[PGT] Flames defeat Canucks 2-1

[Cantrader]

Originally Posted by heep223

Parsons reminds me stylistically of Jonathan Quick. I have high hopes for him!

I think Parsons had surpass Mason Macdonald in the depth chart. Mason has not looked good for the last little while.

[Bingo]

Compared to say Sam Bennett two years ago I just don't think Tkachuk is ready. I think he's better served going back to junior and then on the WJC.

His speed to get in on the forecheck isn't there.

But beyond that his quick speed to get into the corner quickly, maybe the better word is anticipation, just isn't there yet.

That isn't to say he's not going to be a great young player, but I think he's over matched as of now.

[442scotty]

Originally Posted by Crumpy-Gunt

As much as I love the potential 2nd line of Tkachuk - Bennett - Brouwer...something tells me Brouwer will probably play on the 1st line at some point.

I dont see Chaisson/Shinkaruk/Vey being the guys we put with our 1st line duo but who knows.

I remember hearing the coach talk about pairs. I'm thinking to start it will be
Monahan/ Gaudreau.
Bennett/Brouwer.
Backlund/Frolik.

Curious to see if the lack of 1st line RW options will prompt Glen to put Troy on the 1st line. Maybe it will be Shinkaruk or Tkachuk playing the off wing. But I dont see Chaisson/Vey being those guys.

While Jankowski is a centre I'd like to see them at least try him on right wing with Johnny and Mony. Might be interesting...

[Jiggy]

Originally Posted by Cantrader

I think Parsons had surpass Mason Macdonald in the depth chart. Mason has not looked good for the last little while.

Mason hasn't looked great, but when it comes to goaltenders everything is up in the air. They just have a different type of development curve compared to other positions. I wouldn't give up on Mason just yet.

[gunnner]

Just watching the replay of the game now. I can see how people are on both sides of the fence on Tkachuk for staying or going. Liked Ferland tonight.

On another note, I was in the minority at the time and i probably still am, but I think if we will regret the Granlund for Hunter trade. I still think Granlund should have been put on the wing, and he will end up having a decent NHL career.

[FBI]

Yeah granlund looked way better than I thought he would unfortunately.

[Yamer]

[sa226]

How quickly we forget.

Granlund always had flashes of brilliance, where we wondered just where he would slot in, just what he could become.

Then he would fade into irrelevance. He isn't good enough to be a consistent top 6 player, and he's out of place in the bottom six. I think if he finds full time NHL employment, it will be on below average teams that have the space to slot him in the top six, where he will get the minutes, but not the success.

The Shinkaruk trade was a win for the contract situation alone.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by FBI

Yeah granlund looked way better than I thought he would unfortunately.

I would be more worried about the trade after his showing yesterday but I've said/though that about Granlund a few times in the past, only for him to fizzle out into the season. Pretty much every call up, he's made an impact the first few games then faded into the background. Yet to see if he can carry his play over a stretch of time in the NHL.

Maybe he's a late bloomer and will finally figure it out but I'm not banking on it.

I don't think anyone should be counting Hunter and his potential out either. He's younger and again showed some good things last night too.

[Plaedo]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Compared to say Sam Bennett two years ago I just don't think Tkachuk is ready. I think he's better served going back to junior and then on the WJC.

His speed to get in on the forecheck isn't there.

But beyond that his quick speed to get into the corner quickly, maybe the better word is anticipation, just isn't there yet.

That isn't to say he's not going to be a great young player, but I think he's over matched as of now.

How would you say Tkachuk compares to Monahan in his rookie year? Our depth at wing now is similar to our depth at centre then, and thus the relative bar for making the NHL might be set at a similar height. I think we might just see Tkachuk's benefit to the team be big enough to stay in the NHL while still learning, like Monahan did. If he fits in and isn't a major liability it becomes likely.

With Bennett's case, in my opinion he looked even better in his rookie season than Monahan did as a rookie, but proportionately there was also greater depth at centre, and a higher bar to clear (but ultimately, Bennett would also have made it had he stayed healthy).

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by sa226

How quickly we forget.

Granlund always had flashes of brilliance, where we wondered just where he would slot in, just what he could become.

Then he would fade into irrelevance. He isn't good enough to be a consistent top 6 player, and he's out of place in the bottom six. I think if he finds full time NHL employment, it will be on below average teams that have the space to slot him in the top six, where he will get the minutes, but not the success.

The Shinkaruk trade was a win for the contract situation alone.

The perfect place for him this year is with the Canucks, who have one of the most underwhelming forward lineups in the whole league, and were understandably one of the lowest scoring teams last year. There is lots of room for Granlund to look good in that situation.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Plaedo

How would you say Tkachuk compares to Monahan in his rookie year? Our depth at wing now is similar to our depth at centre then, and thus the relative bar for making the NHL might be set at a similar height. I think we might just see Tkachuk's benefit to the team be big enough to stay in the NHL while still learning, like Monahan did. If he fits in and isn't a major liability it becomes likely...

The other thing to bear in mind here is that Monahan did not have much forward support when he broke in, and very quickly had to become the driver in order to be effective. Tkachuk has the added luxury of being the #3 guy on a middle-6 line, which should also help to make the transition much easier.

[cannon7]

Granlund showing up Shinkaruk, hoping Shinkaruk can pick up his play. Tkachuk looked much more composed and focused tonight. Some real tough decisions coming for sure.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by cannon7

Granlund showing up Shinkaruk, hoping Shinkaruk can pick up his play. Tkachuk looked much more composed and focused tonight. Some real tough decisions coming for sure.

Are we surprised by this? Technically speaking, Grandlund was the better and more experienced player when we made the trade. I don't think anyone would question that Grandlund is better than Shinkaruk right now. We trade current level of play for future potential, and we traded from a position of depth to create more depth at a different position.

