Alberta Politics Thread

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by para transit fellow

Simplest example is subsidized housing. Federal, Provincial and municipal taxes required to provide housing for "working poor" when employers don't pay enough for workers to live in the community.

Still not sure why anyone thinks minimum wage is the solution here. This article says what I've been thinking all along....

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/ful...-actually-have

Also we would save a huge pile of money if we housed all of our homeless including everyone who has no hope of ever being in the labour market. Subsidized and free housing is actually a money maker.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Once again, why is there a presumption that every task is worthy of a "living wage"?

Because if the task needs doing by a full time person the employer pays them a living wage or the government subsidizes them. A low minimum wage is an artificial subsidy for businesses

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by GGG

Because if the task needs doing by a full time person the employer pays them a living wage or the government subsidizes them. A low minimum wage is an artificial subsidy for businesses

Again, you are acting as if the existence of a task makes it worthy of a "living wage" as if this is self-evident truth.

I could just as easily state that government is subsidizing the individual who is either unable (i.e.: due to disability or poor eduction) or unwilling to seek out a job/task worthy of a living wage.

[Flash Walken]

The economy needs consumers, we're either going to have to pay people a living wage to do menial tasks or pay them a living wage to do absolutely nothing at all.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

The economy needs consumers, we're either going to have to pay people a living wage to do menial tasks or pay them a living wage to do absolutely nothing at all.

Or we can gut the CIT and attract investment from all over the country into Alberta.

We need new and different ideas.

Eliminate/Significantly reduce PIT, CIT, and CapGains Taxes, and introduce a PST.

Shift the taxes away from working, saving, and investing.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally Posted by Dion

He's saying the govt should do more than just raising the minimum wage. Small businesses will do their part but that alone won't get people out of poverty. With an unemployment rate near %10 the NDP needs to do more to help create an economic climate where businesses can thrive and not die.

Yeah increasing the corporate income tax from 10% to 12% sure helps that.



This Premier is beyond incompetent.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

The economy needs consumers, we're either going to have to pay people a living wage to do menial tasks or pay them a living wage to do absolutely nothing at all.

And you are certain the magic number is $15/hour? It seems like we're throwing darts here. Like hey Seattle and San Francisco are doing $15 so let's go with that. Should work great in Hanna too. One thing literally every economist agrees on is that there is a perfect minimum wage, one that minimizes impact on business while maximizing benefit to employees. And that number isn't the same across the board. That number depends on factors that aren't in our favour right now. So when our NDP shoves a bunch of data at me about how well $15 an hour works in some places that aren't Alberta in 2016 it should be patently obvious they have literally no idea what they're talking about.

[peter12]

This is an excellent point.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

And you are certain the magic number is $15/hour? It seems like we're throwing darts here. Like hey Seattle and San Francisco are doing $15 so let's go with that. Should work great in Hanna too. One thing literally every economist agrees on is that there is a perfect minimum wage, one that minimizes impact on business while maximizing benefit to employees. And that number isn't the same across the board. That number depends on factors that aren't in our favour right now. So when our NDP shoves a bunch of data at me about how well $15 an hour works in some places that aren't Alberta in 2016 it should be patently obvious they have literally no idea what they're talking about.

What is your evidence that $15 is an inappropriate minimum wage for alberta?

[puckedoff]

This may have already been discussed but have we tried building a staircase to nowhere? Could generate some much needed jobs and stimulate the economy.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

What is your evidence that $15 is an inappropriate minimum wage for alberta?

I have none. That's why I asked you. Would you agree that there should be some before doing the thing you're about to do?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

What is your evidence that $15 is an inappropriate minimum wage for alberta?

You're missing the point.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

The economy needs consumers, we're either going to have to pay people a living wage to do menial tasks or pay them a living wage to do absolutely nothing at all.

I'll take this job.

[Handsome B. Wonderful]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

The economy needs consumers, we're either going to have to pay people a living wage to do menial tasks or pay them a living wage to do absolutely nothing at all.

High school kids working in a movie theater need a living wage?

You need to prove your premise exists before you can propose a solution.

[CliffFletcher]

Again, we don't have to speculate about what happens when the state mandates a living wage for all workers, we have a bunch of real-world examples. And the reality is that when you take away the kind of low-paying, part-time transitional work (and the vast majority people who earn minimum wage do some for a very short period at the beginning of their working life) you end up with chronically high unemployment among youth and immigrants. That, in turn, leads to a host of unpleasant social problems.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Handsome B. Wonderful

High school kids working in a movie theater need a living wage?

You need to prove your premise exists before you can propose a solution.

Absolutely they do, thats the point. What is a living wage for a 15 year old kid working in a movie theater? His food, shelter and most of his basic essentials are already covered so his 'living wage' could be something like $4/hour.

Whereas an immigrant who is 30+ years old with a family doing the same job would require more money to make ends meet. His 'living wage' might be $30/hour.

But neither of those things matter because its not a problem anyone is actually trying to solve, they're just doing Flash's favourite thing and spending money that isnt theirs to purchase 'Political Capital.'

[Handsome B. Wonderful]

Originally Posted by Locke

Absolutely they do, thats the point. What is a living wage for a 15 year old kid working in a movie theater? His food, shelter and most of his basic essentials are already covered so his 'living wage' could be something like $4/hour.

Whereas an immigrant who is 30+ years old with a family doing the same job would require more money to make ends meet. His 'living wage' might be $30/hour.

But neither of those things matter because its not a problem anyone is actually trying to solve, they're just doing Flash's favourite thing and spending money that isnt theirs to purchase 'Political Capital.'

I like this new cynical Locke.

Also, I demand a life of luxury and convenience, so I'm going to require more money to make ends meet. I'm setting my living wage at $10,000 per hour. I promise I'll be a good consumer once the government starts supplying me with the money.

[Resolute 14]

Meet the new cynical Locke. Same as the old cynical Locke.

[monkeyman]

[QUOTE=Flash Walken;5921455]The economy needs consumers, we're either going to have to pay people a living wage to do menial tasks or pay them a living wage to do absolutely nothing at all.[/QUOTE]

Just to touch on this. Does anyone know how much the government gives individuals if they can't find a job or can't work for medical or other reasons? I have no idea, but I bet it's a lot less than 15.00/hr. maybe they should've started there if they truly wanted to help those who need it?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by GGG

Because if the task needs doing by a full time person the employer pays them a living wage or the government subsidizes them. A low minimum wage is an artificial subsidy for businesses

I think this is actually one of the best arguments for enforcing a higher wage, but it needs to be fully costed out to make sense.