CalgaryNEXT Discussion pt. 2

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Oh ok wow.
Throw in the towel guys! We aren't world class and should not strive to be!
Wonderful view.

Should every city strive to be world class? Calgary? Regina? Red Deer? What does the term even mean?

Originally Posted by The Familia

The league has been around longer than you have and will continue to be around long after you are gone. The amount of money that has been invested in stadiums across the country is reason enough to ensure its survival.

I don't understand why people like you and Cliff Fletcher slag the CFL. Here we have a Canadian institution that has been around for over 100 years yet you both feel the need to trash the league because it isn't big and flashy like America. No other country slags their own domestic leagues like Canada does.

I have nothing against the CFL. I like the CFL. I'm not even a fan of the NFL. I'm just pointed out that it's a semi-professional league, and I questioned how much the city should spend to enable 9-12 games of that league per year.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I can assure you "most" bands/artists do more than 2-4 shows in Canada. The Saddledome roof has been the reason large stage acts have bypassed Calgary.

I thought we were talking about the stadium.

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I can assure you "most" bands/artists do more than 2-4 shows in Canada. The Saddledome roof has been the reason large stage acts have bypassed Calgary.

So if we get a new arena and resolve the event-limiting Saddledome roof issue, what exactly does a new stadium have to do with the concerts discussion?

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by nik-

I was under the impression you lived there, apologies if that's incorrect. I seem to recall you talking about coming up from there to watch games. Or somewhere.

Nah I'm in Calgary. That said it's not uncommon for Lethbridge fans to make it out to games.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I can assure you "most" bands/artists do more than 2-4 shows in Canada. The Saddledome roof has been the reason large stage acts have bypassed Calgary.

I suppose I should have added the qualifier of most "arena/stadium" artists. The bands who "skip" Calgary are usually huge arena bands, and no they do not play much more than Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal and maybe one more city or two. But even Montreal gets skipped more than you would think, even with their normal roof.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

I thought we were talking about the stadium.

I don't know. Being a CalgaryNEXT thread I didn't realize talking about the arena was moving the target.

[Bunk]

I think another real problem with the CalgaryNEXT football component is it being indoors - unless they do some really cool (expensive) translucent or semi-retractable roof. Otherwise I think it'll feel and have all the atmosphere and charm of a cavernous convention centre hall. The CFL is a summer league primarily, and the only thing worse than being outside on a really cold day, is being inside on a really nice day. Outdoor for CFL = better.

[Bingo]

on average 30,000 Calgarians attend Stampeder games for each of their home games in the last 25 years or so.

Arguing it's a two bit league seems a little silly if that many people care to go.

I for one, believe that number goes up if the building is located centrally, and doesn't require you to wet your pants every time you go because you can't get into the bathroom and that second beer is giving you cramps.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I don't know. Being a CalgaryNEXT thread I didn't realize talking about the arena was moving the target.

I'm trying to follow. I thought we were arguing that we don't need a new stadium at all and you were saying we miss out on concerts because of it.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Should every city strive to be world class? Calgary? Regina? Red Deer? What does the term even mean

Good question. Some consider calgary to be world class already. If we aren't then I think we should strive to be. Isn't that part of the justification when folks were arguing for the Peace Bridge?

I don't know what the criteria is but we should set the bar high and then raise it again if we hit it.

I strikes me that Calgary had lost some swagger. We've lost our boldness.
I think we should look for reasons to do stuff like build a new stadium and host the Olympics and then layer on reality and the right way to so it
Instead it feels like generally we are trying to find reasons not to do it
If Edmonton can find a way surely we can.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

If Edmonton can find a way surely we can.

An arena. If the Flames dropped the CalgaryNEXT and focused only on the arena, it would be built by the end of the decade. So we can have a new arena quickly, with no public money, which makes us even better than Edmonton.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Winnipeg, Ottawa, Hamilton, Saskatchewan all have brand new stadiums. BC, Toronto, and Edmonton all have refitted stadiums. I don't see any logic to the "We don't need it" crowd. Is Calgary right and every one else wrong? Doubtful.

