The hunting thread

[CroFlames]

I'd love to get into hunting. It's intimidating though.

[GoinAllTheWay]

I think maybe I'd start off with a bird hunt. Lots of grouse around my cabin. Start small.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

I have a real question to ask the hunting community. First let me say that I am not trying to troll or attack the community with this query, I am simply curious as to the attitudes that prevail. I know it's also a diverse group, so I expect a range of answers, and all are valid as far as I'm concerned. I will also state for the record that I have never hunted, fished, nor killed a living creature other than an insect. That is the reason for this question since I have no experience of my own:

What emotions go through you during the moment of a kill? Is there remorse? Satisfaction? Sadness? Exhilaration? Or is there a momentary repression of emotion during the act in order to get the job done as efficiently as possible?

Honestly, this is just curiosity on my part. I imagine that I would feel some sense of accomplishment, but that I would eventually feel some real regret and sadness for taking another conscious animal's life, even if done humanely.

Anyways, I don't want to get into a political debate or anything, I just wanted some perspective from those who currently hunt, or did so in the past. Thanks.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

I'd love to get into hunting. It's intimidating though.

I am going to try this year.

I have a buddy that was a guide in another life.

[Bane]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I have a real question to ask the hunting community. First let me say that I am not trying to troll or attack the community with this query, I am simply curious as to the attitudes that prevail. I know it's also a diverse group, so I expect a range of answers, and all are valid as far as I'm concerned. I will also state for the record that I have never hunted, fished, nor killed a living creature other than an insect. That is the reason for this question since I have no experience of my own:

What emotions go through you during the moment of a kill? Is there remorse? Satisfaction? Sadness? Exhilaration? Or is there a momentary repression of emotion during the act in order to get the job done as efficiently as possible?

Honestly, this is just curiosity on my part. I imagine that I would feel some sense of accomplishment, but that I would eventually feel some real regret and sadness for taking another conscious animal's life, even if done humanely.

Anyways, I don't want to get into a political debate or anything, I just wanted some perspective from those who currently hunt, or did so in the past. Thanks.

I'm not a hunter, but I would help out on my uncle's farm when I was a kid during chicken processing. You do feel remorse when you kill them, but you do it as quickly and painlessly as possible. There is no joy in it, but there was no regret either. I find it the same when killing and cleaning a fish those very rare times I catch anything.

I would wager its different for those who kill for sport though.

[chedder]

I've only shot geese and ducks. I also fish. There is exhilaration, especially with a big fish. I don't feel guilty as I know we're going to eat what we kill, or in the case of fishing, catch and release if not eating. I don't see it as any different than buying meat at the store. In fact I believe it to be more responsible. I think, unless you are a vegetarian, it's hypocritical to judge a hunter who is doing it within the rules and for food. I don't generally feel the same way about trophy hunting and don't agree with the spear buffoon in the article above.

[foshizzle11]

Originally Posted by chedder

I've only shot geese and ducks. I also fish. There is exhilaration, especially with a big fish. I don't feel guilty as I know we're going to eat what we kill, or in the case of fishing, catch and release if not eating. I don't see it as any different than buying meat at the store. In fact I believe it to be more responsible. I think, unless you are a vegetarian, it's hypocritical to judge a hunter who is doing it within the rules and for food. I don't generally feel the same way about trophy hunting and don't agree with the spear buffoon in the article above.

I have a very similar outlook as you posted, thank you. Trophy hunting and baiting just isn't in the spirit of what hunting should be no matter if it is within the rules.

I also fish and also respect the rules. I find it hard to listen to people who judge hunters as well but also buy meat from grocery stores. Talk about the worst way to kill and eat animals.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by foshizzle11

I have a very similar outlook as you posted, thank you. Trophy hunting and baiting just isn't in the spirit of what hunting should be no matter if it is within the rules.

I also fish and also respect the rules. I find it hard to listen to people who judge hunters as well but also buy meat from grocery stores. Talk about the worst way to kill and eat animals.