While its true both players are still "developing" Shinkaruk is earlier in his development curve. Hope is he becomes the better player further down the road, who's playing better between the two now is pretty irrelevant.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

I liked a lot of what I saw last night.

- I'm okay with Wideman in the bottom pairing. I think Glen will make sure he keeps it simple in his own end. He looked more comfortable on the point compared to last season.
- Wotherspoon was underwhelming and made some questionable decisions. Kulak is very clearly ahead on the depth chart now. Even without his 2 goals last game, he looks like a better skater and decision maker.
- Tkachuk is NHL ready and while he has holes in his game, they can be easily worked out if he stays on the top-6 learning from Bennett and Brouwer. The Flames do not control his development in Junior. This way they can keep a closer eye on him and work a bit of discipline into his game.
- Jankowski looked okay, but struggled defensively at times. He was much more impressive in the other 2 games I watched. Might of been nerves of playing his first game in the dome. I'm sure he'll get another game or two in, but it's safe to say his development is better served getting top line AHL minutes.
- Bennett will score 30-30 this season.
- Kylington is really fun to watch at times. He seems much stronger than last season and looks a bit bigger too. I wouldn't be surprised if he becomes a full time NHLer this time next year.
- There is no room for Higgins. I'd prefer him at league minimum than Stajan at 3 mil, but it's nothing major. Stajan is still a serviceable defensive forward. Actually I wouldn't mind him getting some time with Backlund and Frolik.
- Freddie impressed me once again. He's got high intensity and Dougie loves feeding him the puck.
- Ferland is going to get an extended look with Monahan and Gaudreau once again this season. And I think he's going to show that he's ready to stick with them.
- Parsons has looked excellent every time I've seen him. IMO he's right behind Gillies.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Plaedo

How would you say Tkachuk compares to Monahan in his rookie year? Our depth at wing now is similar to our depth at centre then, and thus the relative bar for making the NHL might be set at a similar height. I think we might just see Tkachuk's benefit to the team be big enough to stay in the NHL while still learning, like Monahan did. If he fits in and isn't a major liability it becomes likely.

With Bennett's case, in my opinion he looked even better in his rookie season than Monahan did as a rookie, but proportionately there was also greater depth at centre, and a higher bar to clear (but ultimately, Bennett would also have made it had he stayed healthy).

Monahan has always been a different case because of how he plays. To this day he's pretty underwhelming up and down the ice, but his instincts, positioning and shot make him deadly in and around the net.

Others seem to have liked Tkachuk much more than I did last night so maybe I'm being too hard on him. He just didn't seem to have the speed to keep up in my mind.

[GranteedEV]

I feel like Tkachuk will have a great rookie season but he won't stick with Bennett and Brouwer. I think he ends up playing with Backlund/Frolik. He will benefit from their speed, forechecking, experience, skill and general style of play. I liked him with Bennett/Brouwer on the PP but that's a different type of game situation from 5v5.

I'm thinking:

Johnny / Monny / (....Shinkaruk? Bouma? Chiasson? Hamilton? Stajan? IDK... get well Pribyl!)
Tkachuk / Backlund / Frolik
Ferland / Bennett / Brouwer

Will be one of the most balanced top 9 groups in the league. Putting Ferly with that Bennett/Brouwer combo will give them a lot more speed and forechecking pressure to turn pucks over.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I feel like Tkachuk will have a great rookie season but he won't stick with Bennett and Brouwer. I think he ends up playing with Backlund/Frolik. He will benefit from their speed, forechecking, experience, skill and general style of play. I liked him with Bennett/Brouwer on the PP but that's a different type of game situation from 5v5.

I'm thinking:

Johnny / Monny / (....Shinkaruk? Bouma? Chiasson? Hamilton? Stajan? IDK... get well Pribyl!)
Tkachuk / Backlund / Frolik
Ferland / Bennett / Brouwer

Will be one of the most balanced top 9 groups in the league. Putting Ferly with that Bennett/Brouwer combo will give them a lot more speed and forechecking pressure to turn pucks over.

? - Backlund - Frolik is going to be the line with the most defensive zone faceoffs all year, and used in shutdown situations - it's not where you want to start Tkachuk. Think back to how incredibly sheltered Monahan was in his rookie year. Tkachuk-Bennett-Brouwer is the way to go if Tkachuk is in the NHL this year. Monahan/Gaudreau will draw the best of the other team, Backlund/Frolik will get the hard zone starts, and Tkachuk-Bennett-Brouwer will get lots of offensive zone starts and will generally play against the 2nd/3rd pairing D of the opposition.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

? - Backlund - Frolik is going to be the line with the most defensive zone faceoffs all year, and used in shutdown situations - it's not where you want to start Tkachuk. Think back to how incredibly sheltered Monahan was in his rookie year. Tkachuk-Bennett-Brouwer is the way to go if Tkachuk is in the NHL this year. Monahan/Gaudreau will draw the best of the other team, Backlund/Frolik will get the hard zone starts, and Tkachuk-Bennett-Brouwer will get lots of offensive zone starts and will generally play against the 2nd/3rd pairing D of the opposition.

Opposition quality / zone starts won't influence Tkachuk's success at LW as much as the ability of his linemates to shelter him and put him in positions to succeed. Don't forget Bennett and Colborne were the LWs on that line last year.

Unless you think Tkachuk is a completely irresponsible liability in his own zone. In that case he should be cut asap as every line will find themselves defending at some point and if I had to place bets, the Bennett Brouwer line will have more sequences defending than the Backlund Frolik line regardless of "zone starts".

[btimbit]

I can't find any pics of Elliott in his all red gear other than the one in the practice jersey. anyone have one?