Man/Feline wedding ceremony. That's pretty slick.

In other news, some people think that certain large breeds of dogs should be banned but I think that would lead to extremely high gas prices. I mean if you won't allow certain breeds of dogs, what next? [/b][/quote]
Just because you feel my example is not related to yours does not mean it isn't.

BOTH cases involve two consenting human beings of legal age
BOTH cases does not affect anyone else
BOTH cases does not result in deformed babies
Gay example involves non related people where the incest one does

Similarities??? Yes
Differences??? Sure

Although the two scenarios are not identical, they are comparable

[MrMastodonFarm]

Daradon, well said man. Some of the things AlbertGQ has said over the last couple of threads has made me just shake my head in disgust. Anyone who continues to make an arguement in the hypothetical as much as he does clearly doesn't have a leg to stand on.