[News] ARZ Promotes 26-year-old John Chayka to GM. Tipett Coach and Exec. VP of hockey ops.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I don't understand the sentiments of jealousy from posters who have no future in NHL hockey operations. How can you be jealous of someone for landing a job any one of us never could?

Originally Posted by MattyC

Because if your older than someone you're better at everything. because...experience?

I'm not saying that I should have the job.... far from it.

I can't sing either, but I can't help but be a little jealous of people who can make millions from singing.

Because it is a pretty cool thing and who wouldn't want to be in that position?

[Coach]

I'm more commenting on the posts that seem to think his age will somehow be related to his negotiation ability or who he will be able to contact. He has all the same contacts as the Arizona Coyotes have. And if anyone wants to do deals with Arizone, they'll have to talk to him.

"Oh sorry, you're too young to deal with. Is your dad there?"
"OK, then someone else gets my business, dickhead"

If any GM doesn't do business with AZ because of the age of their GM, the should be immediately fired.

[dino7c]

I think the reality is they cheeped out on a GM

time will tell but I wouldn't want him running the Flames

[dammage79]

OP is bumped for updates.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by MattyC

I'm more commenting on the posts that seem to think his age will somehow be related to his negotiation ability or who he will be able to contact. He has all the same contacts as the Arizona Coyotes have. And if anyone wants to do deals with Arizone, they'll have to talk to him.

"Oh sorry, you're too young to deal with. Is your dad there?"
"OK, then someone else gets my business, dickhead"

If any GM doesn't do business with AZ because of the age of their GM, the should be immediately fired.

People need to understand that while this is new for hockey, it isn't new for other major North American professional sports. Baseball and basketball teams have been hiring GMs around 28-30 years old for years now. Many of whom have been very successful - the most notable being Theo Epstein (hired at 28) who won a championship with the Red Sox two years after being hired. If it's worked in other sports, then why should hockey be any different?

It was just a matter of time before hockey started going this route. It's easy to make stupid jokes, but at the end of the day it's a management position and it's pretty ridiculous that in 2016 the majority of the jobs still go to ex-NHLers. What exactly about playing in the NHL prepares you for a management position?

[dammage79]

Really looks like they went for the Colorado management structure. Tippet is VP of Hockey Operations so anything the kid wants to do is likely going to have to go through Tippett and the the Prez of Hockey Ops.

Tippett got the Patrick Roy job.

[troutman]

We like our GMs over 40 and our rock idols under 30.

[polak]

Originally Posted by JayP

What exactly about playing in the NHL prepares you for a management position?

Being hit in the head a lot is pretty much a prerequisite for the Oilers management positions.

[VladtheImpaler]

Does he cosplay and/or LARP?

[troutman]

Does he chew tobacco and is his tie undone?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Because if your older than someone you're better at everything. because...experience?

Absolutely. Sometimes you even get a hand at a fair by a miner.

[The Swedish Flame]

Yikes. Well boy do I feel old now.

[Beatle17]

I wish people would quit mentioning Theo Epstein. The guy got two gravy jobs in baseball where his teams won because they spent more money than anyone else, he bought good players for already mostly established teams. I give him credit, along with the other team management, for winning the championships but let's be realistic.

Moneyball was a nice story but Billy Beane never won anything. Baseball/Football teams win because they buy the best players to play in structured offense/defense environments. Basketball and Hockey are the 2 toughest sports to win because the games are so fluid, offense to defence in seconds, so I will continue to look at hiring of "analytic experts" with a leery glance until they can show a stat that actually defines and shows what each player can do in future games, not what they have done in the past on different teams.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Locke

Absolutely. Sometimes you even get a hand at a fair by a miner.

Hey! Sometimes we have to type discreetly when we're supposed to be working.

[Vansmack]

.

[RougeUnderoos]

It will bomb. It's in the numbers. If you look deep into the stats, it never works out there.

[getbak]

Here's a story about the company Chayka started, Stathletes: http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/...043/story.html

As Stathletes was taking off, Laine became aware that many teams were using the Neilson model on scoring chances and tracking other things as well. “They’re not necessarily putting it in a data base and organizing it, but they’re all collecting or analyzing the game in their own way.

“(NHL) people that were sort of against the analytics movement when we were talking to them, they still looked at the game analytically. They looked at the game in a way that we could measure, they just never thought about it that way, so there was a big training or educational period with what we were doing. Why do you call that player gritty? What is he doing that is gritty? And they would tell us all their definition of why they think he’s gritty and we would say, ‘Well, we can measure that very black and white through this, this, this and this.’ ”

In recent years, many of the analytics people hired by NHL teams have come from the data mining school, doing work based on NHL data on shots-at-net plus-minus metrics such as Corsi and Fenwick numbers, which are popular metrics with many fans.

“I think they have their place,” Lane says of the Corsi and Fenwick metrics. “The fact of the matter is there’s only so much data available to the general public and people are trying to do the best they can with what they have. That’s why we built this business, to bring more data and do better.”

But, again, one problem with mining the NHL’s data is its unreliability, Lane says. “We looked at the data that was out there and we didn’t think it was reliable enough. We had a philosophy of ‘Garbage in, garbage out,’ no matter how good you are at manipulating it. So that was one of the big reasons for us collecting our own data. We also looked at the mathematical analysis and whether it was the regression outputs to prove stuff. From our mathematical background we just didn’t feel they were strong enough, and we felt that in a market where players are getting paid the salaries they are, to make decisions off those types of numbers is not something I would be comfortable doing, and that’s why we felt the needed to be more and why we built this.”

They started with two NHL clients: The Canucks and an unnamed Eastern Conference team. The Eastern team has an exclusive contract for the entire Eastern Conference, but multiple Western teams are now using their service.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Flames are one of them. This sounds a lot like what the Flames have been having Chris Snow do for a number of years.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

If I was a fan of the Coyotes, his age would not be a concern to me either. Whether this is a good hire or not, clearly he's accomplished even to be getting this opportunity, and can likely handle himself just fine. That's not to say that he doesn't have anything to learn about being a good GM, or that he might not be wise to surround himself with some experience (like he has in Tippet), but I really wouldn't sweat the age.

What is most interesting to me is as the guys were saying on the FAN this morning, it's the first time we've seen the Analytics guy be the "main guy" (or the Jonah Hill as they put it) on the management team. That's where I most interested to see if this works out for the Coyotes or not.

I am just waiting for the day when a GM in Hockey trades an established player that is producing(Pena in the movie) for a guy with good advanced stats.

That will be the day when #### hits the fan.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

I think a 27 year old will have a tough time navigating the shark filled waters that is being a NHL GM, unless he is really, really good at dealing with people.

I read a couple articles that said he is very good with people. One of those guys who makes an impression on people, and backs it up with results.