Justin Trudeau says marijuana should be legalized

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by heep223

There are a lot of pot smokers in this thread rationalizing their usage.

Source?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Really? I would bet I'm one of the mroe regular users here and I don't see anyone rationalizing usage (particularly heavy usage) outside od those with medicinal prescriptions.

This has nothing to do with claiming the usage is all good, that there are no negative effects, or even that there are concrete positive effects. This thread in pretty much it's entirety has been about the best way to manage the use by youths and cut out the black market so the country can actually benefit from the usage of a mostly destructive product.

What in my post rationalizes the use at all? It's just an anecdote noting how many people actually do use, regardless of legality.

If you woke up tomorrow, and penalties against marijuana were strictly enforced, supply was reduced by half, and it all of a sudden became heavily stigmatized to the point where close acquaintances would avoid you/or heavily advice you to stop using the drug, what would you do?

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by peter12

If you woke up tomorrow, and penalties against marijuana were strictly enforced, supply was reduced by half, and it all of a sudden became heavily stigmatized to the point where close acquaintances would avoid you/or heavily advice you to stop using the drug, what would you do?

If you woke up tomorrow and penalties were completely relaxed, supply was doubled, and all of your friends avoided you unless you did it, what would you do?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by rubecube

If you woke up tomorrow and penalties were completely relaxed, supply was doubled, and all of your friends avoided you unless you did it, what would you do?

Well, we are a lot closer to this scenario than the one I outlined above. I would continue to do as I do.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by peter12

If you woke up tomorrow, and penalties against marijuana were strictly enforced,

How so? Swat teams breaking own the doors of everyone using in their own homes? What would the penalties be? What's the monetary cost of that level of enforcement? Is it worth it vs the potential monetary benefits of legalization?

supply was reduced by half

How?

and it all of a sudden became heavily stigmatized to the point where close acquaintances would avoid you/or heavily advice you to stop using the drug, what would you do?

Again, how? How are you planning on reversing the psychology of millions of people?

This is what I'm talking about. The health concerns and whatnot are all perfectly valid. But the fact is you're not stopping this from happening without significant leaps in enforcement and mass psychology which are just not logical possibilities.

Say what you want about the "potheads" who want this to happen, the argument that "this should be illegal because look how bad it is!" is no better than the reverse of "this should be legal because of how awesome it is!". At least the legalize side has plans for how this can be implemented to try and make the market safer for users, while the country receives monetary benefits hopefully off setting any negative social impacts.

I still haven't seen any sort of specific plan for the reverse.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by peter12

Well, we are a lot closer to this scenario than the one I outlined above. I would continue to do as I do.

Which is kind of my point. Legalization wouldn't change my usage habits (which are basically around once or twice a year over the past 10 years) at all. I have friends who smoke pot and friends who don't. The ones that don't have no desire to smoke it, even if it were to be legalized, but we're getting into the anecdotal again. It looks like based on the previous link you provided that there might be a 10% increase in the amount of people who would try pot once if it were legalized, but no info on whether they would become regular users.

I'd be interested in running a CP poll though (hardly scientific I know), just to see what everyone else thinks.

[WesternCanadaKing]

Originally Posted by heep223

There are a lot of pot smokers in this thread rationalizing their usage.

I don't need to rationalize my use, I'm an adult and every once in a while I like to smoke pot.

Get over it.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by WesternCanadaKing

I don't need to rationalize my use, I'm an adult and every once in a while I like to smoke pot.

Get over it.

That's a rationalization.

[Street Pharmacist]

I don't use it now and won't then. Paranoia, munchies and sleepiness aren't enjoyable to me

[Coach]

Originally Posted by peter12

That's a rationalization.

You going to answer any of my questions?

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by peter12

That's a rationalization.

Hmmmm, nope. Rationalization implies defensiveness and that there is some kind of hidden and true meaning that you hide from others and potentially yourself.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by MattyC

You going to answer any of my questions?

Well, you kind of missed my point. I was really asking why you use it, and why it is so important to you.

[Coach]

Rationalization would be like me saying "I use it for my back pain", when the amount that I smoke is likely far in excess of any medical prescription would be. Even if I do have constant back pain (I do), saying that MJ somehow helps with that in large doses would be a raionalization for my use outside of "i just like it", which is exactly what WesternCanadaKing said.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Rationalization would be like me saying "I use it for my back pain", when the amount that I smoke is likely far in excess of any medical prescription would be. Even if I do have constant back pain (I do), saying that MJ somehow helps with that in large doses would be a raionalization for my use outside of "i just like it", which is exactly what WesternCanadaKing said.

By pretending it is a harmless, uncontroversial substance, he is rationalizing.

[Senator Clay Davis]

I ponder sometimes if peter12 spends his spare time teaching online trolling classes. I'm consistently impressed at his baiting skills.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by peter12

Well, you kind of missed my point. I was really asking why you use it, and why it is so important to you.

You're missing the point. It has nothing to do with my personal use at all. It's not really important to me. If marijuana became biologically extinct tomorrow, I wouldn't cry about it.

You keep bringing up these things like "enforcement" and "reducing supply" like they are actual possibilities. Maybe they are, but no one on your side of it has mentioned any concrete plans for how or why it would work.

The other side has given plenty of rational arguments for it's legalization that have very little to do with their own personal use (read: not everyone who wants this legalized is a smoker). Actually making decent points about how legalization could potentially help with your concerns (moreso than our current landscape does). I don't mind having a debate about it, but bring some points to the table about how your concerns would actually be addressed. Not just what your concerns are.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

I ponder sometimes if peter12 spends his spare time teaching online trolling classes. I'm consistently impressed at his baiting skills.

I'm impressed at the number of people who get quite defensive about what Peter posts. I guess the truth hurts.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by peter12

By pretending it is a harmless, uncontroversial substance, he is rationalizing.

You have made a large assumption here. I know you don't care, but you are difficult to take seriously.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by MattyC

You're missing the point. It has nothing to do with my personal use at all. It's not really important to me. If marijuana became biologically extinct tomorrow, I wouldn't cry about it.

You keep bringing up these things like "enforcement" and "reducing supply" like they are actual possibilities. Maybe they are, but no one on your side of it has mentioned any concrete plans for how or why it would work.

The other side has given plenty of rational arguments for it's legalization that have very little to do with their own personal use (read: not everyone who wants this legalized is a smoker). I don't mind having a debate about it, but bring some points to the table about how your concerns would actually be addressed. Not just what your concerns are.

It's frustrating to make the same point many times in a debate, but have your opponent gaslight it like it never happened.

I have consistently brought up increased fines and community service for small amount possession, first time and juvenile offenders paired with very heavy prison sentences for distributors - particularly to minors.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Major Major

You have made a large assumption here. I know you don't care, but you are difficult to take seriously.

Not that you would care to actually read the evidence that I posted.