The New American Politics thread

[Lanny_McDonald]

Trump’s sanity is finally being question, on both sides of the political divide.

I have been calling Trump a sociopath for months now and finally the media is catching up and questioning his sanity. To me, there has never been a question about Trump’s narcissism, but his sociopathy has been a point of debate. It seems that the debate is now going to come to a head. Yahoo had a good write up on this. Here's the highlights.

Eugene Robinson from the Washington Post asks, “Is Donald Trump just plain crazy?”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...mepage%2Fstory

Neoconservative Robert Kagan, writing as a guest for the Washington Post says, “There is something very wrong with Donald Trump.” Hagan is a Senior Fellow for the centrist Brookings Institute.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...856_story.html

Ezra Klein from Vox asks, “Have we stopped to appreciate how crazy Donald Trump has gotten recently?”

http://www.vox.com/2016/7/27/1229851...nc-hack-russia

Stephen Hayes from the very conservative Weekly Standard states, “Donald Trump is crazy, and so is the GOP for embracing him.”

http://www.weeklystandard.com/donald...rticle/2003466

Conservative commentator, David Brooks says Trump suffers from multiple personality disorders in his column in the New York Times, “The Democrats win the summer.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/29/op...mmer.html?_r=0


The American Psychological Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (APA DSM 5) provides the following criteria for an antisocial personality disorder, or sociopathy.

Significant impairments in personality functioning manifest by:

Impairments in self functioning (a or b):

Identity: Ego-centrism; self-esteem derived from personal gain, power, or pleasure.

Self-direction: Goal-setting based on personal gratification; absence of prosocial internal standards associated with failure to conform to lawful or culturally normative ethical behavior.

AND

Impairments in interpersonal functioning (a or b):

Empathy: Lack of concern for feelings, needs, or suffering of others; lack of remorse after hurting or mistreating another.

Intimacy: Incapacity for mutually intimate relationships, as exploitation is a primary means of relating to others, including by deceit and coercion; use of dominance or intimidation to control others.

Pathological personality traits in the following domains:

Antagonism, characterized by:

Manipulativeness: Frequent use of subterfuge to influence or control others; use of seduction, charm, glibness, or ingratiation to achieve ones ends.

Deceitfulness: Dishonesty and fraudulence; misrepresentation of self; embellishment or
fabrication when relating events.

Callousness: Lack of concern for feelings or problems of others; lack of guilt or remorse about the negative or harmful effects of ones actions on others; aggression; sadism.

Hostility: Persistent or frequent angry feelings; anger or irritability in response to minor slights and insults; mean, nasty, or vengeful behavior.

Disinhibition, characterized by:

Irresponsibility: Disregard for – and failure to honor – financial and other obligations or commitments; lack of respect for – and lack of follow through on – agreements and promises.

Impulsivity: Acting on the spur of the moment in response to immediate stimuli; acting on a momentary basis without a plan or consideration of outcomes; difficulty establishing and following plans.

Risk taking: Engagement in dangerous, risky, and potentially self - damaging activities, unnecessarily and without regard for consequences; boredom proneness and thoughtless initiation of activities to counter boredom; lack of concern for ones limitations and denial of the reality of personal danger.

http://www.psi.uba.ar/academica/carr...terial/dsm.pdf

Trump hits every single one of the characteristics identified to diagnose an anti-social personality disorder. The man is a sociopath and is unfit for office.

I would be interested to see every member of congress have to go through a full psych examination. I wonder how many of them currently in office are nuts in some way (I’m talking to you Steve King, Joe Barton, Joni Ernst and Louie Gohmert).

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

The conventions weren't just about policy. For example: would you disagree that the Khan speech has opened the eyes of the sacrifice Muslim families have made? I think that's the leading part of their speech and while incremental, could be important.

That's a fair point, but doesn't speak to anything substantive about their speech. Just suggests that the emotional message they were offering is one the American public needed to hear.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by troutman

Busta Rhymes.

Rawr rawr like a dungeon dragon indeed.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

That's a fair point, but doesn't speak to anything substantive about their speech. Just suggests that the emotional message they were offering is one the American public needed to hear.

Still worth paying attention to?

[GirlySports]

Train going off the rails.

Does Pence take himself off the ticket before labout day?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Still worth paying attention to?

I guess that depends if you're the sort of person who needs to hear the message... unfortunately, I suspect most of the people who do need to hear it won't listen. As is the case with most such things.

