[Signing] Flames sign Tyler Wotherspoon to 1 yr 2 way deal ($625k NHL, $125k AHL)

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

This again?

How many teams do you think even had a scout out to watch Nakladal in even one game last season in the NHL? He's a relative unknown. Did he play in the playoffs where GMs are watching just out of general interest and a guy catches their eye? No he played in the regular season for a team that was already out of the playoff race. That is not a knock on him as an individual, it's simply a statement of his exposure.



Not bad? It's 2/3rds of the goal scoring rate of Dougie Hamilton. And they weren't flukey goals, they passed the eye test as did many of his non-goal shots. One of which was a snipe that was Iginla-esque.

Well he scored at a 5 goal pace over 82 games and Dougie scored 12 goals so I fail to see the 2/3 argue ment but I am guessing you are going to go by minutes played to justify that claim?

I don't have a hate on for the guy and would rather have him at $1.5M than Wideman at $5.25M. Having said that it doesn't look like there is room for him and I quoted the post that suggest keeping him over Wotherspoon would be the right call. Give me the 23 year old every day who I still think could be a solid 4-5 for the Flames as soon as next year.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Well he scored at a 5 goal pace over 82 games and Dougie scored 12 goals so I fail to see the 2/3 argue ment but I am guessing you are going to go by minutes played to justify that claim?

I don't have a hate on for the guy and would rather have him at $1.5M than Wideman at $5.25M. Having said that it doesn't look like there is room for him and I quoted the post that suggest keeping him over Wotherspoon would be the right call. Give me the 23 year old every day who I still think could be a solid 4-5 for the Flames as soon as next year.

I am indifferent on Wotherspoon. Since he's young, fine, see what he becomes, might as well roll the die. But long term I think he will be quickly passed by guys like Kulak, Hickey, Ollas-Mattsson, and Kylington, and short term I think a bottom four D of Jokipakka, Nakladal, Wideman, Wotherspoon in that order would be the best NHL depth chart, but I don't know how to get rid of Smid or Engelland.

[Knut]

Nakladal likely wants a one-way deal. The Flames do not want to give it to him. He can easily head back to Europe and make half a million a year guaranteed.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I am indifferent on Wotherspoon. Since he's young, fine, see what he becomes, might as well roll the die. But long term I think he will be quickly passed by guys like Kulak, Hickey, Ollas-Mattsson, and Kylington, and short term I think a bottom four D of Jokipakka, Nakladal, Wideman, Wotherspoon in that order would be the best NHL depth chart, but I don't know how to get rid of Smid or Engelland.

I am a bit of a believer that Engellend has value to this team who lack physical players that will stand up for teammates and drop the gloves. The Pilers have quickly added a lot of goon to their lineup. Nurse, Lucic, Kassian, Maroon is a goon squad that will try and physically intimidate the Flames. LA and Amaheim are still really big teams. I don't see much of a use for Engellend outside of being a good teammate that will fight who he needs to for his team.

Brouwer, Tkachuk, and Chiasson are big body wingers that will help with needed size on the wing. I do see Engellend and Bollig dressing nearly every game against the Oil this year and likely games against the bigger California teams

[StrykerSteve]

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

Nakladal is better at playing defense than Wideman, Russell, Jokipakka, and Engelland.

It pains me that the Flames' 4th best option at defense is simply being let walk because of Wideman/Engelland/Smid's horrible contract situations.

Imagine if the Flames were able to keep Schlemko. We wouldn't be stressing out wondering whether or not Jokipakka/Wotherspoon/Kulak will be able to keep up in the top 4 next season. The time to start competing is now while Bennett and Tkachuk are still on ELC's, and I'd feel a lot better about the Flames' chances to compete if they had a Schlemko-Jokipakka-Nakladal bottom three than the Smid-Wideman-Engelland disaster they're currently paying.

Also, wow, 625k. That is a great contract. Hopefully Spoon can find himself a spot on the roster this year.

I think we need a larger sample size to evaluate Nakladal. I don't think 27 games in garbage time is nearly enough to make a compelling case either way. However, so far it would appear all NHL GMs disagree with your assessment and don't view him as an NHL-caliber defenseman. Otherwise, in a year where Russell is one of the best UFA defenseman options, it makes no sense why one of the other 29 teams haven't taken a chance on him yet. I can't imagine he is looking for a Schlemko-type deal, unless he has the worst agent ever. The fact that he hasn't secured a deal yet makes me think that most GMs think he is nothing special (not worth a one way deal).