Again, not to get too political, but learning about the commercial meat industry over the years, I have chosen to eat less and less meat. I still do eat meat, but nowhere near the amount I used to. The issues of sustainability and the impact on the environment alone is a good enough reason to reduce meat consumption, or at least commercial meat consumption. That's not even getting into an ethical debate about animal husbandry.

[PepsiFree]

Trophy hunters should be shot.

Or speared.

[CroFlames]

I've slaughtered farm animals before. I feel a little sorry for the stock before I do it, but I know that if I want to enjoy meat, I need to be comfortable with the fact that an animal needs to die.

I take it one step further. If I'm personally not comfortable taking the life of an animal to consume it, then I shouldn't be comfortable consuming an animal that someone else killed.

That's a big reason why I want to begin hunting. I want to be more connected with where my food comes from. And since I choose to eat meat, I feel I need to be involved in that process and be comfortable with it. If I'm not comfortable with it, then I should not eat meat.

[GoinAllTheWay]

I used to be really into archery years ago. I'd like to get back into it but pretty sure I'll need a new bow. What's a decent compound bow these days that's not a total bank buster? Not likely to be used for hunting but having that option would be nice.

Saw some nice take down recurves at Cabelas recently, would like one of those too.

[Forbsey-123]

Weirdly enough, my feeling depends on the animal and situation I'm in while hunting. For instance I never feel bad shooting coyotes even though I love dogs and have owned them all my life. I have seen coyotes lure and rip through household cats and dogs just for the fun of it....then leave them suffering without eating a bit. After that I felt zero remorse...I think if a child was wondering alone that those sneaky b*stards would do the same to them.

I've always felt a twang of guilt hunting bigger game like deer or elk....and its mostly due to the situation....one second you are in hiding marvelling at this nice buck and thinking of how cool it looks and then your expected to kill it while its in this happy moment. Same goes for a doe that is standing there with her mature fawn.....its legal to take that doe (if the fawn has no spots) but its tough when you see it standing next to its little fawn (I still never have).....hell I think its even legal to take the fawn in that situation but I don't understand how some guys can without even batting an eye....then be so excited because the meat will be so tender.

Birds and waterfowl I've never had a real problem with because I know I will eat every delicious morsel and I don't really feel the human connection with birds. Their eyes just seem kind of dead and emotionless. Fish are something that have never really bothered me but to be honest I've probably thrown back 99.9% of fish I've caught, so that one doesn't really weigh on my conscience much.

I also feel that age plays a part. When I was a kid it was really hard to kill anything and I always felt guilty....as I got older it definitely wasn't as hard.....but I've talked to hardened old hunters who are older than me and they say that it gets tough again as you get into your twilight years. A lot of them just hunt with a camera now or have designated themselves the camp cook

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Forbsey-123

Birds and waterfowl I've never had a real problem with because I know I will eat every delicious morsel and I don't really feel the human connection with birds. Their eyes just seem kind of dead and emotionless. Fish are something that have never really bothered me but to be honest I've probably thrown back 99.9% of fish I've caught, so that one doesn't really weigh on my conscience much.

I also feel that age plays a part. When I was a kid it was really hard to kill anything and I always felt guilty....as I got older it definitely wasn't as hard.....but I've talked to hardened old hunters who are older than me and they say that it gets tough again as you get into your twilight years. A lot of them just hunt with a camera now or have designated themselves the camp cook

That's because birds are basically dinosaurs. They're evil and ancient, like sharks. Fish are even older depending on the lineage.

Your last paragraph really struck me as intriguing. What is it about us that we feel these things as children before we are desensitized, and then we forget what it is to feel that compassion for another animal, and only when we have to face our own mortality do we recognize the value of ALL life?

To quote George Carlin: "These are the thoughts that kept me out of all the really good schools."

