2016 property tax increases

[CaptainYooh]

I always read Letters to the Editor section of Calgary Herald. One letter this morning was right on the money, I thought. Each and every time property tax goes up, councillors put on a gloomy face and tell us that less tax would mean less services. Like Pincott this time asking his constituents if they'd want less firefighters, policemen and parks maintenance. This is grossly misleading. The first thing for any organization to look at is cutting overhead costs (staffing levels, pay levels, benefit levels etc.), then cutting discretionary spending (public art spending, community event spending, intangible investment spending), then looking at short-term capital cost budget re-planning. Threatening to cut essential services should never be used as a scare tactic to justify property tax increases.

ENMAX - a municipal utility company wholly-owned by the City of Calgary, just paid a million-dollar bonus to its new CEO based on all the crap they usually use to justify these payouts. My firm set-in-contract salary was cut. My firm set-in-contract non-discretionary earned 2015 bonus was cut in half without too much discussion – the times are tough, the company needs to preserve its cash, do you have a problem with it? Yes, I do, but I understand...

[Lubicon]

Well said CaptainYooh. One item to add to this:
Ward Sutherland (Councillor for Ward 1) was on the radio yesterday and said that wage increases for unionized workers etc. (ie previosuly agreed to contracts) effectively put the tax increase at something like 3.5% right off the bat. To get the increase below 3.5% means cutting something from somewhere else. So yeah, I agree that fearmongering about cutting police etc. is irresponsible but they do have a point in that something does need to be cut from somewhere else if people want taxes lowered, or even the tax increase lowered. And our course most people do not want their current levels of service for anything to be cut, so where does that put the City?

[TheAlpineOracle]

Jesus. Mine sure went up. I think it's closer to 10% than 4.8%, but I honestly don't know as I don't pay that attention to it (part of mortgage). Seems to me it went from $2,700 to $3,000.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by chemgear

Escoba has it's own thread but of course many other businesses are facing big tax increases. Probably going a lot of the businesses pinning hopes on the Stampede aren't going to make it long after that. But 8% down isn't bad all things considered.

http://www.calgarysun.com/2016/06/07...dimed-to-death

“We’ve heard some people say they’re hanging on until the Calgary Stampede and hoping for a bump in business,” he said.

On Wednesday, Adele Stevens will be at city hall appealing her $45,000 property tax bill, which just two years ago was a much more manageable $22,000.
“We are getting nickel and dimed to death in every direction,” said Stevens, who said she’s also faced an 8% drop in business from last year.

Stevens, who noted two other businesses on her retail block in mixed-use residential neighbourhood — Fresh Kitchen catering’s storefront and Altadore Barber, which had been operating for 45 years — have recently had to close their doors, said she’s having to consider laying off staff at her 53-employee strong salon.

HOLY SH*T
If you don't know who Adele Stevens is, DO NOT GOOGLE HER NAME ON YOUR WORK PC.

Now I know...

[Jacks]

Mine went up 10%. They have my house assessed about 35% - 40% higher than the house that just sold a month ago 2 lots away.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Mine went up 10%. They have my house assessed about 35% - 40% higher than the house that just sold a month ago 2 lots away.

Tough! That money belongs to the Government so cough it up!

[llwhiteoutll]

Up about 15% on a house value that dropped about 1%, doubt I'll see any increase in services though.

Except they'll cut my garbage pickup in half, take up more of my space with a bin I won't use and force stupid code requirements that make no sense on my reno plans.

[Regorium]

Interesting that my entire property tax went towards the Victoria Park CRL.

I cannot imagine how many millions of dollars from Vic Park and East Village (including the bow building) is taken out of the pool for property tax calculations, and the services for the communities has to be paid by the rest of the city.

Where else has CRL?

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

I always read Letters to the Editor section of Calgary Herald. One letter this morning was right on the money, I thought. Each and every time property tax goes up, councillors put on a gloomy face and tell us that less tax would mean less services. Like Pincott this time asking his constituents if they'd want less firefighters, policemen and parks maintenance. This is grossly misleading. The first thing for any organization to look at is cutting overhead costs (staffing levels, pay levels, benefit levels etc.), then cutting discretionary spending (public art spending, community event spending, intangible investment spending), then looking at short-term capital cost budget re-planning. Threatening to cut essential services should never be used as a scare tactic to justify property tax increases.

To be fair, every single budget year, Council directs Administration to put on the squeeze and "find efficiencies" Exactly the thing you suggest are the things that are cut. Staff levels manage through attrition, less back of house support , certain discretionary services, and so on.