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Now that we have Hickey, Andersson and Kylington in the system, I can't see Wother having a career here

None of the three you mentioned are close to making the NHL IMO. Wotherspoon has years of development on them. He's pretty much NHL ready and the fact there are prospects behind him doesn't really affect his chances of being a Flame.

I think he's likely to be an NHLer this year and has a good chance at establishing himself as a long term defenceman likely a 5/6 with an outside chance at being a 4.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

Kylington is nowhere near as good as Wotherspoon defensively. I'd be shocked if Kylington maintained an NHL spot over Wotherspoon.

As someone who watched/listened to most of the Heat games, I was pleased with Kylington.

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

None of the three you mentioned are close to making the NHL IMO.

While from a purely polish/defensive viewpoint, both you guys are correct, I wonder how much that really matters in Treliving's eyes. You can't substitute raw offensive talent. Oliver Ekman-Larsson was a comparable prospect to Kylington talent-wise at the same age, and Maloney/Treliving got him into 48 NHL games as a 19 year old.

On the other hand we have a lot of offensive blue line talent where we don't need to rush Kylington the way OEL might have been fast-tracked. But that is also a barrier for Wotherspoon, who needs to be almost perfect defensively as he's giving you almost zero offensively. He can't cheese his way onto the lineup by punching face either.

Now, my preference would be to keep Kylington under 10GP anyways, whereas Wotherspoon is waiver eligible and there is that mild risk of losing him.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I am indifferent on Wotherspoon. Since he's young, fine, see what he becomes, might as well roll the die. But long term I think he will be quickly passed by guys like Kulak, Hickey, Ollas-Mattsson, and Kylington, and short term I think a bottom four D of Jokipakka, Nakladal, Wideman, Wotherspoon in that order would be the best NHL depth chart, but I don't know how to get rid of Smid or Engelland.

Remember when you wanted to extend Smid after his short return last season?

You put way too much emphasis on small sample sizes, you're doing it again with Nakladal.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Remember when you wanted to extend Smid after his short return last season?

No, because you're most likely making that up unless I made a tongue-in-cheek comment. I might have said Smid was a better option at different points in time than Russell, Wideman or Engelland and should not have been randomly scratched at a time where he was playing well and they were being liabilities (which was obviously often). How that suddenly equates to wanting to extend a player with a year-and-half left on his deal makes no sense.

You are just flat out lying, as I've noticed you've got some sort of vendetta against me in which you consistently follow my posts around to disparage them. Cute, but pathetic.

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

You put way too much emphasis on small sample sizes, you're doing it again with Nakladal.

How so? By saying he's an adequate (and cheap) fifth/sixth defenseman, with a skillset that adds value compared to a "mediocre depth defenseman"?

Okay there. Apparently, being awful, but reliably awful over a big sample, is more valuable than being good over a small sample.

[btimbit]

Surprised to see this before the big deals that need to happen.

Glad though, I like Wotherspoon and think he has a place here, especially next year after we turn over the bottom half on the D

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

No, because you're most likely making that up unless I made a tongue-in-cheek comment. I might have said Smid was a better option at different points in time than Russell, Wideman or Engelland and should not have been randomly scratched at a time where he was playing well and they were being liabilities (which was obviously often). How that suddenly equates to wanting to extend a player with a year-and-half left on his deal makes no sense.

You are just flat out lying, as I've noticed you've got some sort of vendetta against me in which you consistently follow my posts around to disparage them. Cute, but pathetic.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthr...id#post5612559

Man, I kinda want to consider re-signing Smid in two years. He is so damn underrated. Deserved an assist on that Monny goal too.

Maybe it was tongue-in-cheek (doesn't seem like it) but you should probably relax with the lying accusations. The vendetta thing I can only chalk up to a wild imagination.

How so? By saying he's an adequate (and cheap) fifth/sixth defenseman, with a skillset that adds value compared to a "mediocre depth defenseman"?

He might be that, but he isn't that yet. He played less than 30 games towards the end of the year and looked okay. He has a lot of things you want, right shot that's nice and accurate can carry the puck but he makes some boneheaded plays. I'd like to see him back but not banging down the door to see it happen. It's mid-August and he's still looking for an NHL deal.

Right now I'd suggest he's an AHL/7th guy

[GranteedEV]

Okay, no that does not look Tongue-in-Cheek... you have managed to find a lazy comment about liking a player enough to want him around (with the obvious, nay, overlying assumption that over the next two years, that player keeps up the quality of play he was playing at at that point in time while staying healthy) , inside of a game thread, and you conclusion is that I want to extend that player right away based on a small sample and I'm an idiot.