[Aleks]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I have a real question to ask the hunting community. First let me say that I am not trying to troll or attack the community with this query, I am simply curious as to the attitudes that prevail. I know it's also a diverse group, so I expect a range of answers, and all are valid as far as I'm concerned. I will also state for the record that I have never hunted, fished, nor killed a living creature other than an insect. That is the reason for this question since I have no experience of my own:

What emotions go through you during the moment of a kill? Is there remorse? Satisfaction? Sadness? Exhilaration? Or is there a momentary repression of emotion during the act in order to get the job done as efficiently as possible?

Honestly, this is just curiosity on my part. I imagine that I would feel some sense of accomplishment, but that I would eventually feel some real regret and sadness for taking another conscious animal's life, even if done humanely.

Anyways, I don't want to get into a political debate or anything, I just wanted some perspective from those who currently hunt, or did so in the past. Thanks.

Personal experience, I hunt. Both small waterfowl and deer +. I was apprehensive when I started as well, I didn't know what emotions or how I would feel about it, I imagined what it would feel like being the deer.

What it did was made me conscientious about my shot, what my goals are when I find my target, and what I consider to be reasonable. I have a personal goal of ensuring as little suffering as possible, so I prefer a clean kill. I hunt using a large caliber rifle (7mm Rem Mag), and I ensure my shot placement is good. I've never had an animal (outside of duck, that's a different story) do anything more than turn to bolt and drop on the spot. Zero suffering. Afterward you field dress as quickly as possible, and take home for butchering. There's a small sense of overall sympathy, but also reward. I intend to eat that animal, and it feels pretty amazing when you can serve a meal you personally hunted, butchered, prepared to your friends and family.

That said, I am starting now hunting this year, and rarely do you see a shoot->drop with a bow, and you have to really be spot on with placement, but you're closer at the time of shot too.

Butchering is a fantastic skill to have. It's simple, it's messy, and time consuming, but I did everything from roasts to strips to ground and all vac packed for consumption.

[TSXCman]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Trophy hunters should be shot.

Or speared.

What about trophy hunters that eat the meat?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by TSXCman

What about trophy hunters that eat the meat?

Hmmmm, they're fine.

[troutman]

Bear killed with spear by American hunter

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgar...nter-1.3723290

As I understand it, bating a bear and using a spear is legal in Alberta, so I have no problem with that aspect of it.

Correct me if I am wrong, but with a spear, doesn't the bear have to wander off and bleed to death? Is there not a more humane way to kill it? Also, it seems very dangerous for the hunter.

[CroFlames]

Once you kill the animal, what happens next? Do you gut and skin it in the field? Or do you just gut it, then skin and butcher it at home?

What do you do with waste at home? Just throw it in the municipal garbage?

[foshizzle11]

I believe you gut it in the field/kill site and scavengers and such just finish up the job for you. Then skinning and butchering at home/butcher.

Troutman, I posted a similar article earlier this week. That kind of hunting should be banned and I think the government will abolish it as soon as they can in Alberta, especially after videos like these surface on the internet.

[troutman]

http://billmoyers.com/content/ep-3-j...tellers-audio/

JOSEPH CAMPBELL: That’s right. The basic hunting myth, I would say, is of a kind of covenant between the animal world and the human world, where the animal gives its life willingly. They are regarded generally as willing victims, with the understanding that their life, which transcends their physical entity, will be returned to the soil or to the mother through some ritual of restoration. And the principal rituals, for instance, and the principal divinities are associated with the main hunting animal, the animal who is the master animal, and sends the flocks to be killed, you know. To the Indians of the American plains, it was the buffalo. You go to the northwest coast, it’s the salmon. The great festivals have to do with the run of salmon coming in. When you go to South Africa, the eland, the big, magnificent antelope, is the principal animal to the Bushmen, for example.
BILL MOYERS: And the principal animal, the master animal
JOSEPH CAMPBELL: Is the one that furnishes the food.
BILL MOYERS: So there grew up between human beings and animals, a bonding, as you say, which required one to be consumed by the other.
JOSEPH CAMPBELL: That’s the way life is.
BILL MOYERS: Do you think this troubled early man, too
JOSEPH CAMPBELL: Absolutely, that’s why you have the rites, because it did trouble him.