[Rumour] UPD: Friedman: Thinks a deal will get done between Gaudreau and the Flames in the next week

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Polak to you 6.75M is a lowball number. I do not think it is.

If $6.75 is lowballing a two-year pro with no arbitration or offer sheet rights, who is a fantastic offensive player but who doesn't play defence that well, doesn't play PK, is presently fairly well defended on the road when teams can match lines and who doesn't wear a letter or otherwise get referred to as a leader on the team, then it must have also been a lowball to a guy who is captain and undisputed leader of the team, a realistic Norris candidate over the past 3 seasons, who regularly is a top 10 scoring defenceman, plays PK and PP and regularly leads in minutes per game.

I'm not saying $6.75 is the right deal for Gaudreau, but it's no insulting "lowball". If it is, then what's not a lowball starting offer? $7M (only $250K more)?

[Gozer]

I haven't read the whole thread, but count me among the crowd that thinks Johnny and his agent are totally justified.

If he's an elite goal scorer and franchise player, he should be paid like one.
It's also reasonable to assume, at his size, he won't have a 20-season career to rack up earnings. He needs to seriously contemplate that this contract will be the biggest of his career.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Red Menace

If Flames wanted to get him at less than 7.5, then they should have offered him something like that at the start of last season (maybe they did who knows), in any case, I think most neutral observers agree he is worth at least 7.5 or 8 million now.
Just get it done already.

I missed that poll of neutral observers. Analysts who I've seen have started their analysis at the Monahan contract amount and referenced the Ekblad and Tarasenko deals. Not one that I've seen has said $8M is fair.

[tkflames]

Definitely curious to see what the final numbers work out to, but to me the following seems like a fair contract.

6.74 x 5 +8+9+10 = 7.59 AAV.

Keeps the Gio cap in place until his final year (a passing of the baton so to speak) and provides fair market value. I base my market value on who I would be willing to trade Gaudreau for:

Trade for:
Toews, Kane, Sid, Stamkos

Close: Tarasenko

Would not trade for: Forsberg, Marchand, RNH, Hall, Lucic, Eberle as examples in the $6M range.

From BTs standpoint he is a tough negotiator. I honestly thinks he waits this one out. Johnny's agent figures he will get the best deal last minute. If Brad gives into this, I believe this will have impacts on how future agents deal with BT. I would not be surprised if this goes a week or two into the season (much like the Doughty deal). This is an important season for the flames, but when it comes to a $60M+ deal of the most important player on the team, thy have to get it right.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by tkflames

Definitely curious to see what the final numbers work out to, but to me the following seems like a fair contract.

6.74 x 5 +8+9+10 = 7.59 AAV.

Keeps the Gio cap in place until his final year (a passing of the baton so to speak) and provides fair market value. I base my market value on who I would be willing to trade Gaudreau for:

Trade for:
Toews, Kane, Sid, Stamkos

Close: Tarasenko

Would not trade for: Forsberg, Marchand, RNH, Hall, Lucic, Eberle as examples in the $6M range.

From BTs standpoint he is a tough negotiator. I honestly thinks he waits this one out. Johnny's agent figures he will get the best deal last minute. If Brad gives into this, I believe this will have impacts on how future agents deal with BT. I would not be surprised if this goes a week or two into the season (much like the Doughty deal). This is an important season for the flames, but when it comes to a $60M+ deal of the most important player on the team, thy have to get it right.

Is he though? Is you top line winger your most important player?

I argue your #1 goalie is more important, then your #1 and 2 d-men, then your #1C.

Brodie, Monahan, Gio are all just as important, if not more important to the success of this team.

[442scotty]

The more I think about it I have to agree that it's about more than just Johnny. It's about sending a message to those that follow... Bennett etc... Keeping a lid on salary to build a great team that can stay intact

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Is he though? Is you top line winger your most important player?

I argue your #1 goalie is more important, then your #1 and 2 d-men, then your #1C.

Brodie, Monahan, Gio are all just as important, if not more important to the success of this team.

Stop disparaging Johnny

[Red Menace]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I missed that poll of neutral observers. Analysts who I've seen have started their analysis at the Monahan contract amount and referenced the Ekblad and Tarasenko deals. Not one that I've seen has said $8M is fair.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/ar...deal-right-now

Button also said he was worth $7.5 million

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by 442scotty

The more I think about it I have to agree that it's about more than just Johnny. It's about sending a message to those that follow... Bennett etc... Keeping a lid on salary to build a great team that can stay intact

It's even bigger than that IMO.

Kucherov, Trouba, Lindholm... this is about agents trying to change the rules for second contracts - essentially changing the entire payroll structure - and teams adamantly resisting it.

Johnny is a pawn in a bigger game.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Gozer

I haven't read the whole thread, but count me among the crowd that thinks Johnny and his agent are totally justified.

If he's an elite goal scorer and franchise player, he should be paid like one.
It's also reasonable to assume, at his size, he won't have a 20-season career to rack up earnings. He needs to seriously contemplate that this contract will be the biggest of his career.