K.

The fact that you latched onto something like such doesn't do many favors to your claims of not having a vendetta.

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

He has a lot of things you want, right shot that's nice and accurate can carry the puck but he makes some boneheaded plays.

What 5/6 D does not? Heck, Hamilton makes many a boneheaded play and he's our #3.

If anything, fixating on costly mistakes while ignoring the many subtle, successful plays is the best example of "putting too much emphasis on a small sample".

I'd like to see him back but not banging down the door to see it happen.

And I am, by pointing out that he's not "a mediocre depth piece".

[Tacopuck]

Treliving's Troll game has reached an elite level.

Gaudreau's and Monahan's contracts are already signed, dual $6.0M AAV x 8 years

Treliving is just bored AF and is now just trolling fans by signing everyone else to keep busy until training camp, reveal the contracts, and get a good laugh out of it when he shows the fans they were signed months ago.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Okay, no that does not look Tongue-in-Cheek... you have managed to find a lazy comment about liking a player enough to want him around (with the obvious, nay, overlying assumption that over the next two years, that player keeps up the quality of play he was playing at at that point in time while staying healthy) , inside of a game thread, and you conclusion is that I want to extend that player right away based on a small sample and I'm an idiot.

K.

The fact that you latched onto something like such doesn't do many favors to your claims of not having a vendetta.

Didn't latch on to anything or went looking for something crazy, I just remembered you said that, something we vendetta seeking liars call a memory.

[Mister Yamoto]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

Nakladal is better at playing defense than Wideman, Russell, Jokipakka, and Engelland.
.

No, no, no and...........no.

The amount of love Nakladal gets around here is mind bottling. He is no Commodore.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

Nakladal is better at playing defense than Wideman, Russell, Jokipakka, and Engelland.

It pains me that the Flames' 4th best option at defense is simply being let walk because of Wideman/Engelland/Smid's horrible contract situations.

Imagine if the Flames were able to keep Schlemko. We wouldn't be stressing out wondering whether or not Jokipakka/Wotherspoon/Kulak will be able to keep up in the top 4 next season. The time to start competing is now while Bennett and Tkachuk are still on ELC's, and I'd feel a lot better about the Flames' chances to compete if they had a Schlemko-Jokipakka-Nakladal bottom three than the Smid-Wideman-Engelland disaster they're currently paying.

Also, wow, 625k. That is a great contract. Hopefully Spoon can find himself a spot on the roster this year.

Schlemko was a waiver pickup just prior to the end of that season. He entered the last season as a PTO to NJD. He played well enough this past season to earn a long term contract off a PTO. Good for him, but he wasn't a lock as a 4th dman.

Nakladal played well this season. While I would like to keep him, I also don't exactly see other teams stealing him. The sample size is just too small. While it doesn't bother me to see some posters preferring him to guys like Engelland, Smid or Wideman, some posters acting like we're losing a 1st round pick for nothing is a bit of an overreaction IMO. I'd be elated if he signed a similar contract to Wotherspoon in anticipation of grabbing a roster spot once the aforemention 3 contracts expire.

Also... just another general jab to add... IMO the rebuild is not done. I expect it to finish after this season and certain contracts expire and we can start slotting a large batch of kids into the line up.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

This again?

How many teams do you think even had a scout out to watch Nakladal in even one game last season in the NHL? He's a relative unknown. Did he play in the playoffs where GMs are watching just out of general interest and a guy catches their eye? No he played in the regular season for a team that was already out of the playoff race. That is not a knock on him as an individual, it's simply a statement of his exposure.



Not bad? It's 2/3rds of the goal scoring rate of Dougie Hamilton. And they weren't flukey goals, they passed the eye test as did many of his non-goal shots. One of which was a snipe that was Iginla-esque.

Teams have a book on literally every player in the NHL and Ahl.
He played more than enough for teams to be able to assess. It's not like he was tucked away in some remote part of the world

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

He entered the last season as a PTO to NJD. He played well enough this past season to earn a long term contract off a PTO.

Factually inaccurate. He signed a proper one year deal, before preseason, after Calgary couldn't make the roster spot to fit him in.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

...
The fact that you latched onto something like such doesn't do many favors to your claims of not having a vendetta.
...

Wasn't it *your* claim that there *was* a vendetta? I think you're mixed up about who's making a claim here.