I'd be willing to overpay for Laine. I would offer this years 1st, next years 1st, and this year's Dallas pick if it turned into a 1st. So yes, three 1sts. Overkill just to move up a few picks? Perhaps...but I think he's one of those guys that checks off so many needs that you need to step up and get him. I also don't see this team being Top 5 for quite a while after this year, so the chances to draft up these types of dynamic talents will be considerably harder after this year.
Having said that, these types of trades are pretty rare, as teams never went to give up this type of quality. But considering where they are in their rebuild, a team like Toronto may value the quantity of picks over the quality (Not unlike us in 2013).
If we had the #2 would you give it up for the #6, #28 and that team's 1st next year? I'm not sure we would. It would intrigue me but so does Laine.
Trading up into the top tier is rare because the teams in the top team won't move the pick unless you really overpay. Probably takes 3 good assets in addition to our 1st this year to get it done.
It really depends who ends up with the #2 pick. If it's Edmonton, there is no trade. Torontos I think with how many holes they have, they could really use quantity like trade. Our 1st, Dallas Pick, Kylington, etc... Vancouver could also be in a Toronto like spot, they really need some quality young guys.
All in all, it's going to depend who has the #2 pick. I definitely think it could be possible for us to move up tho, it won't be cheap. But if we can put Laine across from Johnny that could be the most dangerous line in the NHL in a couple years!
If we had the #2 would you give it up for the #6, #28 and that team's 1st next year? I'm not sure we would. It would intrigue me but so does Laine.
Trading up into the top tier is rare because the teams in the top team won't move the pick unless you really overpay. Probably takes 3 good assists in addition to our 1st this year to get it done.
If I'm Calgary and am at a stage where I need quality guys to fill a few specific holes, no. If I'm Toronto (and Vancouver perhaps) and looking to rebuild the entire team and need quantity...perhaps I do consider it.
But you're right, even with three 1sts, the offer might not be enough for a guy like Laine. This is exactly why I don't view tanking in a negatively light as some the board. Players like this are virtually impossible to trade for....drafting in the top 1/2 is almost always the only way.
The first seven picks all look really solid. The only way that I consider trading up is if the other team accepts something stupid, or you are in the eight spot.
__________________
"By Grabthar's hammer ... what a savings."
Chatting at work regarding the Flames 5th position and whether or not it would make sense to use assests to move up in this years draft for one of the big 3 if we are not graced with a lottery ball.
Would you guys trade the 5th-8th pick (pending lottery loss) for 1 of Laine or Puljujarvi?
I would assume it would take one or multiple of the following:
1st RD - 2017
2nd RD - 2016/2017
Young prospect with high potential (Kylington, Shinkaruk, Poirier)
Moving up as always will be discussed in the coming months but the likelihood of any teams trading out of their top 5 picks is extremely slim outside of possibly the Oilers if they can get a top defender in return. The draft is simply too important in the salary cap era for teams to trade out of getting the best young prospects available.
Fair enough. Just on that sequence all five guys got caught watching the puck behind the net while Laine cruises into a one-timer.
There's usually a defensive mistake involved in a goal in any league. It's a last second scramble and good positioning by Laine to hang back. Not representative of the game. If you only watched NHL goal highlights, it wouldn't give a fair idea about NHL defense.
Of course the only place you'll see NHL level defense is in the NHL.
Moving up as always will be discussed in the coming months but the likelihood of any teams trading out of their top 5 picks is extremely slim outside of possibly the Oilers if they can get a top defender in return. The draft is simply too important in the salary cap era for teams to trade out of getting the best young prospects available.
I'd be willing to overpay for Laine. I would offer this years 1st, next years 1st, and this year's Dallas pick if it turned into a 1st. So yes, three 1sts. Overkill just to move up a few picks? Perhaps...but I think he's one of those guys that checks off so many needs that you need to step up and get him. I also don't see this team being Top 5 for quite a while after this year, so the chances to draft up these types of dynamic talents will be considerably harder after this year.
Having said that, these types of trades are pretty rare, as teams never went to give up this type of quality. But considering where they are in their rebuild, a team like Toronto may value the quantity of picks over the quality (Not unlike us in 2013).
Your example doesn't prove your point. In 2013 we tried to move 3 1st rounders for 1st overall -- the exact opposite of what you suggest.
Laine appears to fit the biggest need for Calgary as a huge scoring RW. Can't deny Matthews skill though. Honestly just get a top 3 pick and I am stoked. Puljujarvi would be a great pick as well
I got curious if there were any prospects drafted top 5 that had as low goal totals as Mike McLeod had this year. Looked back 10 years and these are the lowest goal scoring prospects drafted in the top 5 out of the CHL (Galchenyuk was exempted as he missed most of his draft year)
Everyone else drafted top 5 out of the CHL in the last 10 years had at least 32 goals.
Mike McLeod 57GP 21G 40A 61P
Arguably Staal went too high as Toews (#3 that year) is considered to be a much better player. Backstrom (#4 that year) is near point per game in his career and I think a lot of people would take him over Staal as well. Kessel went #5 and Brassard #6, not sure if people prefer Staal over them.
Arguably Pouliot went too high as Carey Price (#5) went right after and Anze Kopitar went down at #11. Not the greatest draft year.
That leaves Johansen who was a solid pick at #4 despite his low goal totals. Obviously the scouts saw #1 centre potential in him.
Anyways I had to look that stuff up because McLeod's 21 goals would be the lowest goal total of any player selected in the last 10 years if he went top 5. I had to research that after the McKeens piece.
The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Flames Draft Watcher For This Useful Post:
Well, using your 32 goal mark as the minimum requirement for going top five that clearly defines the players. The top five eligible players are De Brincat (51), Dubois (42), Gauthier (41), Abramov (38), and Mascherin (35). Out of their positions are Tkachuk (30) and Nylander (28). Can't score 32 goals you have no business being in the top 5 picks!
Thankfully there is a lot more that goes into judging top end talent than just an arbitrary measure of points scored. There are other things that make you a great prospect. Hall scored a bunch in junior, and he's a horrible hockey player. Yakupov scored a ton too, and he's got a first class ticket to Bustville. I hope our scouts don't get locked in on a statistic and use it as a mark for players to hit. I hope they review all these guys and base their selection on their talent and whether they think they will be good players in the NHL. There are some good players out there that didn't hit 32 goals.