In between budget years several departments at a time go through Zero Based Reviews to find better ways of providing the service and save money. These have resulted in tens of millions in savings too.

But there is a breaking point somewhere. There's only so much stuff you can cut and find efficiency in before the service is substantially affected.

In 4 out of the last 5 years, the City's total operating expenses have gone up less than population growth and inflation. That means they are doing more with less. 2013 was the anomaly, and mostly attributed to extraordinary operating costs related to the flood. The years property tax was higher than operating expense increase were the years (11,12,13) the City took tax room for capital projects, not for op-ex.




So question, is spending really "out of control" as some have suggested? Are they living "in the bubble" not caring about efficiency? Or is this just mindless rhetoric?

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by Regorium

Interesting that my entire property tax went towards the Victoria Park CRL.

I cannot imagine how many millions of dollars from Vic Park and East Village (including the bow building) is taken out of the pool for property tax calculations, and the services for the communities has to be paid by the rest of the city.

Where else has CRL?

Nowhere, unless KK has his way.

I don't know what the take is from the CRL district currently, but imagine the windfall when the CRL expires. That'll be interesting to see what the City decides to do then.

[calgarywinning]

Originally Posted by Bunk

To be fair, every single budget year, Council directs Administration to put on the squeeze and "find efficiencies" Exactly the thing you suggest are the things that are cut. Staff levels manage through attrition, less back of house support , certain discretionary services, and so on.

In between budget years several departments at a time go through Zero Based Reviews to find better ways of providing the service and save money. These have resulted in tens of millions in savings too.

In 4 out of the last 5 years, the City's total operating expenses have gone up less than population growth and inflation. That means they are doing more with less.

But there is a breaking point somewhere. There's only so much stuff you can cut and find efficiency in before the service is substantially affected.

This chart is completely misleading. It should be in comparison to bottle cap percentages found on the Nashville North floor during stampede. Then it would have context.

Both municipally and provincially the liberals of politics (Nenshi) and NDP government have made spending an art form. Every time the citizen is on the hook. This time though, due to the economic recession maybe people will start to look harder.

We should add the City water and services tower to the chart as well. That building in an industrial park is prime example of how City bureaucracy runs a tax regime for their own benefit without regard.

Not only has the province given the city the shaft, they implement a carbon tax on the guise to punish the citizens for going to work in an oil and gas industry. This is just another tax grab to feed into the spending addictions the government has.

All the while the threat of reduced services are offered. Pay more, get less. Yes, this is a socialistic bureautcrats motto.

[Bunk]

Ok, beyond this kinda strange rant, what do you actually take issue with the chart?

It shows the year over year increase in the City's total operating expenses (all services), tax revenue increases and population + inflation for context. What is misleading?

Originally Posted by calgarywinning

This chart is completely misleading. It should be in comparison to bottle cap percentages found on the Nashville North floor during stampede. Then it would have context.

Both municipally and provincially the liberals of politics (Nenshi) and NDP government have made spending an art form. Every time the citizen is on the hook. This time though, due to the economic recession maybe people will start to look harder.

We should add the City water and services tower to the chart as well. That building in an industrial park is prime example of how City bureaucracy runs a tax regime for their own benefit without regard.

Not only has the province given the city the shaft, they implement a carbon tax on the guise to punish the citizens for going to work in an oil and gas industry. This is just another tax grab to feed into the spending addictions the government has.

All the while the threat of reduced services are offered. Pay more, get less. Yes, this is a socialistic bureautcrats motto.

[V]

Originally Posted by Bunk

So question, is spending really "out of control" as some have suggested? Are they living "in the bubble" not caring about efficiency? Or is this just mindless rhetoric?

I'm glad to hear that things have gotten much more efficient in the 6 years since I've been gone, because back when I lived there we loved our City contracts. It was the easiest way to make the most money doing the least amount of work. Though truth be told I never enjoy working with the same municipalities that I live in because I prefer to be unaware of the gross overspending that my tax dollars are going towards.

[calgarywinning]

Originally Posted by Bunk

Ok, beyond this kinda strange rant, what do you actually take issue with the chart?

It shows the year over year increase in the City's total operating expenses (all services), tax revenue increases and population + inflation for context. What is misleading?

How about the whole report and the rest of the charts. Since you like charts show us City taxes from 2000 until now for business and property taxation revenue only? Then show us the total percentage of increase in that time frame.

Escobar goes wildly flailing from 22k to 60k+. What we have is an aggressive, out of touch tax regime.

