[News] Grossmann on waivers. UPD: Assigned to Stockton

[devo22]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Why do people think Vegas wants our bottom defenseman so bad? We are last again in GA and Vegas will ignore the rest of the better defenseman out there to take Kulak or Jokipakka? Highly doubtful they even take a sniff at any of our non protected defenseman.

A lot of overrating by Flame fans. If they leave our forwards alone and take one of Kulak or Jokipakka then that's great news for Flame fans.

because the Flames can protect almost every forward that's worth protecting. Jokipakka is a solid 4/5 and Kulak has top 4 upside. Why wouldn't those players be appealing to Las Vegas?

[CsInMyBlood]

Plus Jokipakka and Kulak have youth on their side.

LV may take a boatload of dmen only to package them up in trades for quality forwards later.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Why do people think Vegas wants our bottom defenseman so bad?

- Because they are on the correct side of Age 25, which fits the needs of a first time building team

- Because we have some uninspiring forward depth available for selection, with the exception of protection no-brainers (Bennett, Gaudreau, Monahan, Backlund) and exempt guys (Tkachuk, Jankowski, Klimchuk, Mangiapane, Dube)

- Because moving the puck is the single most impactful element of defensive play (aside from the obvious positioning/stickwork), something George McPhee is historically aware of, and both Jokipakka and Kulak have shown a first pass that could help a rebuilding team. Kulak moreso.

- Because the very few teams that have four bonafide top 4 D (like Nashville) will protect 8 skaters.

We are last again in GA

Yes, our PK (Engelland, Giordano) and top 4 (Giordano, Brodie, Hamilton, Jokipakka/Wideman/Engelland) have not been up to snuff.

Kulak however, has a 5v5 GA60 rate of 1.30 which is just... not correlated with our problems keeping the puck out of the net (he also has very little to do with our PK, and the one PK on-ice fail he did have was on Engelland primarily). He's a bottom pair D now, but very likely to be an effective top 4 by February or March.

and Vegas will ignore the rest of the better defenseman out there to take Kulak or Jokipakka?

Vegas is going to draft 8 to 12 defensemen, 2-3 goaltenders, 15-20 forwards in the expansion draft. Considering we have one of the worst expansion-eligible forward groups in the league past the first seven (Gaudreau/Monahan/Bennett/Backlund/Ferland/Frolik/Brouwer), it seems likely we lose a defenseman over a forward, considering we don't have a forward to expose that a team actually wants in a 3-7-1, and 8 skaters makes no sense for us either as we have four forwards, three D, and one G that are protection no-brainers.

At this point Kulak, Jokipakka, and Shinkaruk are the only expansion-eligible guys that a team might actually want, and if Shinkaruk actually plays well enough to deserve getting selected we can easily expose Brouwer or Frolik and not lose a wink of sleep over it as they are 3rd line wingers on player-friendly contracts, whereas Kulak is not dethroning Giordano, Brodie, or Hamilton as those three would get scooped up in a heartbeat.

[Iceman90]

Hi Ho! Hi Ho! It's off to Stockton he goes.

[Stealth22]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

It was a stupid decision to bring him in, waste time looking at him, signing him, playing him and watching opposing players skate around him like a pylon.

What other season destroying decisions can they roll back now? And is there enough time?

My apologies if this has been posted already, but some of you guys need to chill out a little re: the Grossmann signing.

http://flamesnation.ca/2016/10/13/wh...klas-grossmann

Should he have gotten as much ice as he did? No, I won't argue with you there. But I can understand the reason for signing him.

[wooohooo]

Is there a reason why we couldn't have just signed Nakaldal to the same contract instead of Grossman?

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

Is there a reason why we couldn't have just signed Nakaldal to the same contract instead of Grossman?

Nolan Patrick?

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

Is there a reason why we couldn't have just signed Nakaldal to the same contract instead of Grossman?

Yes. Johnny Gaudreau.

Gaudreau signed after Nakladal signed with Carolina.

Flames were in talks with Nakladal in the off-season. They were very close to the cap while still waiting for Johnny to re-sign (given what they were thinking Gaudreau was going to eventually re-sign for). Carolina signed Nakladal on Oct 9. Gaudreau re-signed in Calgary on Oct 10.