So RFA rights (or even ELC contracts) should be meaningless? Should the Flames take all the risk that he won't in fact be an elite goal scorer (since there's only 2 years of history to go on)? Should he be paid more than Toews? Ovechkin? Getzlaf? He outscored all those guys last year.

Let him do it consistently for the years those guys did and then get paid like they do, or else build in the risk that he won't into the contract (which is pretty much why there are RFA rights).

[CalgaryFan1988]

If the old saying "defense wins championships" is true. Then there is no way a LWer should ever be your "most important piece".

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Red Menace

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/ar...deal-right-now

Button also said he was worth $7.5 million

That's one guy, and he's basically being consistent with the Tarasenko/Ekblad deal. I don't necessarily disagree either.

No one has said $8M.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

If the old saying "defense wins championships" is true. Then there is no way a LWer should ever be your "most important piece".

Very true.

I'm a huge Iggy guy. In fact, I'd love to bring him back for a 1 year swan song deal. But when Iggy was Calgary's best player, the Flames went no where.

Ovechkin is my favorite player. He is generational (I don't throw that word around). Him being WSH's best player has led them to zero Cups.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

For people who have kids, do you think when Johnny finally signs you'll be happier than the day your kid was born?

It'll feel like Christmas for me and this thread can die off.

I'm sorry, but what a stupid question. Seriously? It's hockey. If Gaudreau never plays another game for the Flames I will get over it. Quickly.

[wingmaker]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

It's even bigger than that IMO.

Kucherov, Trouba, Lindholm... this is about agents trying to change the rules for second contracts - essentially changing the entire payroll structure.

The contract people on this board want to give Johnny without arb rights is a massive step towards this exact scenario.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I'm sorry, but what a stupid question. Seriously? It's hockey. If Gaudreau never plays another game for the Flames I will get over it. Quickly.

Clearly a 2nd or 3rd tier fan.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

That's one guy, and he's basically being consistent with the Tarasenko/Ekblad deal. I don't necessarily disagree either.

No one has said $8M.

I've always liked the Tarsenko deal adjusted for the extra RFA year.

8 years x 7.125M

Done

[ricardodw]

It seems that the Flames management might have caught on to the implications of the big money long term contracts.

When they had a lot of cap space they were only looking forward 2 years:

This got us Raymond, Engelland, Stajan, Hamilton, Frolik and Gio and Backlund and Brouwer.

The cap space was used up on support players. The only pieces that have a reasonable chance of being core are Hamilton and Gio and maybe Backlund as a #3 C.

It seems that their is some internal conflict. The salary dump of Russell and Hudler and Jones got us over the immediate hump.

Not signing support player Colborne for 3M and giving him away for nothing seemed to be a radical change in direction. This just occurred on the fly as Colborne would have brought in an asset at the 2016 trade deadline.

Now they seem to be looking ahead 2-3 years. In 3 years they have all the Bad contracts off the books... Wideman, Stajan, Bollig, Bouma , Engelland, (Backlund -- not bad but gone anyway).

That leaves them with 3 forwards Monahan, Frolik, Brouwer and 3 defensemen Brodie, Gio and Hamilton.... and a cap hit of 32.3.....

No goalies , No Bennett, Tkachuk possibly in his last ELC year. Jankowski a RFA

Just adding Gaudreau @7.5 brings the cap up to 40M Elliot being anywhere close to what we expect will want 5M and Gillies or the other NHL goalie will be at least 1M.

46M spent and a cap of 75-77M say 76M leaves 30M for 9 forward and 5 d-men.

Average of just over 2M per player.

Bennett at best from a cap POV will be an RFA with arbitration rights. I can't see him not being close to 5M no matter how much the Flames try to nickel and dime him.

25M for 13 player... including a Backlund replacement!!


Of the 9 players we have in 3 years 7 were on the 2015-16 team.... Gio, Hamilton, Brodie, Frolik, Monahan, Gaudreau, Bennett (add Elliot, Brouwer)

Once Gaudreau is signed the Flames have 2 major contracts to deal with within 3 years - Elliott and Bennett. The team is set.

If this team is an top-4 team over 100 pts then the core is good enough, but if it is not ... then what? another 10 years with 1 playoff series win?

They can't afford to give everyone a keep them Happy bonus of 500K-1M like they did with Hamilton, Gio, Bouma, Stajan, Engelland, Brouwer, Frolik, Monahan and be a solid team. ie all these players are getting the top end of their range. Brodie is the only value contract.

[wingmaker]

^^ Don't agree with ricardow's assessment of players, but the Flames are looking at a difficult cap situation moving forward. They have banked heavily on defensemen being able to provide scoring as well as defence. Frolik and Brouwer are good additions, but they are sizeable cap numbers. Will be interesting to see how it unfolds. Whatever Gaudreau ends up being, the Flames need Bennett and Monahan to be high impact centres to have success. Full stop. Without that development, it doesn't matter how good Johnny is—the team will not succeed with all of its offence coming from one winger and its defence. This is why you can't pay Johnny more money than you have to. Treliving is likely signing his exit papers if Johnny makes much more than 7 million/year.

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

That's one guy, and he's basically being consistent with the Tarasenko/Ekblad deal. I don't necessarily disagree either.

No one has said $8M.

Mike Johnson said $8M