Predict the 2016/2017 Flames Starting Lineup

[Bourque's Twin]

Here's the ultimate dream:
Gaudreau - Monahan - Lucic
Matthews - Bennett - Vesey
Colborne - Backlund - Frolik
Ferland - Jankowski - Bouma

Giordano - Brodie
Hamilton - Jokipakka
Engelland - Wideman

Reimer
Ortio

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Interesting stuff from everyone, but I think cap realities are going to play a bigger role.

The flames have 22m (roughly?) to spend. Gaudreau Monahan and Colborne will be at least 15. Plus 2 goalies. Plus $2-4m in bonuses for ELCs depending on who they pick in the draft.

I don't think there is any way the flames are adding salary and keeping all of wideman, engelland, smid, Raymond etc.

[SeanCharles]

Fingers crossed:

Gaudreau-Monahan-Laine
Ferland-Bennett-Colborne
Stajan-Backlund-Frolik
Bouma-Grant-Jooris
Bollig

Brodie-Hamilton
Gio-Wideman
Jokipakka-Engelland
Smid-Nakladal

Andersen
Ortio

[PugnaciousIntern]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

Here's the ultimate dream:
Gaudreau - Monahan - Lucic
Matthews - Bennett - Vesey
Colborne - Backlund - Frolik
Ferland - Jankowski - Bouma

Giordano - Brodie
Hamilton - Jokipakka
Engelland - Wideman

Reimer
Ortio

Reimer as the starter is an upgrade, though not 'ultimate dream' material

[Dogbert]

Sure, why not (cap hits in brackets):

Gaudreau ($8M) - Monahan ($4M) - Shinkaruk ($0.75M)
Colborne ($2.5M) - Bennett ($3.2M) - Frolik ($4.3M)
Ferland ($0.825M) - Backlund ($3.575M) - Raymond ($3.15M)
Bouma ($2.2M) - Stajan ($3.125M) - Hathaway ($0.69M)
Extras: Bollig ($1.3M), Jooris ($0.75M)

Giordano ($6.75M) - Brodie ($4.65M)
Hamilton ($5.75M) - Wideman ($5.25M)
Engelland ($2.917M) - Jokipakka ($0.9M)
Extra: Smid ($3.5M)

Ramo ($4M)
Ortio ($1.5M)

Total cap hit: $73,582,000
Max cap hit: $74,500,000 (estimate)

Gonna be a quiet off-season. Too many bad contracts leeching cap space that nobody's gonna take on, and once the required extensions are made, there really isn't any more room to maneuver. The 2017 off-season will be the one where we'll make the required additions.

[PugnaciousIntern]

Predicting next year's lineup is exciting, but in 2 years is much, much more exciting. Expiring cap-hits include:

Bollig (1.25M)
Wideman (5.25M)
Smid (3.5M)
Engelland (2.9M)
Raymond (2.2M)

Total = 15.1M

The only player who was regularly in the lineup this year was Engelland, who honestly did play respectably, but I would argue did not act as much of a big-body deterrent and can be replaced for cheap.

The team played without the rest of these players often this year, and didn't notice much difference. Pending significant trades including dead-weight contracts (which don't happen all that often) next year's lineup changes will be even more exciting than this off-season.

[Hugh Jahrmes]

Originally Posted by Dogbert

Sure, why not (cap hits in brackets):

Gaudreau ($8M) - Monahan ($4M) - Shinkaruk ($0.75M)
Colborne ($2.5M) - Bennett ($3.2M) - Frolik ($4.3M)
Ferland ($0.825M) - Backlund ($3.575M) - Raymond ($3.15M)
Bouma ($2.2M) - Stajan ($3.125M) - Hathaway ($0.69M)
Extras: Bollig ($1.3M), Jooris ($0.75M)

Giordano ($6.75M) - Brodie ($4.65M)
Hamilton ($5.75M) - Wideman ($5.25M)
Engelland ($2.917M) - Jokipakka ($0.9M)
Extra: Smid ($3.5M)

Ramo ($4M)
Ortio ($1.5M)

Total cap hit: $73,582,000
Max cap hit: $74,500,000 (estimate)

Gonna be a quiet off-season. Too many bad contracts leeching cap space that nobody's gonna take on, and once the required extensions are made, there really isn't any more room to maneuver. The 2017 off-season will be the one where we'll make the required additions.

