The 2016 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

[Jason14h]

The problem is no contender is giving you a real player for Bautista . And you can't trade him to the AL

We have prospects to go find a reliever and really that's all they need . Maybe 2 relievers if Cecil isn't back

[Jiggy_12]

For those fans of Josh Donaldson and advanced stats, this is a good read.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/josh-...etting-better/

[Cuz]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

The problem is no contender is giving you a real player for Bautista . And you can't trade him to the AL

We have prospects to go find a reliever and really that's all they need . Maybe 2 relievers if Cecil isn't back

Cecil is back

[Jason14h]

I mean back as in last year quality ! But he's looked better

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

The problem is no contender is giving you a real player for Bautista . And you can't trade him to the AL

We have prospects to go find a reliever and really that's all they need . Maybe 2 relievers if Cecil isn't back

That's why I think the only option is to trade him to an NL contender for prospects you can use to flip for pitching help (if that's even possible). Otherwise, I think we just keep him and take our lumps in the off season.

The Jays also need a substantial starter. Rotation looks great now, but what about the innings limits on Stroman and Sanchez? What if Estrada has a lengthy injury? Do we really want to start a playoff series with RA Dickey in the starting 3? He may go out there and shut the team down, he may go out there and allow 10 runs in an inning. Too much of a crap shoot.

Baltimore and the Red Sox will be loading up. Our division is about to become an arm's race, and even harder to win it than it already is.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

For those fans of Josh Donaldson and advanced stats, this is a good read.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/josh-...etting-better/

Basically Donaldson is having a better season than he did last year and is putting up Mike Trout-like numbers, pretty damn impressive.

My favourite part:

Trout’s got the longer track record, so we can be more confident that he can keep this up, but for the last year, Donaldson has been nearly his equal. And when you’re nearly the equal of one of the best players of all-time, well, you’re doing pretty well.

And it’s not like Donaldson has turned into a bat-only player. As I noted a few weeks ago, he’s stolen 23 consecutive bases without being caught, and has turned himself into one of the better baserunners in baseball, supplementing his offensive value. And he remains a terrific defender at third base, so over the last year, he’s pushing up against +10 WAR.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

It's that or lose him for nothing in a few months.

Technically it'd be losing him for a compensation pick... baseball isn't hockey if a guy is good enough you never lose him for absolutely nothing.

It'll be the same for whomever we could get for him. We're not going to be able to trade Bautista for anything that we can then flip for something else of equal single season performance value as Bautista (plus extra years/team control). What we'd ultimately flip him for would either be a lesser value asset perhaps with team control (counter-productive to winning now) or an equal value asset without team control (pointless to winning now and counter-productive in the future since in-season trades can't get qualifying offers).

Either way it's a waste of managements time. You either trade Bautista and keep the futures (at least this year) or you keep Bautista and try to win it all. There's no "having your cake and eating it too" in this equation.

Frankly... I think our starting pitching has been pretty good. Estrada continues to pitch amazingly well, Toronto Happ 2.0 hasn't been Pittsburgh Happ but he's been better then Toronto Happ 1.0, Sanchez made his breakthrough, Dickey is still the reliable inning eater, and Stroman... well he hasn't been what we hoped but that guy is in there and flashes it. If we run into inning issues later we'll have Hutch and Floyd to shoulder some burdens until the post-season when we could put Sanchez back in. The offense after having a rocky start has come back.

So what do we need? Some better guys for the backend of the bullpen is it really. Those guys can be had for "C" prospects and Toronto still has plenty of "C" prospects.

[Cappy]

The Jays cupboard is pretty bare, but there are depth trades that can be made without giving up A prospects.

Bullpen depth and pitching depth usually doesn't require a lot so long as you stay away from Miller/Chapman type guys.

[mrkajz44]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

It's that or lose him for nothing in a few months. I originally wanted to keep Bautista for this run, but the offence keeps firing on all cylinders without him. His offense isn't really needed and he's declined at fielding significantly in the past few years, so I think the Jays have to use him in some sort of way to acquire the pitching they will need to win the AL East because as Resolute indicated, they have no prospects with any value left to trade.

Well I guess they have Guerrero, but he's pretty much untouchable I would assume (or at least hope that's the case).

Remember when everyone was saying we didn't need Tulo because Goins / Barney / Travis could patrol the middle of the diamond? Just because the offense is clicking now without Bautista does not mean he's not a key part of the Blue Jay run-producing machine. Quite honestly, the return we would get for Bautista is likely not great at the deadline - I think he's much more valuable to use down the stretch. As someone else mentioned too, we'd get a comp draft pick anyway, so how much more would we get at the deadline?

Long story short, trading Bautista at the deadline would majorly hurt the Jays chances at a post-season run.

[Jiggy_12]

Not only does it hurt the chances of making playoffs, but how can we so quickly forget just how clutch he was in the playoffs? We don't make the ALCS with anyone else, and we don't even get a sniff in game 6 of that ALCS with anyone else. His personality is built for the playoffs and big games.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Saunders gets things started!

Martin knocks in Saunders!

2-0!

[The Big Chill]

2-0!

[flames_fan_down_under]

Donaldson with another double ho hum.

[Karl]

I don't like what I'm seeing this bottom inning...

[Karl]

Agh. 2 on with no out and then they get nothing but 2 strikeouts and a ground out after that.

Unacceptable.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Well Hutchison is not going to be the answer. Score is favouring him. Missing his spots all over the place, constantly crossing Martin up, and fastballs with no movement. Same guy as last year. He's lucky they only have 3. Now we just need a little offence like we got last year everytime he pitched.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Karl

Agh. 2 on with no out and then they get nothing but 2 strikeouts and a ground out after that.

Unacceptable.

I like in the third inning where they walked two people to get to Smoak. That's how much respect anyone has for Smoak.

[Karl]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

I like in the third inning where they walked two people to get to Smoak. That's how much respect anyone has for Smoak.

Yeah. They walked Saunders & Tulo to get out Smoak.

[Karl]

Ah cripes! Barney splits the gap but the ball bounces over the wall. Pillar would've scored easily if the ball stayed in play.

[Jiggy_12]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Well Hutchison is not going to be the answer. Score is favouring him. Missing his spots all over the place, constantly crossing Martin up, and fastballs with no movement. Same guy as last year. He's lucky they only have 3. Now we just need a little offence like we got last year everytime he pitched.

Come on, Hutch has done just fine.

6IP, 6H, 3ER, 1BB, 7K (so far)

Ill take that line from any starting pitcher, any day.