What you don't get and why you probably can't listen is your are part of the system. This doesn't surprise me, has anyone tried to to talk to the city property and business assessment group since Nenshi took over? Crickets. They work the MGA have more people on staff and are continually try to shove it down peoples throats.

They can do no wrong, see no wrong, hear no wrong. Pay more for less.

Instead of offering up a critical analysis of what the City has done and could possibly do, it's just brushed to the side. They will march forward or there will be no police.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by calgarywinning

How about the whole report and the rest of the charts. Since you like charts show us City taxes from 2000 until now for business and property taxation revenue only? Then show us the total percentage of increase in that time frame.

Escobar goes wildly flailing from 22k to 60k+. What we have is an aggressive, out of touch tax regime.

What you don't get and why you probably can't listen is your are part of the system. This doesn't surprise me, has anyone tried to to talk to the city property and business assessment group since Nenshi took over? Crickets. They work the MGA have more people on staff and are continually try to shove it down peoples throats.

They can do no wrong, see no wrong, hear no wrong. Pay more for less.

Instead of offering up a critical analysis of what the City has done and could possibly do, it's just brushed to the side. They will march forward or there will be no police.

He doesn't work for the city anymore. The funny thing is that I think the city and mayors office in particular, seems to be very approachable. That doesn't mean I agree with everything that they do, but you definitely have input and a chance to give your opinion.

About the only part of that graph that I don't like is that taxes have increased every single year. Its frustrating that no one seems to be able to hold the line at all.

[CaptainYooh]

Originally Posted by Bunk

To be fair, every single budget year, Council directs Administration to put on the squeeze and "find efficiencies" Exactly the thing you suggest are the things that are cut. Staff levels manage through attrition, less back of house support , certain discretionary services, and so on.

In between budget years several departments at a time go through Zero Based Reviews to find better ways of providing the service and save money. These have resulted in tens of millions in savings too.

But there is a breaking point somewhere. There's only so much stuff you can cut and find efficiency in before the service is substantially affected.

In 4 out of the last 5 years, the City's total operating expenses have gone up less than population growth and inflation. That means they are doing more with less. ...
So question, is spending really "out of control" as some have suggested? Are they living "in the bubble" not caring about efficiency? Or is this just mindless rhetoric?

Rhetoric? I don't look at what the Administration says to justify its bloated budget. I look at what I receive as a resident of Calgary from the municipality that charges me for their services.

For the past 25 years, my municipally-supplied utility services (electricity, water, sewerage, garbage collection) remained of the same quality. The streets I drive on receive the same or worse level of maintenance (e.g. snow used to be removed from my cul-de-sac fairly quickly, nowadays, it is not removed at all). The level and quality of policing, firefighting and EMS services remains of the same quality that it was for 25 years.

With the above in mind, my costs for buying these services should have remained relatively flat or, at best, growing at the rate not higher than the annual inflation of 3%. You cannot dispute that they have grown at a substantially higher rate than that (in fact, the only utility that costs less today than 25 years ago is telephone, and it's no longer supplied by the government). Growth of the city demands more volume of services, yes, but that should be a revenue neutral relationship - more taxpayers, more revenue, same or better costs due to economies of scale.

Instead, City has switched to market value assessment system, where a household that happens to be in a higher-priced community pays more taxes for the same level of services received. In addition, condominium owners are forced to pay taxes for the services they pay for already through their condo fees; which, you can't disagree is absolutely a double taxation. But hey, that's OK, who's gonna complain, only those rich people in Mount Royal, right?

So, it's not (should not be) the growth. What's next? Intangible investments in municipal betterment - public transit, arts, community programs, bike lanes, parks, sports, recreation, events, etc. These costs should be budgeted in accordance with targeted revenue - not the other way around (we set the wish list of programs and then see how high we should/can raise taxes to squeeze as many of them as possible).

Back to my original post: when was the last time the Administration cut wages to its staff due to the market condition? Ever? Because they have certainly raised them during booms! When was the last time Council cut their pay? City of Calgary has one of the most generous benefit packages and pension plans. When was the last time these packages have been re-evaluated and, perhaps, trimmed down? Ever?

So, no, no rhetoric, Josh. Taxes should not have been going up at the pace they have. No way.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

In addition, condominium owners are forced to pay taxes for the services they pay for already through their condo fees; which, you can't disagree is absolutely a double taxation.

What services are you referring to? Off the top of my head I can't think of any.