Wut

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Dogbert

Sure, why not (cap hits in brackets):

Gaudreau ($8M) - Monahan ($4M) - Shinkaruk ($0.75M)
Colborne ($2.5M) - Bennett ($3.2M) - Frolik ($4.3M)
Ferland ($0.825M) - Backlund ($3.575M) - Raymond ($3.15M)
Bouma ($2.2M) - Stajan ($3.125M) - Hathaway ($0.69M)
Extras: Bollig ($1.3M), Jooris ($0.75M)

Giordano ($6.75M) - Brodie ($4.65M)
Hamilton ($5.75M) - Wideman ($5.25M)
Engelland ($2.917M) - Jokipakka ($0.9M)
Extra: Smid ($3.5M)

Ramo ($4M)
Ortio ($1.5M)

Total cap hit: $73,582,000
Max cap hit: $74,500,000 (estimate)

Gonna be a quiet off-season. Too many bad contracts leeching cap space that nobody's gonna take on, and once the required extensions are made, there really isn't any more room to maneuver. The 2017 off-season will be the one where we'll make the required additions.

Uh, this is worse than mine.

Ramo?
Monahan at 4 million?
Raymond?

Do you want us to finish last?

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Bend it like Bourgeois

Interesting stuff from everyone, but I think cap realities are going to play a bigger role.

The flames have 22m (roughly?) to spend. Gaudreau Monahan and Colborne will be at least 15. Plus 2 goalies. Plus $2-4m in bonuses for ELCs depending on who they pick in the draft.

I don't think there is any way the flames are adding salary and keeping all of wideman, engelland, smid, Raymond etc.

I don't think the Flames have a lot of cap problems, to be honest.



That's without Smid (LTIR?), but also without trading or buying anybody out. So with the cap being anywhere between 71 and 74m (IIRC), that gives Treliving some wiggle room. The figures in blue are obviously my estimates, no idea if they're all realistic and/or if they bring back everybody I listed. But in my scenario, that leaves Treliving with 7-9m for a goaltender and one or two wingers (one of them could be a cheap young player from the farm like Shinkaruk) ... that's doable. Buying out one or two of the guys with 1 year left could give them some cap relief as well.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland
Colborne - Bennett - Nichushkin
Jooris - Backlund - Frolik
Hathaway - Stajan- Bouma
Bolig

Giordano - Brodie
Hamilton - Polak
Jokipakka - Nakladal
Engelland

Reimer
Raanta

Wideman (50% retained) traded along with the Dallas 1st rounder, or two second rounders, for Nichushkin at the draft.
Polak signed for 3x$2.5M
Reimer signed for 3x$4M
Raanta signed 2x$1M

Flames draft Nylander with their 1st rounder but return him to the Steelheads.

[Dogbert]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Uh, this is worse than mine.

Ramo?
Monahan at 4 million?
Raymond?

Do you want us to finish last?

- We're going to get bent over in any goalie trade, as teams realize how big a need it is for us; on the free-agent market, Reimer will get a big fat contract from someone that could easily turn into a boat anchor, and there really isn't anyone better out there. Ramo seemed to figure it out after that bad start, and was playing fine up until he got hurt. Why not give him another shot, punt the goalie issue another year, and bring in a more long-term solution when we have the cap space to do it comfortably? Who knows - maybe Gillies will be ready for 2017-18, and it'll resolve itself.

- What are you expecting Monahan's contract to look like? Ryan Johansen got a three-year, $12 million bridge contract after a single 60-point year, and Monahan's put up two in a row.

- Nobody is trading for Raymond, Bollig, Wideman, Smid, or Engelland, unless we take back a contract that's just as bad. Might as well play the lot of them, see if they can show something, trade them at the deadline if they do, or let them walk next summer if they don't.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Dogbert

- We're going to get bent over in any goalie trade, as teams realize how big a need it is for us; on the free-agent market, Reimer will get a big fat contract from someone that could easily turn into a boat anchor, and there really isn't anyone better out there. Ramo seemed to figure it out after that bad start, and was playing fine up until he got hurt. Why not give him another shot, punt the goalie issue another year, and bring in a more long-term solution when we have the cap space to do it comfortably?

- What are you expecting Monahan's contract to look like? Ryan Johansen got a three-year, $12 million bridge contract after a single 60-point year, and Monahan's put up two in a row.

- Nobody is trading for Raymond, Bollig, Wideman, Smid, or Engelland, unless we take back a contract that's just as bad. Might as well play the lot of them, see if they can show something, trade them at the deadline if they do, or let them walk next summer if they don't.

I expect Monahan's contract to be 8 years, 56 million.

