The 2016 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

[868904]

Originally Posted by whosurnabby

Personally, I think Bats is an outstanding leader to his ballclub, heck even his own teammates attested to this OVER and OVER and OVER again. I couldn't give a rats ass if he treats fans poorly. Or maybe you just caught him on a bad day.

But this is a guy that was one of the biggest supporters of deffering contract for the Jays to land Ervin Santana a couple of years ago, a guy who has recently paid off both teams' meals (home&away) when he was on Class A and Buffalo for rehab assignment, a guy who -despite being verbal about being a true RF- never complained in public once about playing other positions (and oh i watch a lot of Jays games, he has played 3B and 1B previously), and a guy who was one of the key players in turning around this season when he came up to Gibby and suggested that he will help this 2016 team by batting leadoff in a contract year.

I also liked his beef with Rogers last year over the Travis suit thing. If I was his teammate and he stuck his neck out like that in a spat with the company, i'd appreciate that. I know some thought this was a dbag move by Bautista, but I think the players appreciated it and at the end of the day, that is what matters.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by whosurnabby

Not to rag on your opinion, but I know that you're opinion about JoeyBats having THE BIGGEST ego in baseball stemmed from that one ugly encounter of him outside of the field.

Personally, I think Bats is an outstanding leader to his ballclub, heck even his own teammates attested to this OVER and OVER and OVER again. I couldn't give a rats ass if he treats fans poorly. Or maybe you just caught him on a bad day.

But this is a guy that was one of the biggest supporters of deffering contract for the Jays to land Ervin Santana a couple of years ago, a guy who has recently paid off both teams' meals (home&away) when he was on Class A and Buffalo for rehab assignment, a guy who -despite being verbal about being a true RF- never complained in public once about playing other positions (and oh i watch a lot of Jays games, he has played 3B and 1B previously), and a guy who was one of the key players in turning around this season when he came up to Gibby and suggested that he will help this 2016 team by batting leadoff in a contract year.

You keep on stating, like it's a fact, that Jose has a huge ego...but the truth of the matter is, on that one day you had that specific interaction with Mr. Bautista, the only ego that got bruised is yours buddy. I tend to think, as do most BJ's fan that Jose is an outstanding ballplayer and teammate. If he is a ###### outside of the field, the only person that seems to care constantly is you TAO. I'm not trolling my friend, just please stop with the whole Jose Bautista = "biggest ego in all of baseball" propaganda man.

I'd love to see this amazing baseball player retire in a Jays uni and play out the rest of his career in white&blue, but for the right term and price. It sucks that he developed late in his career, but if we are talking about Bats as a baseball player and what he can do in the game, I'm sorry but he is a premium position player that deserves to get paid. That's a fact that you can hopefully sink your teeth on.

BTW, I don't think we'll hear anything from Bautista splitting time with BJ Upton in RF. He needs constant off days to gauge that broken toe and we all know how meticulous Bats is in keeping his body in prime working condition.

Bautista is one of the most hated players in baseball league wide. There's a constant string of current and past players taking shots at him. He constantly whining, arguing calls, complaining to the media about team moves (though I would agree with Rogers as owners), complaining to the media about a past contract HE signed, and he's even made an ass of himself in the Toronto media on multiple occasions even complaining that it's ridiculous that there isn't gated communities in the city that he should be able to live in. I've long not had a very high opinion of Jose Bautista, and it had nothing to with his interactions with the fans. Though, I will admit, that sure as hell cemented my opinion on him.

Did you happen to catch the pretty league wide reaction to him getting one-punched by Odor. It wasn't "Hey, that Odor is an idiot and has a history of this", it was "Nice see someone as deserving as Bautista get dropped like that".

I'm more than happy to put it up with though if he continues to hit 40 HR.

Where do you see me saying he doesn't deserve to get paid?

[Senator Clay Davis]

I think Bautista being a prick is a little different than him being selfish or an egomanic. Lots of players are pricks.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by 868904

I also liked his beef with Rogers last year over the Travis suit thing. If I was his teammate and he stuck his neck out like that in a spat with the company, i'd appreciate that. I know some thought this was a dbag move by Bautista, but I think the players appreciated it and at the end of the day, that is what matters.

That was one of the Bautista moved I did like, but it was against Rogers so I'm biased.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

I think Bautista being a prick is a little different than him being selfish or an egomanic. Lots of players are pricks.