[troutman]

Trump's last 24 hours - MSNBC

http://www.cnn.com/2016/08/03/politi...016/index.html

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Train going off the rails.

Does Pence take himself off the ticket before labout day?

Nah, Pence has nothing to go back to with no chance to run again for Governor of Indiana. He's just gotta hope Trump does indeed bail out of the race, and then it probably becomes a Ryan/Pence ticket that probably has a better chance of winning than Trump/Pence. Pence attaching himself to the ticket in the first place was putting all his eggs in one basket. He's gotta ride this out now.

As to Trump withdrawing I think after the first debate, if it happens, makes more sense. Much more catastrophic to the GOP, a party he doesn't give a crap about and seems to be gleefully fighting right now. Withdrawing now is a gift to them, gives them lots of time to regroup. End of September leaves them with few if any options at that point. And we know Trump is very petty and would love to stick it to the GOP.

[Swift]

Yikes

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...b031196bf5bc88

[Drak]

Wonder if Trump will fake a health issue to back out.

[troutman]

FLA, PA, COL, OH, trending towards Clinton:

http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/...tion-forecast/

[Street Pharmacist]

Yikes indeed. Zero empathy, wonders why we can't use nukes. Ugh

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Yikes indeed. Zero empathy, wonders why we can't use nukes. Ugh

The context:

Starts at 50 seconds. Joe's language suggests he was told this by the person who was advising Trump or at least knows who it is, but he's sort of cagey about the source of the information.

Manafort denies it, "it didn't happen", Trump hasn't received any security briefings. Says he was "in the meeting".

[photon]

Originally Posted by Drak

Wonder if Trump will fake a health issue to back out.

It DID work to get out of gym class..

I think the idea of Trump dropping out is mostly wishful thinking, he's never shown any tendency to give up a loosing fight before.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Yeah I tend to think dropping out isn't particularly likely unless something unforeseen happens. Trump has already planted the seeds of excuses for when he loses, so he's got the rigged/conspiracy angles to use that shows he didn't actually lose, it was "stolen" from him or whatever helps him sleep at night. And we know his supporters will lap up any bull#### he throws at them, so he'll always have millions of other losers telling him he never lost anything.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Drak

Wonder if Trump will fake a health issue to back out.

His last health report (seemingly written by Trump himself):

http://time.com/4148111/donald-trump-health-report/

If elected, Mr. Trump, I can state unequivocally, will be the healthiest individual ever elected to the presidency

[GirlySports]

Wow, just wow.

I don't think I have ever heard a more incompetent spokesperson in my life. Is she a volunteer, or does she actually collect a salary.

Someone should tell her that it is not pronounced "eye-rack." And that, on top of her beyond clumsy attempts at spin and obvious lying, a phrase such as "You can't put the onerus on Donald Trump" doesn't inspire confidence.

I look forward to hearing more from this bitter sorority girl.

[Swift]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Manafort denies it, "it didn't happen", Trump hasn't received any security briefings. Says he was "in the meeting".

Haha, Manafort was in the meeting that supposedly didn't take place. What a slimy piece of work that guy is too.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by New Era

Trump hits every single one of the characteristics identified to diagnose an anti-social personality disorder. The man is a sociopath and is unfit for office.

I would be interested to see every member of congress have to go through a full psych examination. I wonder how many of them currently in office are nuts in some way (I’m talking to you Steve King, Joe Barton, Joni Ernst and Louie Gohmert).

While I don't disagree with your sentiment could someone legally be disallowed from running for a political office or the office of President if they had a mental disorder or condition? I would assume no because that would be discrimination.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Of course Trump's reaction and especially the reaction of some of his mouthpieces has been abhorrent, that's a separate issue and is so obvious as to be barely worth talking about.

No, it's definitely worth talking about. We have spent endless pages belabouring the obvious, why should this particular bit of obvious be exempt?

Anything that further reinforces the point that Trump is not only an unsuitable candidate surrounded by clowns, but also a terrible and pathetic human being, should be a continuing focus. If anything, we need less semantic quibbling over exactly how to describe Trump's arrogant obliviousness, and more detail on his every misstep, ill-considered tweet, and shady business practice.

It's perfectly rational to loathe Trump and be fearful of him becoming President. I've yet to see a rational argument in favour of him, even the blowhard libertarian obsessive here divides his time between downplaying Trump's lunacy and upvoting Clinton's and the Democatic Party's flaws, because Trump is an appeal to emotion incarnate, with no substance whatsoever that can be coherently argued for.

The world is shades of grey - but some greys are indistinguishable from black.