The Human Camera

[Clarkey]

Getting your kid vaccinated will not give them autism!

It just so happens that the signs of autism start to manifest themselves at the same age that children go in for their shots. This is why the shots have been blamed. It's a correlation not the cause.

Actually there may not even be a correlation, there was a study released not long ago that did a test for autism among vaccinated children and unvaccinated and the unvaccinated actually were found to have a slightly higher incidence of autism.

This is one of those old wives tales that took off.

[Looger]

Originally Posted by Clarkey

Getting your kid vaccinated will not give them autism!

it may raise the risks.

was that study focused on mercury-based vaccinations?

something tells me mercury = bad. call me crazy.

[AC]

My friend's older brother has autisim and taught himself to read by watching the scrolling news channel (4...?) as a child. Quite fascinating.

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Looger

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20IhxCzeuDU

this is a serious issue, there's a lot of bad stuff in our vaccines.

a message board is a great place to inform people aboot things they're not aware of.

don't like it, IGNORE IT.

this is a MESSAGE BOARD.

That's fine, but if you want to rant about vaccines, how about starting a new thread rather than hi-jacking this one?

[Knut]

Quite frankly.... mercury from old fillings is probably more of a culprit than vaccines... the length of time they are in the body, as well as the amount of mercury is much greater.

Fact is... why risk having a child get an illness such as tetnus or diptheria?? these illness' have a much greater impact on the health of a child than autism would. Mumps, Measles and rubella is another shot that can prevent a potential fatal illness in a child. Last is checked, Autism is not fatal.

You have to look at all things objectively....

For me i take all vaccinations but the flu vaccine... why?? because the flu is an ever evolving entity that from year to year is different.. i dont feel that the risk of the flu shot itself is worth it.

[Looger]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

That's fine, but if you want to rant about vaccines, how about starting a new thread rather than hi-jacking this one?

thought it was relevant to the thread.

more relevant than this post of yours.

[JimmytheT]

Originally Posted by Looger

it may raise the risks.

was that study focused on mercury-based vaccinations?

something tells me mercury = bad. call me crazy.

Your lack of the most elementary knowledge in chemistry is astounding.

Lets look at a chemical analogy:

Chlorine (Cl) on its own is extremely toxic. Pure sodium (Na) is also very harmful.

Salt, or Sodium Chloride (NaCl) however, is not toxic (though too much of it will dehydrate your body) as it is in just about everything you eat.

There are compounds that contain the mercury ion(s) that are also similar to salt, in that Mercury on its own is toxic, but in certain compounds is not toxic, given the appropriate levels.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

That's fine, but if you want to rant about vaccines, how about starting a new thread rather than hi-jacking this one?

The guy is autistic and Looger posted something about autism. I don't see the big hang up... If anyone's derailing the thread its the people who are peed off at his attempt to inform people (whether he's right or wrong).

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

The guy is autistic and Looger posted something about autism. I don't see the big hang up... If anyone's derailing the thread its the people who are peed off at his attempt to inform people (whether he's right or wrong).

I agree with you, and Looger; he posted some very interesting links.

I just thought this thread would be more about "The Human Camera", Kim Peek (who was apparently painfully shy until "Rain Man" came out, and the attention brought him out of his shell) and others who are amazing, and less about pulling the thread into the issues with childhood vaccines.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

I agree with you, and Looger; he posted some very interesting links.

I just thought this thread would be more about "The Human Camera" Kim Peek (who was apparently painfully shy until "Rain Man" came out, and the attention brought him out of his shell) and others who are amazing, and less about pulling the thread into the issues with childhood vaccines.

He is pretty freaking awsome, I'll chime in with the rest, I am very impressed. Makes you wonder what else the human brain is capable of...

[Looger]

Originally Posted by JimmytheT

Your lack of the most elementary knowledge in chemistry is astounding.

wow. i'm going to go home and cry.

you trying to actually get a dignified response?

i'll give you one anyway. this time.

Originally Posted by JimmytheT

Lets look at a chemical analogy:

Chlorine (Cl) on its own is extremely toxic. Pure sodium (Na) is also very harmful.