[polak]

Originally Posted by calgarywinning

Not only has the province given the city the shaft, they implement a carbon tax on the guise to punish the citizens for going to work in an oil and gas industry. This is just another tax grab to feed into the spending addictions the government has..

This is the most ridiculous ####ing statement I've heard in my ####ing life.

List of Provinces with Carbon tax in place:

- Quebec
- Ontario
- BC

Where it's imminent:

- Alberta
- Manitoba

And every other province will eventually have it. This isn't an attack on anyone. It's common ####ing sense and unavoidable. Alberta has the largest Diesel consumption out of all of the provinces even though we're 4th in population. We SHOULD be leading the way in Carbon Tax. By the way, the tax isn't attacking anyone. The fact that it's aimed at the consumer should tell you that it's not targeting any single industry. It also takes the work of tracking carbon tax out of the hands of producers and refiners which is a MASSIVE help for them. Ask someone working in downstream about tracking the Cap and Trade system in Quebec and how much fun that is for refiners and how much money they waste doing it.

Who are the people angry about Carbon tax? The people who don't understand it. Do you know there's already plenty of environmental regulations regarding fuel? Compliance units, Blending requirements, Interprovincial Transfer tracking, Sulphur content reporting.... all of this pointless red tape ends up costing you more at the pumps but no cried when they were brought in. Out of all of these, carbon tax makes the most sense yet no cares about the other legislation because it wasn't brought in by the NDP so it's not "cool" to rage over it.

As for timing, what do you expect the government to do? Just sit there and not change a thing? Not fulfill any of their campaign agenda?

God, there's few things in the world more annoying than a hurting O&G worker. Yes, everyone is out to get you cause they're just jealous. They should really go work for the bumper sticker industry. Sales of "NDP Out" and "Refugees go home" stickers must be through the roof.

[CaptainCrunch]

Then have an actual carbon tax program that makes sense, emulate what BC is doing for example.

Don't create a thinly veiled PST, put the money in general accounting and then piss it away.

And don't put in a punative carbon tax, lie about how its going to effect people especially the low and middle class, come up with a rebate that frankly won't even cover half of the cost increases across the board and claim that its revenue neutral or won't harm things.

If the NDP wanted a PST they got it, this has very little to do with the environment or changing peoples usage of anything and all about an across the board a$$kicking of everyone involved.

Do you know what one of the biggest ways to cut your share of the carbon tax is going to be? Stop eating food, or better yet, but food that comes in from out of province because its exempt.

Hammering people at the pump is not going to make people stop driving or buying gas, members here have pointed it out. What its going to do is make low to middle class people spend more money to work, or take their kids to school.

Its a stupid badly conceived general tax, and the arrogance of the NDP to sit there and call it a well crafted tax and not listen to anything that the opposition party had to offer in terms of amendments, especially when the Carbon grab is going to smash the foodbanks which to give credit to the NDP are rising the visibility of and the size of its client base and other charities is maddening and shows how outright stupid and arrogant this government is.

On top of it during the election, no new carbon tax, but its here now, this should be an outright referendum or election issue, especially if the NDP is so damn certain that this is what Albertans want.

Because I guarantee you this, in the next election, when the parties run, the four opposition parties are going to run on either doing an Australia and killing the carbon tax, or the one that probably gets my vote is the one that actually puts forward a system that's actually intelligent and does something to actually reduce carbon through direct re-investment of funds to Green Technology Research or better yet does a whole environmental strategy that includes water and air quality.

I mean frankly right at this point, I feel like I could take a hundred barrels of toxic waste to Banff National Park and dump it in a river and then throw my hands up and say, this isn't increasing our carbon footprint, in fact I'm reducing it because I'm not burning this stuff, and I'll probably get a medal and a key to the city.

The other aspect is to make a carbon tax that is outright revenue neutral where you reward individuals for reducing their footprint by giving their money back to them.

I'm an incredibly low carbon producer, I should be getting rewarded outright, not getting getting hit with more costs, that I'm never going to get back because I make over 51k a year.

As for your last paragraph, quit being an a$$

[polak]

Oh I won't disagree that they haven't picked the best system and I'm really disappointed that they didn't consider any amendments. I just attacked the comment saying it was punitive to Oil & Gas workers.

"Revenue Neutral" like BC is dumb in my opinion too. It should be going towards projects that are offsetting Carbon emissions. Wtf is the point otherwise. So that you can say you're green and have a carbon tax cause you move money from one bucket to another? The majority of the money people save in that system will just be spent in a manner that increases their overall carbon footprint. Buying more things, going to more places. It's pointless.