You don't see someone who continues to argues balls and strikes day in and day out despite being told in the past he needs to tone it down as selfish?
It definitely affects the way calls go against the Jays. It looks sometimes like umps are just looking to ring up Blue Jay batters just so they can stick to Jose and his big mouth.

It's the equivalent of a hockey player taking a selfish retaliation penalty.

[TheAlpineOracle]

I would imagine Upton will be a 30 HR hitter with the Jays. Rogers Center has a way of turning 20HR guys into bigtime power hitters.

If I'm a guy playing for a new contract, Rogers Center is where I want to be.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Bautista is one of the most hated players in baseball league wide. There's a constant string of current and past players taking shots at him.

Well that's just not true.

After he signed with Boston and after the punch up this season David Price talked about how he wasn't a fan of Bautista until he joined the Jays and that changed his mind. I'm on my phone or I'd find the quote, it was a pretty big compliment, I think I even posted it in this thread somewhere.

I can see Jose being disliked, he's pretty competitive and pretty emotional. And I can't stand when he whines about balls and strikes but it's pretty obvious he's toned that down this year. I think he's just one of those athletes you hate playing against but would love on your team.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

You don't see someone who continues to argues balls and strikes day in and day out despite being told in the past he needs to tone it down as selfish?

Not really. The only time it ever actually bothers me is when he argues a good call (which isn't that often).

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

It definitely affects the way calls go against the Jays.

Please provide statistical proof that this is the case. I've never seen anything that indicates that's a real thing.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

I would imagine Upton will be a 30 HR hitter with the Jays. Rogers Center has a way of turning 20HR guys into bigtime power hitters.

Petco and Rogers actually have really similar park factors so probably not so much. The other AL East parks (Fenway and Yankee Stadium in particular) rate above average but that balances out by him no longer getting to hit in Chase or Coors.

It's probably a wash as far as stadium adjustments go.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Parallex

Petco and Rogers actually have really similar park factors so probably not so much. The other AL East parks (Fenway and Yankee Stadium in particular) rate above average but that balances out by him no longer getting to hit in Chase or Coors.

It's probably a wash as far as stadium adjustments go.

I never would have figured that, but according to some stats on ESPN you are right. When I was there I found it to be a pretty spacious park and wouldn't have expected to surrender as much homeruns as it does. I was drinking heavily the whole series though, because the beer there is phenomenal.

[mrkajz44]

I once read an article that basically said that Rogers Center gave up more home runs for 2 reasons:

1) Because it is a dome that could be closed. In the early and late parts of the season, where outdoor parks can get cold and poor weather, the conditions are almost always perfect.

2) Line-ups in the AL east are just better sluggers in general.

Once you factor in those two things, the field itself doesn't do much.

[JiriHrdina]

Now I'm just confused by what is being argued.
Either Bautista is a huge enough idiot that he will reactive negatively to the trade, or he's not, and he would be happy with it.

If the former is true - that is no reason not to make a deal. You can't not improve the team because you are worried about how a player may react.

If the latter is true - then there is no issue.

The question is - does the trade help the baseball club for an appropriate acquisition cost. That remains to be seen, but on the surface it would seem so.

So what is the argument being put forth? Bautista is a jerk so the trade is bad?

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

I never would have figured that, but according to some stats on ESPN you are right. When I was there I found it to be a pretty spacious park and wouldn't have expected to surrender as much homeruns as it does. I was drinking heavily the whole series though, because the beer there is phenomenal.

San Diego moved the fences in, either last year or 2014.

[KelVarnsen]

LOL Kemp.

[vegasbound]

Mvp!

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

San Diego moved the fences in, either last year or 2014.

That would explain it.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

I once read an article that basically said that Rogers Center gave up more home runs for 2 reasons:

1) Because it is a dome that could be closed. In the early and late parts of the season, where outdoor parks can get cold and poor weather, the conditions are almost always perfect.

2) Line-ups in the AL east are just better sluggers in general.

Once you factor in those two things, the field itself doesn't do much.

AL East plays a factor, but there' something to do with that Westjet Flight Deck which has made Rogers Center even more of a homerun magnet. Apparently the windows of the old restaurant used to create somewhat of an effect that pushed the ball back. Since they've been removed, it seems like the ball just flies out of there.

Zaun talks about it from time to time on the broadcasts. I don't generally pay much attention to it though to know the details.

[puffnstuff]

JD is the first Jays 3B with back to back 25 hr seasons.

Would have thought it had been done before.

[JiriHrdina]

What about Tony Batista?

[nik-]

According to Baseball Reference he played short one of those years.