Salt, or Sodium Chloride (NaCl) however, is not toxic (though too much of it will dehydrate your body) as it is in just about everything you eat.
There are compounds that contain the mercury ion(s) that are also similar to salt, in that Mercury on its own is toxic, but in certain compounds is not toxic, given the appropriate levels.

http://www.anr.state.vt.us/dec/ead/m...2003-06-30.htm

Dr. Bress commented that research had been done evaluating ethyl mercury and methyl mercury and that each of these forms of mercury reacted somewhat differently in the body. This, he felt was significant in connection with mercury in vaccines. Mercury is included in vaccines as a preservative. When a large quantity of biological is made, there is a need for some type of anti-bacterial agent. . Ethyl mercury is generally utilized in vaccines as the preservative. The issue with mercury is the build up in the brain. There are two factors that allow mercury to cross the blood brain barrier so mercury can enter the brain- one is the size of the molecule and the other is the solubility and decomposition. Methyl mercury is more stable in the body that ethyl mercury. The methyl mercury molecule is very similar to the amino acid, methionine. There is an amino acid pathway to the brain and the barrier simply thinks the methyl mercury is an amino acid. In metabolism, ethyl mercury breaks down more quickly. Both compounds metabolize to elemental mercury.
Ethyl mercury is less toxic than methyl mercury. Ethyl mercury concentrates in the kidney. The studies in Iraq were based on methyl mercury levels. The actual calculated risks of ethyl mercury in vaccines, in Dr. Bress' opinion, are a lot less than anticipated. Many studies have been conducted to link mercury exposure to autism. Dr. Bress feels that although the cases of autism may be linked to the vaccine, that the mercury is not the issue.

that last bit is kind of interesting - most of what i've heard on the subject suggests that the mercury is one of the problems.

here is some other related research, the second link talking aboot thimerosal as a valued preservative in vaccines that sit for awhile.

http://www.mercola.com/2000/feb/6/mercury.htm

http://www.mercola.com/2002/jun/8/mercury_vaccines.htm

yes, the mercury is in a compound.

what happens after that compound enters the body, however, is what's interesting.

compounds do break down you know.

what rate does this compound break down?

pretty 'astounding.'

[Shazam]

Some European countries banned vaccines containing mercury. Their rates of autism still went up.

Going back to the original topic, I hope I'm never in a locker room with him.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Some European countries banned vaccines containing mercury. Their rates of autism still went up.

Going back to the original topic, I hope I'm never in a locker room with him.

Not that I doubt you... but Looger's provided a ton of supplementary info/studies... do you have one that shows that their rates went up? Which vaccines did they ban? Was it because of the mercury content? Are the increased rates of autism in the same countries that banned the vaccine (Europe can be a big place)?

[Looger]

http://www.immunize.org/catg.d/4038myth.htm

The EPA looked closely at a study performed in Iraq where pregnant women were exposed to large quantities of methylmercury that had been used to fumigate grain. The EPA then estimated the lowest dose of mercury that was found to cause neurodevelopmental delay in the fetus whose mother ingested this seed grain. From this they calculated the lowest dose of methymercury that could possibly harm an unborn child. They then divided this dose by a safety factor of ten to determine the lowest acceptable dose of mercury.
There are many problems with using the study in Iraq to determine levels of thimerosal in vaccines that would be safe in children. First, thimerosal doesn't contain the form of mercury that contaminates the environment. Environmental mercury is usually methylmercury, whereas the mercury contained in vaccines is in the form of ethylmercury. Ethylmercury is excreted in the urine more quickly than methylmercury and is less likely to accumulate in the body. Second, vaccines are administered to children after, not before, they are born. The nervous system of a child is still developing early in a woman's pregnancy, but by the time a child gets a vaccine, the nervous system is more mature and, therefore, much less likely to be susceptible to the harmful effects of mercury. Third, by including a safety factor of ten, the EPA estimate was very conservative

some interesting things i'd never read, contesting what i had posted.

just think how much useful discussion would happen on this site if i wasn't insulted for bringing things up.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Not that I doubt you... but Looger's provided a ton of supplementary info/studies... do you have one that shows that their rates went up? Which vaccines did they ban? Was it because of the mercury content? Are the increased rates of autism in the same countries that banned the vaccine (Europe can be a big place)?

I'm too lazy to do it right now. I just read through a very long thread on another forum dealing with the same issue.

Anyhoo, I'll dig up the links people posted there when I feel like going into that rabbit hole again.