Christ, even Moncton, NB got a brand new outdoor stadium that has allowed them to host multiple events (CFL, Track and Field, Woman's World Cup, MLS Exhibition, Francophone Games, Concerts, etc. ). They are even in the process of building a state of the art downtown arena that seats 10K for a friggen QMJHL team.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

An arena. If the Flames dropped the CalgaryNEXT and focused only on the arena, it would be built by the end of the decade. So we can have a new arena quickly, with no public money, which makes us even better than Edmonton.

Especially if they get over their spat with the Stampede board and just build it on the grounds.

[Flamenspiel]

nm

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Winnipeg, Ottawa, Hamilton, Saskatchewan all have brand new stadiums. BC, Toronto, and Edmonton all have refitted stadiums. I don't see any logic to the "We don't need it" crowd. Is Calgary right and every one else wrong? Doubtful.

Christ, even Moncton, NB got a brand new outdoor stadium that has allowed them to host multiple events (CFL, Track and Field, Woman's World Cup, MLS Exhibition, Francophone Games, Concerts, etc. ). They are even in the process of building a state of the art downtown arena that seats 10K for a friggen QMJHL team.

Yes. and I'll tell you what. I'll sign on for giving the Stampeders $17,000,000 if they can get a stadium built for that.

The Moncton Stadium (French: Stade Moncton) is a track and field stadium on the campus of the Université de Moncton in Moncton, New Brunswick, Canada, built to host the IAAF 2010 World Junior Championships in Athletics.[5] The $17 million venue opened in 2010. Although seating capacity had fluctuated early in construction (original plans called for as many as 28,000 seats), the stadium has 10,000 permanent seats, and is expandable to 20,725 via temporary seating.[1]

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Winnipeg, Ottawa, Hamilton, Saskatchewan all have brand new stadiums. BC, Toronto, and Edmonton all have refitted stadiums. I don't see any logic to the "We don't need it" crowd. Is Calgary right and every one else wrong? Doubtful.

Christ, even Moncton, NB got a brand new outdoor stadium that has allowed them to host multiple events (CFL, Track and Field, Woman's World Cup, MLS Exhibition, Francophone Games, Concerts, etc. ). They are even in the process of building a state of the art downtown arena that seats 10K for a friggen QMJHL team.

Ok so because they wasted taxpayer money, we should too? The benefits of a new Stamps facility are not worth it and that's why most people don't want it. As I said before, not a single compelling reason to build it has been offered.

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I strikes me that Calgary had lost some swagger. We've lost our boldness.
I think we should look for reasons to do stuff like build a new stadium and host the Olympics and then layer on reality and the right way to so it
Instead it feels like generally we are trying to find reasons not to do it
If Edmonton can find a way surely we can.

The Edmonton comparison is a red herring, they built an arena for 400 million, full stop. Everyone is onboard with that, its the 1.5 billion spend all the money at once in a bad location project that everyone is objecting to.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Flamenspiel

The Edmonton thing is a red herring, they built an arena for 400 million, full stop. Everyone is on board with that, its the 1.5 billion spend all the money at once bin a bad location project that everyone is objecting to.

480M for the Arena, 613.7M for the entire project.

http://globalnews.ca/news/2762084/ov...-to-foot-bill/

[Flamenspiel]

If you want to get into specifics, Edmonton city cost is 279M...The poll results would be much more in favour if that was the CalgaryNext proposal.

The CalgaryNext numbers are Olympian size costs, from the city perspective(1.8B) they approach winter olympic games type budgets.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Flamenspiel

If you want to get into specifics, Edmonton city cost is 279M...The poll results would be much more in favour if that was the CalgaryNext proposal.

The CalgaryNext numbers are Olympian size costs, from the city perspective(1.8B) they approach winter olympic games type budgets.

The city of Edmonton is putting up a lot more than that.

https://www.edmonton.ca/projects_pla...agreement.aspx

the loan for the tickets and "rent" is put up by the city. Also that 1.8B number that Calgary city council put out stretched things a bit.