Treliving wasn't able to sign (or re-sign) anyone around that time as it wasn't a sure thing that Gaudreau would have re-signed for the amount he did.

At that point, who else is out there that would be willing to sign for league minimum to help bring the Flames up to literally thousands of dollars short of the cap?

Also, some people seem to think that the Flames should have put Smid on LTIR before the season started so that the Flames had 3.5 million worth of cap room. That is not how LTIR works.

You can not put anyone on LTIR before you declare your roster. You have to set your roster, THEN Smid can be assigned to LTIR. Smid has to be on the opening roster before he can go on LTIR. That is why Grossman's contract was given and allowed the Flames to be as close as possible to the cap, so that when Smid goes to LTIR the Flames can claim the full amount of cap relief.

LTIR doesn't give you extra cap space. Smid's cap hit still counts. What LTIR does is the flexibility to use those dollars to replace Smid. You can't do that until AFTER the opening day rosters are set.

So for those claiming that signing Grossman was a stupid move, I can't think of any other players that the Flames could have signed that were smarter moves to help them get closer to the cap - as of October 10th when Gaudreau finally re-signed anyways. Nakladal was gone by then.

[Freeway]

And Nakladal probably wouldn't have wanted a league-minimum one-way contract.

[wooohooo]

Originally Posted by Freeway

And Nakladal probably wouldn't have wanted a league-minimum one-way contract.

He's making $600 000 and Grossman is $575 000. But thanks for the info! As disappointed as I am not having Nakladal there, I'm happy with Kulak

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Nolan Patrick?

Having a crappy 7th D is the key to winning the draft lottery

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

He's making $600 000 and Grossman is $575 000. But thanks for the info! As disappointed as I am not having Nakladal there, I'm happy with Kulak

Apparently the Flames only had 583K in cap space before signing Grossmann

[sureLoss]

James Mirtle @mirtle
Grossmann clears waivers today. No one placed on them.

[jg13]

[foshizzle11]

Now, will he be assigned to Stockton?

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

Is there a reason why we couldn't have just signed Nakaldal to the same contract instead of Grossman?

No reason they couldn't have. Problem with Nakladal is he's a right shot dman and that means he's behind Hamilton, Engelland and Brodie (if Brodie plays the right side) and fighting with Wideman. We didn't really need 5 guys who prefer playing RD.

When Treliving was unable to move Wideman this summer that unfortunately meant no spot for Nakladal.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

No reason they couldn't have. Problem with Nakladal is he's a right shot dman and that means he's behind Hamilton, Engelland and Brodie (if Brodie plays the right side) and fighting with Wideman. We didn't really need 5 guys who prefer playing RD.

When Treliving was unable to move Wideman this summer that unfortunately meant no spot for Nakladal.

Also, just my gut feeling, but I think they wanted someone that they could put on waivers and not fear someone picking him up. That way they wouldn't lose the cap benefit of signing him and they wouldn't have to find a replacement for that benefit.

It's a fine line to find a player that has NHL experience, but can be sent down and called up at will. I feel Nakladal would be claimed at that price.

[polak]

Nak has only played 3 games for Carolina this season. Is he hurt?

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by polak

Nak has only played 3 games for Carolina this season. Is he hurt?

From what I understand no. He is being consistently healthy scratched.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

I don't know why people are celebrating. He's going to clear and go to Stockton and he's probably first call up with any D injuries.

Unlikely. Grossman is almost certainly done in the NHL. His signing, as noted, was a cap maximization measure, and is no longer a concern now that Smid is on LTIR. His only other attribute was size, and that has been shown to be a liability rather than an asset. There is no longer any reason to have him around in Calgary.

The only scenario where I could see Grossman recalled would be if Engelland were to go down with injury and Gulutzan wanted to give the "big = good" thing one more kick at the can. In any other scenario I would see Wotherspoon as the #1 call-up right now. Maybe Kylington if they think he's ready for a cup of tea. Outside shot: Keith Aulie since he has 150 NHL games. He would have to be signed to an NHL deal first though.