[troutman]

Scientists retract study suggesting vaccine, autism link

http://www.cbc.ca/news/story/2004/03...ion040303.html

The majority of researchers who wrote a study that fuelled fears a childhood vaccination was possibly linked to autism have renounced that interpretation.

Ten of the study's 13 authors have signed a retraction to the journal The Lancet, which published the paper in 1998.

Wakefield and another investigator, Peter Harvey, did not sign the retraction. Team member John Linnell could not be contacted by the 10 who signed.

Richard Horton, editor of The Lancet, said the journal hopes to publish responses from Wakefield and Harvey shortly.

On Feb. 23, the journal's editors posted an online statement saying Wakefield was being paid by lawyers for parents who allege their children were harmed by the immunization.

Horton said if editors had known of the conflict of interest at the time, the journal would not have published the study.

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/short/347/19/1477

This study provides strong evidence against the hypothesis that MMR vaccination causes autism.

http://www.chop.edu/consumer/jsp/div...c.jsp?id=75752

Conclusions
The following studies all support the fact that autism occurs during development of the nervous system early in the womb:

• The genetics of autism
• The timing of the first symptoms of autism (home-movie studies)
• The relationship between autism and the receipt of the MMR vaccine
• Structural abnormalities of the nervous system of children with autism
• Thalidomide and natural rubella infection

Unfortunately, for current and future parents of children with autism, the controversy surrounding vaccines has caused attention and resources to focus away from a number of promising leads.


http://www.immunize.cpha.ca/english/...se/res-mmr.htm

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPr...mu/autism.html

No Evidence of Link
Some parents of children with autism believe that there is a link between measles, mumps, rubella (MMR) vaccine and autism. However, there is no sensible reason to believe that any vaccine can cause autism or any kind of behavioral disorder. Typically, symptoms of autism are first noted by parents as their child begins to have difficulty with delays in speaking after age one. MMR vaccine is first given to children at 12-15 months of age. Since this is also an age when autism commonly becomes apparent, it is not surprising that autism follows MMR immunization in some cases. However, by far the most logical explanation is coincidence, not cause-and-effect.

The Bottom Line

There are no proven data to suggest that measles vaccine will increase the risk of developing autism or any other behavioral disorder [28]. The known benefits vastly exceed any unknown risks. The CDC continues to recommend two doses of MMR vaccine for all children who do not have a known medical contraindication; the first dose is recommended at 12-15 months of age and the second dose is recommended at either 4-6 years of age or at 11-12 years of age [30,31].

[Looger]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Not that I doubt you... but Looger's provided a ton of supplementary info/studies...

we better get an expert here, i confess to doing the White Doors knowledge post, as in google!

[Shazam]

One thing I do find silly about that whole thing, why even use that stuff in the first place? Use something else instead. Even if it costs more, I'd be more than willing to pay whatever the heck the difference is.

[Tower]

The medical community is a business.

There is a lot of information on Vaccines. A lot that is not shown. I did the readings. I spent countless hours educating myself on it before I made an INFORMED CHOICE.

I have not given my children any shots and I choose not to. You can get the same protection from homeopathics and they do not contain the toxic chemicals that vaccines contain.
Ask yourself this - why does a 2 month old baby need the same amount in a shot as a full grown adult?
What keeps the virus week so your body can fight off the virus thus making you immune?
How do you get tetanus? This one makes me laugh. No it's not a rusty nail. Doctors I talked to don't know this one, which is scarier than tetanus.
The immune system is not developed at 2 months of age - so why not wait till they are two.
SIDS is virtually disappeared in Japan. (They don't vaccinate - if you want one, your child is must be 2yrs old.)
There is more.!!!!
eg. Polio vaccine is a huge failure. (It will be abolished by 2000)
When it was made in the 50's there were approx 1000 people in N.A. with polio. After the inoculations (only given to the wealthy) the amount of polio went up to 100 000 people. Because of the boast they "redefined" polio and created Viral Meningitis as the weakened polio strain. To have Polio you had to show signs and symptoms of the virus for 1 month! The next year it went down to approx 100 people - wow!!!! (This is written from memory 8 yrs ago so numbers might be a bit off.)

There is much more for this “Theory” called vaccines

It's a business.

[Shazam]

You can get the same protection from homeopathics

I use ancient wikkan techniques myself. Screw the "homopaths"!