[ricardodw]

Are the Flames so bad that players from Finland, who are not the top players on their Finnish teams ready to come over and play on the Flames top line as an 18 year old.

Barkov was bigger and came over and had a great rookie season as a 18 year old - 8 goals 24 pts in 54 games. He was the 2nd leading scorer on his Euro team 53 pts in 56 games. (1st in ppg).

Puljujarvi is 6th in his team's scoring 28 pts in 50 games .... Is 2nd round pick from 2014 Aho, going to be rookie of year with Carolina? He had 45 pts in 45 games on Puljujarvi's team.

Laine is 5th in his teams scoring 33 pts in 46 games Leading scoring on his team has 59 pts in 56 games.

Is the NHL a step down from SM-Liiga?


Both of these guys are going to be at least a year , maybe 2 away from having an impact at the NHL level.

[Dogbert]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I expect Monahan's contract to be 8 years, 56 million.

Fair enough. I based mine on the reports that Gaudreau would get the long-term extension, while Monahan would get a bridge deal.

[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by Dogbert

Sure, why not (cap hits in brackets):

Gaudreau ($8M) - Monahan ($4M) - Shinkaruk ($0.75M)
Colborne ($2.5M) - Bennett ($3.2M) - Frolik ($4.3M)
Ferland ($0.825M) - Backlund ($3.575M) - Raymond ($3.15M)
Bouma ($2.2M) - Stajan ($3.125M) - Hathaway ($0.69M)
Extras: Bollig ($1.3M), Jooris ($0.75M)

Giordano ($6.75M) - Brodie ($4.65M)
Hamilton ($5.75M) - Wideman ($5.25M)
Engelland ($2.917M) - Jokipakka ($0.9M)
Extra: Smid ($3.5M)

Ramo ($4M)
Ortio ($1.5M)

Total cap hit: $73,582,000
Max cap hit: $74,500,000 (estimate)

Gonna be a quiet off-season. Too many bad contracts leeching cap space that nobody's gonna take on, and once the required extensions are made, there really isn't any more room to maneuver. The 2017 off-season will be the one where we'll make the required additions.

Breaking down the cap is smart, but you paid Ramo too much and Monahan too little. Ramo should be no more than 2 million and Monahan no less than 6 million.

But it goes to show how little we can expect for changes next season. People are out to lunch with Lucic, Reimer, Perron, etc unless there's buyouts or stupid trades like adding our Stars pick to dump Stajan.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by devo22

I don't think the Flames have a lot of cap problems, to be honest.



That's without Smid (LTIR?), but also without trading or buying anybody out. So with the cap being anywhere between 71 and 74m (IIRC), that gives Treliving some wiggle room. The figures in blue are obviously my estimates, no idea if they're all realistic and/or if they bring back everybody I listed. But in my scenario, that leaves Treliving with 7-9m for a goaltender and one or two wingers (one of them could be a cheap young player from the farm like Shinkaruk) ... that's doable. Buying out one or two of the guys with 1 year left could give them some cap relief as well.

All fair. Though don't forget Bennett could easily be a $3m player next year, and another high pick (fingers crossed) would have similar clauses.

I am not saying they are doomed, only that I don't think they can add a FA in there anywhere unless some other salary goes away. Personally I think Wideman is a goner. We'll see.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Gaudreau - Monahan - Okposo
Shinkaruk - Bennett - McGinn/Frolik
Ferland - Backlund - Frolik/McGinn
Bouma - Stajan - Hathaway
Jooris, Grant

Giordano - Brodie
Jokipakka - Hamilton
Wotherspoon - Nakladal
Engelland

Elliott
Ortio

Team Salary: $69.65m (approximately, not sure about bonuses to Monahan, Gaudreau and Bennett)

Gaudreau signs 6 year $7.5m contract
Monahan signs 8 year $6.0m contract
Ortio signs 2 year $0.9m contract
Jooris not qualified, signs 1 year $0.7m contract
Grant signs 1 year $0.65m contract
Wotherspoon accepts qualifying offer

Okposo signs 7 year $6.5m contract
McGinn signs 3 year $3.5m contract
Nakladal signs 2 year $2.0m contract

Colborne-traded to St. Louis for Elliott
Wideman-traded to Vancouver for a 3rd round pick, no retention
Bollig-traded to Nashville for a 6th round pick
Raymond-bought out
Smid-bought out/LTIR

[PugnaciousIntern]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Are the Flames so bad that players from Finland, who are not the top players on their Finnish teams ready to come over and play on the Flames top line as an 18 year old.

Barkov was bigger and came over and had a great rookie season as a 18 year old - 8 goals 24 pts in 54 games. He was the 2nd leading scorer on his Euro team 53 pts in 56 games. (1st in ppg).

Puljujarvi is 6th in his team's scoring 28 pts in 50 games .... Is 2nd round pick from 2014 Aho, going to be rookie of year with Carolina? He had 45 pts in 45 games on Puljujarvi's team.

Laine is 5th in his teams scoring 33 pts in 46 games Leading scoring on his team has 59 pts in 56 games.

Is the NHL a step down from SM-Liiga?


Both of these guys are going to be at least a year , maybe 2 away from having an impact at the NHL level.

Don't agree with every word in this post, but I agree with the sentiment that we can't be pencilling in anybody from this draft into our lineup quite yet. Seeing Monahan come onto the team immediately was not the norm.

As always, in a rebuild, there might be a rookie who could beat a roster player out for a spot on the team if placed head-to-head, yet would benefit from a year rounding his game in an easier league before making the jump.

[GreenLantern2814]

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lucic
Frolik-Backlund-Colborne
Bennett-Jankowski-Ferland
Bouma-Grant-Jooris
Hathaway

Giordano-Brodie
Hamilton-Nakladal
Kevin-Engelland
Wotherspoon

Reimer
Ortio

If not for historically awful goaltending, this is a playoff team. The goalies let in 4+ goals SIXTEEN TIMES before the new year. You cannot expect your offense to overcome that following a year when the Art Ross winner had 89 points.

Gaudreau, Monahan, Brodie, Gio, Hamilton, Backlund and Colborne all had career years. Bennett had more points than Monahan did as a rookie. The back end stabilizes when the bottom pair combines to make less than Engelland.

In 32 games, James Reimer put up a 2.49 GAA and .918 save % with the Leafs. In 32 games, James Reimer put up a 2.49 GAA and a .918 save % with the LEAFS. He's going to cost nothing to acquire but money, and I would guess Treliving can get him on either a Cam Talbot 3/$12M or a Hiller 2/$9M deal. Bring back Ortio on a 1 or 2 year <$1M, and we've just saved nearly $3.5M on goalies.

Jankowski makes the team as the #3C because I think he's a bit more developed as a 200 foot player than Bennett. He also has better size for the position. Jankowski has never had a linemate like Bennett, and Bennett gets to focus a little more on offense. All of a sudden our wing depth isn't as big a concern.

Stajan needs to go. He makes too much if we want to sign Lucic, though if we dont manage to swing that, I'd actually be okay with Stajan riding shotgun on the top line for a year as a stopgap.

Not overreacting is going to be key this off season. That and trading Wideman.

[Savvy27]

This was harder than I realized. That cap space disappears in a hurry.

Gaudreau ($7.5/8 years) - Monahan ($7.0/8 years) - Lucic ($7.8/7 years)
Colborne ($2.4/3 years) - Backlund ($3.575/2 yrs) - Frolik ($4.3/4 years)
Shinkaruk ($0.863/2yrs) - Bennett ($0.925/1 year) - Ferland ($0.825/1 yr)
Bouma ($2.2/2 years) - F. Hamilton ($0.75/1 yr) - Hathaway ($0.69/1 yr)
Bollig ($1.25/1 year)

Brodie ($4.65/3 years) - D. Hamilton ($5.75/4 years)
Giordano ($6.75/5 yrs) - Engelland ($3.5/1 year)
Jokipakka ($0.9/1 yr) - Nakladal ($0.9/2 years)
Wotherspoon ($0.8/2 yrs) - Smid ($3.5/1 year)

Reimer ($4.5/4 years)
Ortio ($1.2/2 years)

Trade: Wideman to Toronto for 2016 4th

Buyout: Stajan and Raymond (Cap hit of $2,008,333 for 2016-17)

Sign: Lucic... this is such an unlikely signing but would add exactly what Calgary needs. I figure that they would have to pay more than other teams and offer the security of max term, so I landed on $7.8 million for 7 years. It's an overpayment on pure production, but compared to a guy like Okposo the extra money would be worth it.

LTIR: Smid would be on this eventually but it doesn't do much good until the season starts so I'm counting his full salary.

Bonuses: $2,515,000 according to capfriendly.com

Draft: Dubois and send him back to juniors

Assuming a $74,000,000 salary cap:
Flames Cap: $73,753,733
Cap Space: $246,267 ($3,746,267 once Smid goes on LTIR)

2017-18 Salary Cap Hit: $61,747,066